Air Emergency

[AndrewHill]

Inspired from the "flying dinosaurs" thread, there's an excellent program on Nat. G. O. that's been on now for a few years called "Air Emergency". The program first goes over the airline accident then reports on what has been done to improve airline aviation since the accident. Its a great program that's meant to educate the public on such events and does not sensationalize the accident itself. Any other viewers?

[Dan Gould]

I try to keep an eye out for both Air Emergency as well as Seconds From Disaster on National Geographic channel. Seconds From Disaster doesn't always feature airline accidents but I'd say at least 50% of the episodes do. Both are very interesting and informative - the last Air Emergency I saw dealt with a fairly recent accident in which a Greek plane took off and the flight crew and passengers lost consciousness, the plane flew on autopilot for two or three hours and then ran out of fuel and crashed. It turned out that the maintenance personnel were checking to pressurization seal around the rear doors and to do that, had set the nob to "manual". When they were done, they didn't flip it back to "auto" and so the plane did not pressurize properly and the flight crew quickly lost consciousness before they could troubleshoot the problem. In fact, right before the Operations Center lost contact with the flight, the engineer on the ground sought to confirm that the knob was set to "auto" but the pilot, losing the ability to think clearly as his brain was running out of oxygen, asked about something else.

Amazingly, one member of the cabin crew actually remained conscious. The oxygen tanks that supply air to the passengers only lasts about ten or fifteen minutes - its presumed that the flight crew will get the plane down to a level where oxygen isn't necessary in that time period. But without any message from the flight deck, this flight attendant, who had some but not a lot of flight training, realized something was wrong and made his way up to the flight deck. There are oxygen tanks that last an hour or so in the forward compartment and he apparently used those to stay alive - but did not attempt to enter the flight deck until the very end. The Greeks scrambled fighter jets and the pilots initially reported no one was conscious on board - then they saw him enter the flight deck and sit in the pilot's seat - but the radio was tuned to the departure frequency of the airport they took off from, so no one heard his message. He then tried to fly the plane but couldn't and it ran out of fuel.

Really sad story, and its difficult to imagine the terror he must have felt - without oxygen for so long, everyone on board would have been brain dead anyway - but he was the one person conscious and aware when it went down, and all because a maintenance person didn't return the knob to where it should have been.

Another frightening story of maintenance incompetence was a British airline plane that had the windscreen explode outward, sucking the pilot halfway out of the cockpit. Somehow they managed to land the plane, and because of the extreme cold, the pilot actually survived and recovered most or all of his faculties. Amazingly, it turned out that the maintenance personnel that had replaced the windscreen bolts didn't look for the right ones - he had a measurement and simply eyeballed it and installed the ones that looked right. Of course, they weren't right, and ultimately broke off and nearly killed 180 people. And the mechanic couldn't see what was wrong with his behavior! Insisted that to be certain that the right bolts were used would take too long and they wouldn't be able to meet their workload in a given night! Frightening.

But one of the best episodes was the one about Egyptair Flight 800 - the one where the replacement pilot took over much earlier than usual, said "I trust in God" and then flew the plane into the Atlantic. The FAA said it was murder/suicide while the Egyptians kept trying to figure out a way to avoid that conclusion. I remember reading about what the FAA saw as compelling evidence, but this episode had the real, full story. An Egyptian pilot actually defected and was interviewed by the FBI. It turned out that the pilot had a problem with sexual harassment and unwanted sexual advances - the Egyptian airline knew about it and was fed up with his latest shenanigans, and the day before his final flight, he was told that this was it - he'd never fly a transatlantic route again. So on top of that circumstantial evidence (the man who had made the decision to ground him was on the doomed flight himself), this pilot also told the FBI that the airline had told the line pilots what had happened - and sworn them to secrecy, even with their families. After learning the truth, its hard to watch the final segment in which a member of the killers family continues to insist that this was a technical problem that the Americans refuse to recognize and fix and that they are destroying the memory of an honorable man. Pathetic.

Since I was a kid I've always been fascinated by plane accidents (insert Rain Man joke here) so I really enjoy both of these shows for giving in depth looks at their causes.

[AndrewHill]

I've seen all of the episodes you've mentioned except the first one, which I just looked up, is apparently a new one. The Egyptian Air one was indeed a good one, along with the episode about the windshield blowing out because of the wrong screws. There are two other episodes that really got to me. The first one, is the episode about Alaskan Air that left, I believe, Mexico. The tail rudders were broken and the plane went into a tail spin, including spinning around completely and crashing in the Pacific Ocean. What the passengers and crew must've gone through must have been horrific. The other one was a a mid-air collision between a freight and passenger plane. What was heartbreaking was that the passenger plane was mostly children. But the story didn't end there, when it culminated with a parent murdering the air traffic controller that made the error.

