Stefan Wood Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 This question came to mind as I was browsing for a new turntable. I noticed a lot of them are belt drives. I have a Marantz direct drive turntable, which is fine. I'm just wondering what the difference is, and if direct drives are better, why are the high end models belt driven and not otherwise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 My general consensus from audiophiles is that most of the diehards prefer belt drives. . . They feel these are on better tables and that may be true: at the higher price points it seems that belt drives are employed in the last decade or two. I've had both, and each table I have had had pluses and minuses and I'll be damned if I could point to the belt or direct drive as responsible ultimately for either advantages or disadvantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 In the 80's direct drive turntables were considered "high tech", that's why many makers switched to this technology, including traditional companies like Dual or Thorens which exclusively used belt drive before. The current entry level turntables (Rega, Pro-Ject) as well as most high end models use belt drive again. Direct drive is indispensable for DJs, because the motor can accelerate the platter to the right speed a lot quicker than with belt drive. "Scratching" is only possible with direct-driven turntables. This is of course irrelevant for the normal home listener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted June 18, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 Thanks guys. Then I guess the next question would be: what's the difference in sound between the two? Less rumble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 Thanks guys. Then I guess the next question would be: what's the difference in sound between the two? Less rumble? This is precisely the argument for belt-driven tables, as there is nothing in the way of "contact" between the motor and the stylus save for a stretch of rubber. I can see it either way. I had a belt-driven Thorens for a couple of years but now have two Technics 1200mkII's with Shure cartridges. Did I notice a major difference? No. In my opinion, if you think you're going to notice a pronounced difference between belt and direct-drive then play it safe and go belt. I've worn both pairs of shoes and love my Technics just the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 I asked someone's who's opinion on analog matters I value, and here was his response: " do prefer belt drive and think they're better, because of the precision robust beearings involved most of the time. You don’t usually put a bearing in a diret Drive like that. Same with the related platters being 13lbs and up in weight plus the huge thickness of materials used. The motor is much more isolated offsetting the platter and ran by a belt, tape or string. Micro Seiki made both, the highest end ones in their line were belt drive. The only really exclusive high end Direct Drive Company was Goldmund. AFAIK One last thing, you don’t have to worry about mounting the motor in a Belt Drive table. It seems like better engineering." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave James Posted June 18, 2004 Report Share Posted June 18, 2004 Seems to me the relative simplicity of a belt drive table gives it a reliability advantage, i.e. a lot fewer things to go wrong. I recall someone telling me once a long time ago that belt drives only have about three moving parts. Up over and out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted June 20, 2004 Report Share Posted June 20, 2004 Seems to me the relative simplicity of a belt drive table gives it a reliability advantage, i.e. a lot fewer things to go wrong. I recall someone telling me once a long time ago that belt drives only have about three moving parts. Up over and out. I'm going to respectfully disagree with this statement. The reason why Technics 1200s were adopted by hip hop DJs as the 'no-brainer' set-up back in the 80's is, other than the aforementioned direct-drive capacities, because they're built like freakin' TANKS. I mean, let's face it...they aren't cheap. Mine were $400 a piece. Don't for a second overlook the fact that DJs have to haul thier equipment around like any other "musican". So the fact that you can safely take a 1200 all over creation (including regular trips as "luggage" on airplanes), in my mind, says volumes about their durability. In my estimation, the sole benefit to a belt drive is, again, the distance you get from the motor to the stylus. The ability to notice these differences is, of course, assuming that you have as little *white noise* in the room as possible (including, but not limited to, air conditioning, ceiling fans, the refrigerator, other folks in the room, etc). In other words, you need near-complete silence to notice the differences. And, frankly, I prefer an existence involving people enjoying themselves, drinking wine, etc. My opinion is that the rumble you might get from a direct-drive table is so minimal that you'd have to be alone--and I mean with the air conditioning off and, perhaps even, with expensive headphones on--to notice the difference. And if that's your M.O. then I think you need (another) hobby... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockman Posted June 21, 2004 Report Share Posted June 21, 2004 The main advantage of belt drive as I understand it is that the belt acts as a "filter" for noise and rumble from the motor. The platter is isolated from the motor noise. Belt or direct, the quality of engineering is paramount -- the devil is in the details of execution. However, a lot of the high end turntables, e.g. Basis, Linn, Clearaudio, etc. utilize belt drive, which maybe tells you which is considered superior in the audiophile world. Or perhaps it is easier to successfully engineer a good belt drive turntable than a direct drive one. Hock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted July 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Okay, after some searching, I made the plunge and bought a Goldring turntable, the new one that the audiophile mags have been raving about. I'll let you know how it sounds -- I ordered via internet -- as well as to try to justify my spending almost $400....... Music is hazardous to one's wallet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolff Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 (edited) Nice! Vinyl lives!! What cartridge did it come with? $400 is not bad. I'm sure there are a few of us around that have spent that much. Enjoy!! Edited July 8, 2004 by wolff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmitry Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Belt drive is way better. Did you know that Target sells 3 models of the Project tt? Welcome back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunky Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 I made the plunge and bought a Goldring turntable, the new one that the audiophile mags have been raving about. Is that the one based on the Rega P2? I took the plunge in Jan this year due entirely to this forum and got a Rega P3 , i've not looked back, I love the sound of vinyl, the feel. I'll be upgrading the tone arm/ rca cabling later this year but for now it's sublime. Sadly it makes my CD player seem uninviting.... bit of snag given the number of CDs I have... