Hot Ptah

Thanks for the props; I'm glad you and others are digging it. Sorry about those bass solos - I agree that a couple of them just aren't getting it. 4: AACM is on the right track, though this is quite obscure. It is a fantastic little album, though. 10: Not Lester. 14: Yes, right time period and as far as I know, an electric tenor. 15: Not Ra. I put this on here because I wanted people to hear it, not necessarily because anyone would guess (though you might be surprised when you find out the answer). It's a very special item to me and I digitized it some years ago for that reason. I will be surprised by #15, because the way that the drums play, is known by me to occur only on Sun Ra sessions. If someone else was using rhythm in this way, it will be a surprise. The others--I am not good at picking out players by ear, so my .000 batting average is what I expected. I had thought that #10 might not be Lester, partly because it does not have the ECM sound which did permeate "All The Magic" to some extent. Also, it does not obviously sound like Lester.

It is probably not hip to say this, but just from how I really feel after listening to many recordings, Benny Goodman is my favorite clarinet player. He has a blues feeling in his playing that really speaks to me. I know all about his difficult personality and other unpleasant aspects of his bandleading, but when I am just listening to clarinet playing on recordings, he is in fact my favorite. I also like Ed Hall and Barney Bigard a lot,and Sidney Bechet when he plays clarinet. Russell Procope is another clarinet player I really like, more than Jimmy Hamilton. To compound my un-hipness, Don Byron is my favorite of recent clarinet players. I know that he is one of those musicians not favored by this board, but that is just the way I feel about it. His playing is much more compelling to me than Anat Cohen's, for example. Byron has made some dull albums, I will grant you that. I also love Dave Tarras and Naftule Brandwein. An old friend sent me a tape of their music about ten years ago.

Here are my impressions, and guesses (which are probably laughably incorrect, but oh well). This is a great Blindfold Test, one of the best I have heard. I must buy some of the CDs here, assuming that I don't already have them without knowing it. 1. No idea who is playing in this trumpet/piano duet. It sounds like the players may be playing in a style which is not their usual style, or else that they are very versatile. 2. I don't know who this is, but it sounds like a group of avant garde heavyweights. The second arco bass soloist, in my left channel, does not have a very good sound, which is a pet peeve of mine--bassists who play with the bow and do not get a good sound. 3. Is this the Art Ensemble of Chicago? If so, I don't know the recording from hearing it, but probably have it in my collection. 4. I like this one a lot. A whole lot. I must own it, assuming that I don't already. At times, I thought I was listening to Muhal Richard Abrams and Anthony Braxton. I am not aware of a recording they did with a trumpet player. This is a truly great cut. 5. I have no idea who is playing in this avant garde cut, just none. They sound like superior players. 6. This is a different kind of piece, with rather minimalist drums and then some trombone later on. I can't place the players. 7. I thought I knew most of the jazz flute players by sound, but I am reasonbly sure that I have not heard this musician play flute for an extended solo before. I have no idea who it is. 8. It sounds like someone influenced by John Coltrane in his Atlantic period to me. Really good. I want this. 9. It sounds like someone influenced by John Coltrane in his "Live At Birdland"/"Crescent" period to me. Really good. I want this. 10. Is this Lester Bowie from "All The Magic"? I bought that album when it came out but have not listened to the second LP, of unaccompanied trumpet solos, for years. This trumpet player does a nice job of remaining compelling for the entire cut with no backing musicians. 11. I like this one a lot. I will have to get this one. I don't know who it is. The combination of clarinet, acoustic guitar and bass works really well here. A strong bass solo! 12. Who would play a "Sonny Rollins in the 1970s and 1980s" style calypso number on tenor sax? It does not sound like Rollins to me but I have no idea who it is. The bass solo is fairly long, but did not really hold my interest. 13. This is a really interesting recording. I really like it. I must have it. The bass clarinet solo, and bass solo, are really good. The bassist has a full, strong tone, and keeps my interest. Which bass clarinet player included a distorted electric guitarist in the group? Hmmmm. I just don't know. 14. This has an early 1970s feeling to it, like a Pharoah Sanders Impulse album when he was trying to get in a groove. I have no idea who it is, but it is very interesting, and again, I must have it. The conga solo is really good--it jumped out at me. Is that an electric saxophone? 15. The rhythm screams out "this is Sun Ra." I thought that I knew about much of Ra's output, but am not aware of a song dominated by violin in this style. I have never even read about such a Ra recording. The organ part comes in, in such an odd way, that it could easily be Sun Ra. I am really interested to learn about this recording. This is the kind of Blindfold Test that I should do when I grow up. Sensational. Thanks for putting it together!