Seconds from Disaster is another excellent show, and I particularly like how they back up and show what happens right before the disaster itself. Favorites are the Oklahoma City bombing, Mt. St. Helens and the Paris-concord crash.

Edited October 29, 2007 by Holy Ghost

[Dan Gould]

I have definitely not heard of the accident in which the ATC person got killed afterwards - that's really amazing. I'll have to watch for that one. Another cool episode was one where a Japanese (or maybe Chinese) flight over the Pacific ended up in an amazing free-fall without engines, fell from 30000 feet to under 10000 in about a minute, but managed to regain control and re-start the engines, and then actually land the extremely damaged jet in San Francisco. Even after learning that it was pilot error that created the situation, you had to have a great deal of admiration for the flight skills of the pilot to save the plane and the passengers.

The episode with the most frightening case of pilot error had to be the accident in England with a brand new Boeing aircraft - a new 737 model or something. The left engine had a failure in the turbine, which exploded and damaged the engine badly. The crew smelled smoke - and because of the fact that the earlier model of the plane had air inputs from the right engine, presumed that the right engine was the problem and shut it down! They shut down the wrong engine - yet with less fuel flow to the damaged engine, the extreme shaking settled down, making them think everything was fine when in fact they were flying, under-powered, on the damaged engine and the plane crashed - across a busy highway - a mile short of the runway.

You probably saw that one too - but it really goes to show how easily pilot error can occur and how tragic the results can be. Only afterwards did Boeing initiate intensive re-training for pilots on "revised" models of existing aircraft.

[clifford_thornton]

Haven't seen this show, and due to my fear of flying, it probably isn't a good idea to watch!

I have heard/read about a lot of these accidents, though.

[Dan Gould]

I've seen all of the episodes you've mentioned except the first one, which I just looked up, is apparently a new one.

The episode with the Greek plane full of unconscious people is on this afternoon at 4 pm.

[AndrewHill]

I've seen all of the episodes you've mentioned except the first one, which I just looked up, is apparently a new one.

The episode with the Greek plane full of unconscious people is on this afternoon at 4 pm.

Thanks! I happen to be home today, so I'm definitely going to catch it.

[Dan Gould]

Looks like an interesting one tomorrow morning at 10, too. Something about a plane with an air speed and altitude instruments failure. Talk about flying blind!

[AllenLowe]

my son watches Seconds From the Disaster - I like the show, but the opening credits are, I think, a little bit exaggerated:

"WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO SEE IS BASED ON ACTUAL EVENTS. ONLY THE NAMES OF CERTAIN PEOPLE HAVE BEEN CHANGED. BUT YOU CAN BET YOUR ASS THAT IF YOU RIDE ON A PLANE, TAKE A TRIP IN A BOAT, DRIVE A CAR, OR GO ANYWHERE BY ANY MEANS OF TRANSPORTATION: YOU WILL DIE!

Edited November 5, 2007 by AllenLowe

[AndrewHill]

I've seen all of the episodes you've mentioned except the first one, which I just looked up, is apparently a new one.

The episode with the Greek plane full of unconscious people is on this afternoon at 4 pm.

Man, that was a tragic episode. My hat is off to the flight attendant trying to save the plane. That must've been a nightmare being the only one conscious.

[AndrewHill]

Looks like an interesting one tomorrow morning at 10, too. Something about a plane with an air speed and altitude instruments failure. Talk about flying blind!

Is this another new episode? Glad to see that there's more production on the way.

[Dan Gould]

I've seen all of the episodes you've mentioned except the first one, which I just looked up, is apparently a new one.

The episode with the Greek plane full of unconscious people is on this afternoon at 4 pm.

Man, that was a tragic episode. My hat is off to the flight attendant trying to save the plane. That must've been a nightmare being the only one conscious.

What I couldn't understand is why he didn't attempt to fly the plane sooner than he did. It was probably hopeless anyway but that was the one part of the mystery that I find kind of baffling.

[Dan Gould]

Looks like an interesting one tomorrow morning at 10, too. Something about a plane with an air speed and altitude instruments failure. Talk about flying blind!

Is this another new episode? Glad to see that there's more production on the way.

No, it says its a 2004 episode, it was an AeroPeru flight.

