riverrat Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Sorry for the double post, but I thought I'd start a separate thread on this to give it better exposure. (Also posted in the thread about CD-R differences below.) _______________________________________ Well my new computer will be here any day, and I will finally have a CD burner!! I've been reviewing this thread before I buy any blanks. I just did a google search on the Mobile Fidelity "Gold" CD-Rs, and came upon this site that sells products by MAM, formerly Mitsui Advanced Media. Some interesting info there that may help explain why they seem to be better. The website below lists Mitsui "Gold" CD-Rs for $89 per 100, 100 minimum order, and is where I found all this Mitsui propaganda. Not sure if these are the same as Mobile Fidelity's but I'm sure they will be good enough for me. They say "Mitsui" CD-Rs are made in plant in Colorado Springs. Does anyone know if these are the real deal? Are they the same as the way more spendy Mobile Fidelity CD-Rs? Diversified Systems Group "MAM-A CD-R and DVD-R products are consistently recognized as some of the highest quality and most durable recording material available in today’s market. Their products are known for their high strength, remarkable reflectivity, low stress and ideal compatibility. MAM-A is the only CD-R and DVD-R producer that controls all stages of its manufacturing chain. They also hold a worldwide patent on Phthalocyanine dye, used during the recording process to ensure that your information burns accurately. MAM-A has been an industry leader in the production of high quality CD-R and DVD-R since their inception in 1991. Established in the Chiba district in Japan, Mitsui Chemicals America, Inc. expanded within five years and in 1996 created Mitsui Advanced Media, Inc, whose sole focus is CD-R and DVD-R manufacturing. MAM-A Inc. was founded in March 1996 for the production and sales of recordable compact discs. Its 50,000 sq. ft. plant is located in Colorado Springs, Colorado where the CD-R media is manufactured in a state-of-the-art clean room environment. The MAM GOLD discs uses Mitsui Chemical's patented dye and has a characteristic gold color. Mitsui Gold CD-R are available in 74 or 80-minute discs and can offer storage life in excess of 300 years. Their Gold Archive-Grade CD-R is the highest quality CD-R that Mitsui offers its customers, providing superior longevity and durability far in excess of the competition. Developed in response to user’s concerns about the longevity of current CD-R products, Mitsui has combined the technology of its patented Phthalocyanine dye with a 24-karat gold reflective layer and strict quality control to produce the highest quality product available. And, as all Mitsui products are manufactured in house, with all materials provided by the company, Mitsui CD-R benefit from a consistency in production and quality control that other CD-R manufacturers cannot equal. Mitsui Phthalocyanine Dye Mitsui Media America, Inc., in their quest to produce the highest quality product for their customers, has developed an innovative new dye that allows for the highest quality recording of your personal data or music files. With their worldwide patent on Phthalocyanine, Mitsui is able to provide recording capabilities that no other CD-R and DVD-R manufacturer can offer. When a CD-R or DVD-R is created, a photosensitive dye layer is incorporated into the product. This layer is then burned by a laser when you “write” to the disc. It is where your data or music is stored, and the cleaner the burn, the higher your accuracy of stored information will be. Phthalocyanine dye burns cleaner than any other dye in the marketplace right now, thus ensuring the best quality available in data recording. Along with this higher quality, Phthalocyanine has the longest lifetime of any photosensitive dye, guaranteeing that your product will be around for at least 100 years (estimated lifetime for Silver CD-R is 100 years; Gold CD-r is 300 years). The dye is also more transparent, contributing to the high reflectivity of Mitsui products. In a comparison of Phthalocyanine, Cyanine and AZO dye in high heat and humidity conditions, Phthalocyanine dye showed a significantly lower number of errors than the other two products. Phthalocyanine is clearly the industry leader in providing accurate data recording at affordable prices." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 I don't know anything about Mobile Fidelity CDRs, I know they made gold CDs and then went out of business and then came back again recently, but. . . . I have used these Mitsui cdrs when my audio burner was in better shape, less discriminating of type of cdrs, and they are very very good cdrs. Just got a few dozen for some archiving of recordings I had made myself on tape in the 'eighties. Worked flawlessly, seem beefy and even seem to maybe have a tiny bit more warmth than the normal Mitsui cds in playback. (Maybe that's just my imagining). They're quality. Got mine from www.am-dig.