Guest akanalog Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 if anyone cares this album just got reissued. i have always found it a tad overrated. but it has a great list of players for the time-the time being 1974- jan hammer (in relaxed mode mostly), abercrombie, fortune, laird, towner, romao, mraz, etc.. i think some of arnold's breaks have been sampled before...maybe the beastie boys? anyway, this is a good album. not as good as they say, imo, but good... Quote
JSngry Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 this is a good album. not as good as they say, imo, but good... I agree. Who's reissuing it? Arnold's other Columbia album, TRIBE, is another obscure, if not quite gem, one worhty of a fate better than total obscurity. With Billy Harper, Joe Farrell, Dave Friedman, Ralph Towner. George Mraz, & Rakph McDonald, it's an eclectic (to put it mildly) lineup and the music is much less "fusiony" than that of FLEA. Can the reissue of Albert Dailey's Columbia date be far behind? Quote
mikeweil Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 Yeah, who did save this rare bird? Never saw a copy of these LPs. I have read somewhere that the rave about them was indeed a little too much, but nevertheless ... Quote
Guest akanalog Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 reissued by sony, actually... well i don't understand... it says sony... but it also says www.rockandgrooverecords.com Quote
JSngry Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 I have read somewhere that the rave about them was indeed a little too much, but nevertheless ... Well, yes and no... FLEA is one of those albums that is too much in its own bag to really comapre w/others that are roughly in the same bag. In other words, it's a "fusion" album, yes, but not a FUSION album, if you know what I mean. "Interesting", "quirky", "unpredictable", these are all adjectives I'd use (quotes intact) to describe Horacee Arnold's music. The fact that it got released on Columbia (executive producer John Hammond, no less) seems pretty mind-boggling these days. The fact that they sunk pretty much without a trace pretty much immediately doesn't. Arnold's writing and concepts were quirky, and if they've not proven to be of "earthshattering importance" or anything like that, their uniqueness still makes them interesting to hear today. It's very "unique" music, and I appreciate it as such. Same w/TRIBE, which is a different bag altogether, one of those "sorta free" albums that's neither fish nor fowl in that regard. I mean, really, Billy Harper & Dave Freidman together? You know that's the product of a mind that hears things a little differently than the rest of us! Probably these albums (& FLEA's the only one to be reissued) are more for "connoiseurs", specifically those of the many new directions jazz was trying out in the early 70s, than for "general audiences". But there's more than a few of those aboard in this community, so.... Quote
mikeweil Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 Found out its on Rock & Groove 4 - but no more. Wonder what the first three were. Quote
mikeweil Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 Okay, found it thanks to the post above: http://www.rockandgrooverecords.com/ Quote
Guest akanalog Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 no idea what these are, but the other 3 are... tranquility-self titled bell + arc-self titled west, bruce and laing-live n kickin no idea.... Quote
mikeweil Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 They sell it for $ 13.98 plus shipping. Quote
Chuck Nessa Posted October 23, 2004 Report Posted October 23, 2004 Don't let it/them concern you. Just 'cause it was issued don't mean you give them money. Quote
mikeweil Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 I'm afraid I can't follow you here, Chuck: please explain (probably only my English). Quote
Chuck Nessa Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 I hope this is clear enough. I think these recordings are not interesting enough for serious considerations. Short version "ain't nothing happening". Quote
Guest akanalog Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 i disagree. not great music...but for those of use that enjoy the jazzier end of fusion, these recordings (at least "exonerated flea" as i have not heard the other) have a good amount of value. i would personally rather listen to this album than almost any pre-1964 jazz album I can think of (or post 1976 i guess...) all personal taste. but i like the moog, the rhodes and the rockier beats on this album. and though i am not a huge fan of guitars in general, there is some nice electric guitar on here too.... Quote
Chuck Nessa Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 i would personally rather listen to this album than almost any pre-1964 jazz album I can think of (or post 1976 i guess Sorry, I never encountered the dozen year world you live in. All the best, and my condolences. Quote
JSngry Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 Just for the hallibut, I took this Sunday morning to listen to both TRIBE & FLEA again. It had been a while. TRIBE is a very nice record throughout. "Composed free" in spots, and at times reminiscent of some of the early ECM in style (but not timbre). Joe Farrell & Billy Harper both give strong performances, and Dave Friedman, a name I blew off decades ago, is a pleasant surprise. FLEA is just a tad more "fusion-y" than I remember it, but it does have it's moments, notably in great flute work by Art Webb (is he still around, even if it's playing Latin gigs?) & Dom Um Romao. Far from "essential" indeed, and I don't know that I'd pay full price for a reissue (I would for TRIBE, I think), but not deserving of total obscurity either. It's albums like this that Napster & Kazzaa were tailor made for. Quote
Noj Posted October 24, 2004 Report Posted October 24, 2004 In other words, I'd love it. I dig that funky fusion stuff. Some of my favorite tracks are just the short little interludes and simple grooves. Sometimes less is more, if it's funky enough, afaic. I don't need music to stretch the boundaries of what I have heard accomplished with instruments so much as an original sound within a traditional rhythmic structure. I've got some cheesey albums where I just like a couple bars...isn't that veird? Quote
JohnS Posted October 29, 2004 Report Posted October 29, 2004 A nice refreshing album when it first came out. I still have the vinyl so I guess it must have some value for me though it's not been played for a while. I suspect it wont have stood the test of time. Quote
mikeweil Posted November 3, 2004 Report Posted November 3, 2004 (edited) Got this today, purchased directly from the label, paid by PayPal. Took about a week to jump over the drink. Was skeptical at first as I got only a payment confirmation from PayPal but none from the label, but delivery was fast and reliable. The rhythmic concepts remind me of the Mahavishnu Orchestra - no small wonder, considering Jan Hammer is on board. Very good remastered sound! Like it very much and think Chuck's comment about it's worthlessness is inappropriate. Does anybody know who the uncredited tabla player is? Badal Roy? Neither Dom Um Romao nor David Earle Johnson were able to play like this. Edited November 3, 2004 by mikeweil Quote
Chuck Nessa Posted November 4, 2004 Report Posted November 4, 2004 Chuck's comment about it's worthlessness is inappropriate. When done correctly, everything I say is "inappropriate". Quote
pryan Posted November 4, 2004 Report Posted November 4, 2004 Chuck's comment about it's worthlessness is inappropriate. When done correctly, everything I say is "inappropriate". Some might take the poster's comment about not really taking earlier forms of music seriously (or at least not listening to them much) to be a dis. I think that attitude kind of limits you as far as jazz is concerned, but you can't like everything I guess. There's a TON of good stuff prior to '64, however. People should open up their minds and ears, they might be surprised as to what they'll discover. Quote
mikeweil Posted November 4, 2004 Report Posted November 4, 2004 Don't take me wrong - I like all kinds of jazz and other music beyond that, and have no problems with others disliking some of it. I just think one should rather say something is not to his/her taste or post the reasons for a negative judgement than simply dissing. I get the impression Chuck is somewhat too negative about a lot of the music. I appreciate his taste, and his work as a producer, but still like Horacee Arnold as well as Von Freeman .... Quote
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