The 1988 tour featured a five piece jazz horn section and a lot of improvisation, including trumpet, trombone and saxophone solos. Again, 'Make a Jazz Noise Here' is the best example, although 'The Best Band You Never Heard in Your Life' has its fine sections.

Why did you change your forum name, Bev?

But....the 1988 big band tour. The recordings from that tour have some amazing moments, especially on 'Make a Jazz Noise Here.'

One thing I forgot to mention earlier. I have seen both Jackie McLean and Paquito D'Rivera play a white plastic alto saxophone which was owned by Charlie Parker (and which is now owned by the Jazz Museum at 18th and Vine in Kansas City). When McLean played it, he was in a trio with Richard Davis and Max Roach. They were playing to publicize the beginning of the planning for the 18th and Vine complex, when it was just starting out, before any construction had happened. McLean complained before he played it that it was in very bad repair and was basically unplayable. Then he played incredibly well on it, just as hard and loud and intense as he had played on his own saxophone a few minutes before. His tone was slightly different on the plastic sax, but it sounded great in his hands.

"Ahead of Their Time" is a must for any fan of Zappa's first band.

My favorites are Johnny Hodges, Charlie Parker, and Eric Dolphy, none of whom I saw live. I have seen the following live: Roscoe Mitchell, Anthony Braxton, Henry Threadgill, Jimmy Lyons, Lee Konitz, Sonny Stitt, John Handy, Marshall Allen, Bobby Watson, Kenny Garrett, Miguel Zenon, Arthur Blythe, Jackie McLean, Charles McPherson, Greg Osby, Sonny Fortune, Paquito D'Rivera, Frank Morgan, Phil Woods, Donald Harrison, Steve Slagle, Vincent Herring, Antonio Hart, Jerry Dodgion, Dick Oatts, Bobby Mellito, Gary Foster, Ernie Watts, Marty Nau, and others I am forgetting.

In my first collegiate burst of jazz exploration, I sold a lot of rock LPs at a used music store in Madison, Wisconsin and took the cash to Discount Records on State Street (which had been managed by Chuck Nessa a few years earlier). I asked the staff to take the money and pick out a jazz collection for me. One of the albums which a young man selected was a two LP set, "This Is Duke Ellington", which had some of Duke's biggest songs from the late 1920s through the mid 1940s. I remember that this Discount Records staffer said, "the best jazz is often the oldest jazz. Keep your mind open to listening to the older stuff." I was immediately hooked by the Ellington set, just loved the music. With my apartment mates, who loved jazz too, we just about wore the grooves out on that 2 LPs set. I remember that we played "Concerto for Cootie" repeatedly, marvelling at Cootie Williams' effects in his solo. I tried to buy more Duke and was surprised at how little had been reissued (this was in the mid-1970s). I read Stanley Dance's book, and started making lists of what I wanted to hear. I wrote a letter to a local public radio disc jockey who played swing era selections on his show, and he wrote back about two weeks later with a list of Ellington LPs which he thought were essential. (In those pre-internet days, a two week hiatus between mailing a letter and receiving a reply would have been not unusual). By the end of the 1970s, I had more than 50 Duke albums, and I have bought many more since then. So Ellington was among the first jazz I heard. I had heard a lot of other music before then, to answer the question in the title of the thread.

I saw her live in a theater in the early 1990s. For some reason she stared right into my eyes when she sang. It was very powerful.