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Mitsui Golds are the accepted standard for the storage of digital media (music, text, etc) on disc. Most archives and audio preservation labs use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDK Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 The Mitsui golds are certainly fine CDRs, but for everyday use they're awfully expensive. Using a coupon, my wife just picked up 200 TDK blanks for me at Costco for $26. Frankly, I've never had any problems using any quality brand name blanks. The only ones that ever went bad were no-name Office Depot blanks that i bought several years ago, when i got my very first CD burner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 The Mitsui golds are certainly fine CDRs, but for everyday use they're awfully expensive. Using a coupon, my wife just picked up 200 TDK blanks for me at Costco for $26. Frankly, I've never had any problems using any quality brand name blanks. The only ones that ever went bad were no-name Office Depot blanks that i bought several years ago, when i got my very first CD burner. Good point. I didn't mean to give the impression that I fork over for Mitsuis at home. I would if it were some important stuff that I wanted to archive (like Lon mentioned above). For everyday home use I buy Memorex CD-Rs at Target. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riverrat Posted February 6, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 I should specify what I will be using these for- I plan to make custom CD-Rs from my home music collection primarily for use in car CD players. I'll be using a 48X CD-RW drive that came in my new Dell computer. I think it is a pretty standard issue drive. I understand I'll probably want to burn CD-Rs at a slower rate, and I'm assuming the software will allow me to select tracks to burn from one CD, then swap in a different CD and add more tracks from that one, like I used to do with cassettes. We (my wife and I) are planning to upgrade to car CD players from cassettes (just now getting out of the dark ages in car audio) now that we will have a means to make CD-Rs rather than risk damaging our CDs. (I'm aware that not all car CD players will play CD-Rs, and will be checking to see we buy players that do.) Given all the discussion that some brands seem more prone to errors than others it's worth it to me to spend a little more money on quality blanks if it will reduce these types of hassles in any measurable way. It will take some time to make custom CD-Rs (i.e. my own mixes of tracks) and I would just as soon do it right the first time rather than waste a bunch of time because I used cheap blanks that turn out to skip or not play. I guess I'm assuming that quality blanks might reduce the numbers of coasters. But perhaps there isn't much difference. I guess I'll buy some cheap ones and see how it goes. Let me know if I'm missing anything here (quite likely...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couw Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 my advise: buy some cheap ones, see how it goes. if you are not in it for archiving purposes but rather for car-music you do not need the best of the best. I have been using Sony and no-name cheap-o CDrs for some time now and they are just swell. if you have a high quality burner, it will hardly ever spoil a disk. I have had two duds up till now from a series of well over a hundred disks. the little extra something in audiophile quality that these expensive disks may provide is lost when you record from LP (lots of noise) or when you listen in the car (even more noise) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluerein Posted February 11, 2004 Report Share Posted February 11, 2004 Can anybody give me an online address where I can buy Mitsui CD-r's??? Most sellers in the US don't ship overseas (or agains outrageous prices). Thanks in advance, Reinier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted February 11, 2004 Report Share Posted February 11, 2004 www.am-dig.com still has the silver line, and has the gold in the "Klone" label which is manufactured by Mitsui. I'm not sure if they ship overseas or not, but they are a great company to do business with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 my advise: buy some cheap ones, see how it goes. if you are not in it for archiving purposes but rather for car-music you do not need the best of the best. I have been using Sony and no-name cheap-o CDrs for some time now and they are just swell. if you have a high quality burner, it will hardly ever spoil a disk. I have had two duds up till now from a series of well over a hundred disks. the little extra something in audiophile quality that these expensive disks may provide is lost when you record from LP (lots of noise) or when you listen in the car (even more noise) Agreed. Save your money unless you're archiving rare materials. You'll definately want to stick to a slower burning rate. Unless I'm in a big hurry I choose the slowest available on whatever workstation I'm on (home, the lab, etc). Just today, I burned something in realtime (1x). It makes a difference. Faster rates invite signal loss. Also, avoid burning more than, say, 60-65 minutes onto a CD-R. Your signal will begin to decrease in quality if you don't. I don't care what the suggested size limit is on the label (74 min, 80 min, etc). Keep it short. