Sunny Murray and BAG

[clifford_thornton]

I could email him and ask him if you want... judging, however, from his disdain for not being treated well in the industry, I doubt he'd want one to download his shit for free.

[clifford_thornton]

Note also the last song on "Big Chief" is "This Nearly Was Mine" which, last time I checked, was a Richard Rodgers-Oscar Hammerstein composition from "South Pacific."

Great version of the tune.

[Rupertdacat]

... judging, however, from his disdain for not being treated well in the industry, I doubt he'd want one to download his shit for free.

O.K., I get it. You don't care about the question I asked. You have some personal agenda you're attending to.

[clifford_thornton]

I DON'T KNOW.

I am surprised that there aren't CDs of this material, but that's how Eremite and the artists set it up.

I myself don't download because, at this point, I don't see how ethically to do it. I don't know if it is ethical to pay $100 for a used copy of Big Chief, a title which I don't believe Murray got a whole lot of compensation for in the first place... but about eight years ago, it seemed like the only way to fulfill my desires.

[eremite records]

hey rupertdacat, as i said to you in an email, i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP. the owner does not "forfeit" any rights by choosing to release something in one format & not another. now if someone wanted to license _big chief_ for release on c/d, that would be great. i'm in the process of licensing a record released by eremite, c/d only, to a japan-based label who will issue it l/p only. when dealing with super-specialized recordings for which the audience is very small, that's how it goes sometimes.

just to say, i thought it was cool of the guys over at _inconstant sol_ blog to remove the _big chief_ files when i asked them to. a pleasant surprise. it shows they respect murray & recognize he has rights over his work. seems incredibly straight-forward to me --even more straight forward to murray-- but it's amazing how so many will go on & on about the 'grey areas.' while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

finally, thanks for your suggestion about an "exclusive arrangement" with a third party to sell authorized CDRs. a bit tricky, that one. that you give any thought to these matters at all & don't just go find a free download of the album is also cool. there's a lot of great music out there that's vinyl only, sure you don't want to get just a basic turntable? best regards, michael

[eremite records]

hey rupertdacat, as i said to you in an email, i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP. the owner does not "forfeit" any rights by choosing to release something in one format & not another. now if someone wanted to license _big chief_ for release on c/d, that would be great. i'm in the process of licensing a record released by eremite, c/d only, to a japan-based label who will issue it l/p only. when dealing with super-specialized recordings for which the audience is very small, that's how it goes sometimes.

just to say, i thought it was cool of the guys over at _inconstant sol_ blog to remove the _big chief_ files when i asked them to. a pleasant surprise. it shows they respect murray & recognize he has rights over his work. seems incredibly straight-forward to me --even more straight forward to murray-- but it's amazing how so many will go on & on about the 'grey areas.' while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

finally, thanks for your suggestion about an "exclusive arrangement" with a third party to sell authorized CDRs. a bit tricky, that one. that you give any thought to these matters at all & don't just go find a free download of the album is also cool. there's a lot of great music out there that's vinyl only, sure you don't want to get just a basic turntable? best regards, michael

[Rupertdacat]

.

whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP.

I have no reason to doubt that what you say is legally the case (at least in this country, and at this time). My question, however, was about ethics.

... while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

Whatever I want? I find that a quite unfair (between the lines) reading of what I wrote.

Anyway... I will give the matter some more thought as I do find the problem I posed one worth pondering. I don't anticipate making any move to acquire a copy of 'Big Chief'. Perhaps one day I'll get to hear it on the radio, or in someone else's home. And if neither one of those opportunities should come up, I would be the poorer for that. I do wonder in what sense, if any, the musicians on the record might not also be the poorer should I and others ready and eager to give them a sympathetic hearing never get the chance?

Rupe

P.S. FWIW, I have only one CDR in my library- an authorized (I think) copy of Hum Dono sold by Downtown Music Gallery.

[AndrewHill]

i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP.

I respect that. I don't own a turntable, but whatever benefits the artist best, I support that.

[clifford_thornton]

P.S. FWIW, I have only one CDR in my library- an authorized (I think) copy of Hum Dono sold by Downtown Music Gallery.

DMG CD-Rs are totally unauthorized. But ya might as well hold onto it - great session!