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted July 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 The Goldring is based on the Rega 2, and comes with the Goldring Elektra cartridge. It is supposed to have an excellent tonearm, construction, etc. After listening to all this classical music, I thought it was best to make a change. I have no problems with cds, and I have waaay too much! You know, cds like Andrew Hill's Passing Ships just isn't going to make an appearance on lp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted July 14, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2004 I got the Goldring Turntable today and am listening to it right now. What a difference! The sound is much richer and dynamic. I was a little concerned when I picked it up -- not too heavy, but looking at it, they concentrated on all the parts that matter -- the motor, the arm, and included their own Elektra cartridge as well. It took about 5 minutes to put it together, calibrate the arm, and plug it in. There is no ground wire, something new to me, which probably tells you I've been using some old turntables. Plexi cover, platter and felt mat (which I replaced with an antistatic one), and three feet (another new one to me). It is one solid machine. My only complaint is that why can't they make rca plugs to the table so you can attach a better interconnect to it. A minor complaint, though. This is sweet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeway Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 I made the plunge and bought a Goldring turntable, the new one that the audiophile mags have been raving about. Is that the one based on the Rega P2? I took the plunge in Jan this year due entirely to this forum and got a Rega P3 , i've not looked back, I love the sound of vinyl, the feel. I'll be upgrading the tone arm/ rca cabling later this year but for now it's sublime. Sadly it makes my CD player seem uninviting.... bit of snag given the number of CDs I have... I have had a Rega P3 for several years. It will make anyone a vinylphile. I really, really like it I know that some audiophiles have replaced the tonearm, but, frankly, I don't know why you would do that with a P3, as the RB 300 is a terrific arm. Indeed, it appears in various guises on more expensive TTs. BTW, do you have the P3 in "basic black"? I do, and sort of regret it. I should have bought the blue one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolff Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 I got the Goldring Turntable today and am listening to it right now. What a difference! The sound is much richer and dynamic. I was a little concerned when I picked it up -- not too heavy, but looking at it, they concentrated on all the parts that matter -- the motor, the arm, and included their own Elektra cartridge as well. It took about 5 minutes to put it together, calibrate the arm, and plug it in. There is no ground wire, something new to me, which probably tells you I've been using some old turntables. Plexi cover, platter and felt mat (which I replaced with an antistatic one), and three feet (another new one to me). It is one solid machine. My only complaint is that why can't they make rca plugs to the table so you can attach a better interconnect to it. A minor complaint, though. This is sweet! Great! It may even sound better after the cartridge 'breaks in", I know mine did. It's nice how most of the new(and even older) tt are built. My tt is 20 years old, but if anything breaks it's easy to fix, except the tonearm. Replacement parts are readily available. If the motor goes it will be costly, but still worth it to slap another one in there. If you do not drop the tt, the bearing should last a long time as long as you keep it oiled per instructions. I change oil every year or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolff Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 My only complaint is that why can't they make rca plugs to the table so you can attach a better interconnect to it. I know what you mean, but all is not lost if you want to upgrade your tonearm cable. Unless I'm mistaken, your cable runs fron the bottom of the tonearm(usually the connector is a DIN plug..5 little holes in it) out to your pre-amp/amp, where it connects with RCA's. Many after market tonearm cables are available. Ranging in price from $75-$1000 . Do a search for tonearm cables. Many high-end interconnect and speaker cable companies include them in their line. You just will not see them in the brick and morter stores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Williams Posted July 16, 2004 Report Share Posted July 16, 2004 Here are ebay pictures of a 1960's Garrard 401 (direct drive) just like mine: ding! Scroll down to see the platter off, showing the idler wheel and drive pully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalupa Posted August 4, 2004 Report Share Posted August 4, 2004 Is there a good place on line to buy turntables???? I thinking of getting a Rega. TIA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolff Posted August 4, 2004 Report Share Posted August 4, 2004 Is there a good place on line to buy turntables???? I thinking of getting a Rega. TIA. MusicDirect Red Trumpet Good luck! Vinyl Lives!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_par Posted August 17, 2004 Report Share Posted August 17, 2004 (edited) I have had a Rega P3 for several years. It will make anyone a vinylphile. I really, really like it Same here. I've been enjoying my Rega P3 for more than three years now, and I've enjoyed every minute. I put a Dynavector 10x4 Mk II cartridge on it, and the combination delivers beautiful sound. I don't really feel the need to investigate anything "better." Mine is black too. I actually think it's a cool, classic look. And the bright red Dyna cart looks great on it ... Edited August 17, 2004 by j_par Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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