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with the Golden Arm Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 Also, avoid burning more than, say, 60-65 minutes onto a CD-R. Your signal will begin to decrease in quality if you don't. I don't care what the suggested size limit is on the label (74 min, 80 min, etc). Keep it short. Can you expound upon this theory? Not being wise ... I'd like to know why? (I do recall one time buying one of those Blue Note Breakbeats, a molded disc of course, that was something like 79:58 and the last cut "Ollloqui Valley" as I remember would fall apart on certain players. Just an anomaly I assumed?) My advice for the cheap ones is to go Japanese whenever convenient. A big old 50 of Fujis can be had after rebates for about $5.00 at Best Buy etc... now I see Fuji is going with 100 cts from Taiwan. And NEVER EVER Philips!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluerein Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Thanks Lon but they don't ship overseas...... Anyone else???? Cheers, Reinier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 Brandon, I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. Loss of signal? If you get that then your burner and/or software, or media is defective. I have never, ever had any problems or loss of quality when burning at high speeds. And the time issue? Another falsehood. 80 minute discs sound just as good as 30 minute discs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 Brandon, I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. Loss of signal? If you get that then your burner and/or software, or media is defective. I have never, ever had any problems or loss of quality when burning at high speeds. And the time issue? Another falsehood. 80 minute discs sound just as good as 30 minute discs. Are you doing this at home or at work, Stefan? I ask because I'm simply relaying standards that circulate within archival circles. One chooses to err on the conservative side in these situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neveronfriday Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 I read quite a lot of hi-fi magazines, and mumbo-jumbo aside, I think there is consensus that burning at higher speeds decreases sound quality (jitter). But, reducing the burning speed to 12x or below seems to be the way to go. As far as I recall from numerous articles, burning at single speed is the best way, but not always (depending on your burner, the medium and the software). My memory might serve me wrong here, but I can faintly recall an article from the end 90s about a Plextor drive (excellent drives, BTW) which produced better-sounding CDs with less jitter at speeds around 8x - 12x. What I have not heard at all is that the signal weakens if you use the medium to its full potential (length). This might have been a problem in the past (and might be a problem with data archiving), but not with audio. I think I would remember that from some magazine (I have been a subscriber to three different ones for over 10 years). Again, I haven't read everything on the subject, so an audio forum might be a place to ask to get a more informed opinion. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockefeller center Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 (edited) There's one post re burning speed, in the thread linked below, that sums it up quite nicely: http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=...ight=burn+speed So, it appears that some drives can burn better at lower speeds on some media, while others burn better on higher speed on some media. I don't think we can safely assume that lower or higher speed is automatically better (even if it's well within a good quality disc's certification limits and drive's PoweRec/SmartBurn features are used). It's better to test the burns yourself on your drives/media. Edited March 7, 2004 by rockefeller center Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Wood Posted March 8, 2004 Report Share Posted March 8, 2004 A late response. I burn at home. I also agree the quality of the burner varies, so it is important when looking for one to check for things like buffer overrun protection, software, etc. We're dealing with 0s and 1s guys, not analog audio waves. Also, the set up of your computer is just as important -- if you don't have enough RAM, it will affect the performance of your burning. Same as quality of your hard drive, how much processor speed, your operating system, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_forumlogo.png.a607ef20a6e0c299ab2aa6443aa1f32e.png)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.