From the Zappa I've listened to - which isn't a lot, but some - I get the impression that he was trying too hard to be "weird," "difficult," or "quirky." It's the difference between your average CRI LP (not counting the Feldman, Partch, etc. titles) and, say, Xenakis. Xenakis didn't have to try! Of course, I can't fade FZ completely because he was good for foisting more Beefheart on the world, but... as a composer, he's totally uninteresting to me. Alan Silva is sometimes quite interesting (not always). I'm not comparing the two, really, but you get my drift. I was merely stating that I was curious to hear Zappa the guitarist (who's decent) in the historical context of the Actuel festival. You may not have heard enough of his output, based on your comments.

I liked Zappa with the original Mothers group, when he was actually trying to say something. "Trouble Every Day' sums up the received trauma of growing up in the American Suburbs in the 60's pretty well (Blow your harmonica, son!). He lost me with the Flo and Eddie group, which was crude for crudity's sake. I enjoyed the Hot Rats/Waka Jawaka/Grand Wazoo period instrumental stuff also, as well as the original albums up through Chunga's Revenge quite a bit. Incredibly imaginative. I also liked 'Apostrophe', 'One Size Fits All' and 'Bongo Fury' on a much more minor level. The place to start to try to understand when, why, and how Zappa "mattered" is We're Only In It For The Money, his send-up/critique of the 60's counterculture (and more). Then go one album back to Absolutely Free, which takes on their parents. Then go back one more to Freak Out and forward to Uncle Meat for the amazing side-long "King Kong". Then Hot Rats/Waka Jawaka/Grand Wazoo for the instrumental stuff. And if you like Uncle Meat, pick up Burnt Weeny Sandwich, Weasils Ripped My Flesh, and Chunga's Revenge for more of the same with somewhat diminishing returns each step. "Make A Jazz Noise Here", from the big band 1988 tour, should not be overlooked for its improvisations and jazz content. I find each album after 1976 to have some pleasures, often some great things, and then to also have what I consider filler. But his post-1976 output should not be dismissed out of hand, in my opinion.

A live recording with Archie Shepp and Zappa appears on one of the volumes of Zappa's "You Can't Do That Onstage Anymore". It is all right. Shepp plays a rather inside solo over the group's steady backing. It is not all that remarkable. It is not like there was some great synthesis of the musical backgrounds of Zappa and Shepp. It's just a blowing tune.

PM sent.

I hope TMG comes back. I have noticed that any jazz discussion forum is not as enjoyable after he stops posting on it. (AAJ suffered that fate earlier).

I can't agree with that. There were many pleasures and high points after 1971, including much uncompromised music of very high quality. Grand Wazoo and Waka Jawaka are to me, the absolute high points of all of Zappa's instrumental music. Bongo Fury and Zoot Allures have some outstanding blues oriented tracks, and scorching solos. Roxy and Elsewhere and One Size Fits All have some great jazz oriented playing. Make a Jazz Noise Here, from the 1988 tour, contains some of my favorite Zappa instrumental work ever. There are many excellent songs, some with pointed social and political commentary, on the albums of the 1980s. After 1971, his output became massive and varied, and there could be parts of it that one does not like as well, often within the same album as the high points or one's favorite tracks. But there was a lot more of value than "little glimmers", to me.

That is remarkable that these private recordings are still in existence, and in decent condition.

Why does anyone care, at all, what Letteman has to say about anything?

While these pianists usually had a drummer along with a bassist, I would think that you would enjoy Ray Bryant and Bobby Timmons.

I like them both, and find much of merit in both. I don't think it needs to be an either/or thing with them.

I'm not absolutely sure, but my guess - and it's only a guess - is that the growl work is Bernstein. Tell you what, I'll e-mail Satoko and ask her. Stay tuned... Well, I was totally wrong. Guess I just flunked my own BFT. Here's what she said in the e-mail reply: Hi Bill, Thank you for using the track for the blindfold test. The "growl" work is by Natsuki, Steven plays beautiful lines and more quiet. Very best from boiling Tokyo, Satoko Thanks for finding that out for us!

No wonder I could not guess these. I see that Natsuki Tamura & Steven Bernstein are the trumpeters on Track 6. Which one plays with the growling sound which I enjoyed so much? Thanks for Blindfold Test which expanded my knowledge and horizons!

PM will be sent on the James Moody. Right now I cannot get the private messaging system to work.