[AllenLowe]

I like the one about the donkey in the mountains whose left testicle burst at 12,000 feet, sending all 18 passengers on a 4,000 foot dive - fortunately the pilot was able to gain control with the right testicle, steer the donkey out of its spin, and make a safe lending on its front left nipple -

Edited November 6, 2007 by AllenLowe

[AllenLowe]

I guess nobody else saw that one -

[Dan Gould]

What an amazing story they covered in today's episode. Almost immediately after takeoff, first the altimeter (there are three of them) and then the air speed indicator failed. Then the pilots started getting multiple warnings, sometimes contradictory ones (the stalk shaker started with a stall warning while the high speed warning was also going off!). They consulted ATC for info on altitude/heading/air speed but since the transponder was sending the same messed up data to the ground, their info was worthless. And all of this is going on at night so there are no visual markers for attitude or altitude. Ultimately the plane gradually lost altitude so that when the ground proximity warning went off, it was a "true" alarm - but in the dark, the pilots didn't know and treated it like they were treating the other alarms, having no idea whether they were accurate or not.

And the cause? The sensors for these instruments are on the bottom of the wing. Following procedure, ground crews covered them before cleaning the plane, but forgot to remove the tape. The supervisor was out sick, so another mechanic filled in, and didn't spot it. Neither did the pilot on his walk-around (which is not surprising considering that he was using a flashlight and the duct tape was silver and reflective, like the underside of the wing.

This is the type of accident where I'd be curious to see how other pilots do when placed in a simulator programmed to give the same series of readings/alarms. It seems like a near impossible situation to deal with when you add in the darkness. Pilots are trained to trust their instruments because of the way that flight illusions can mess with their senses, but what the hell do you do when the instruments aren't working and you can't fly visually?

[AndrewHill]

What an amazing story they covered in today's episode. Almost immediately after takeoff, first the altimeter (there are three of them) and then the air speed indicator failed. Then the pilots started getting multiple warnings, sometimes contradictory ones (the stalk shaker started with a stall warning while the high speed warning was also going off!). They consulted ATC for info on altitude/heading/air speed but since the transponder was sending the same messed up data to the ground, their info was worthless. And all of this is going on at night so there are no visual markers for attitude or altitude. Ultimately the plane gradually lost altitude so that when the ground proximity warning went off, it was a "true" alarm - but in the dark, the pilots didn't know and treated it like they were treating the other alarms, having no idea whether they were accurate or not.

And the cause? The sensors for these instruments are on the bottom of the wing. Following procedure, ground crews covered them before cleaning the plane, but forgot to remove the tape. The supervisor was out sick, so another mechanic filled in, and didn't spot it. Neither did the pilot on his walk-around (which is not surprising considering that he was using a flashlight and the duct tape was silver and reflective, like the underside of the wing.

This is the type of accident where I'd be curious to see how other pilots do when placed in a simulator programmed to give the same series of readings/alarms. It seems like a near impossible situation to deal with when you add in the darkness. Pilots are trained to trust their instruments because of the way that flight illusions can mess with their senses, but what the hell do you do when the instruments aren't working and you can't fly visually?

Yes, I did see this one a couple of years ago. It was nuts! Scary to think that a simple piece of tape can bring down a jet

[Dan Gould]

What an amazing story they covered in today's episode. Almost immediately after takeoff, first the altimeter (there are three of them) and then the air speed indicator failed. Then the pilots started getting multiple warnings, sometimes contradictory ones (the stalk shaker started with a stall warning while the high speed warning was also going off!). They consulted ATC for info on altitude/heading/air speed but since the transponder was sending the same messed up data to the ground, their info was worthless. And all of this is going on at night so there are no visual markers for attitude or altitude. Ultimately the plane gradually lost altitude so that when the ground proximity warning went off, it was a "true" alarm - but in the dark, the pilots didn't know and treated it like they were treating the other alarms, having no idea whether they were accurate or not.

And the cause? The sensors for these instruments are on the bottom of the wing. Following procedure, ground crews covered them before cleaning the plane, but forgot to remove the tape. The supervisor was out sick, so another mechanic filled in, and didn't spot it. Neither did the pilot on his walk-around (which is not surprising considering that he was using a flashlight and the duct tape was silver and reflective, like the underside of the wing.

This is the type of accident where I'd be curious to see how other pilots do when placed in a simulator programmed to give the same series of readings/alarms. It seems like a near impossible situation to deal with when you add in the darkness. Pilots are trained to trust their instruments because of the way that flight illusions can mess with their senses, but what the hell do you do when the instruments aren't working and you can't fly visually?

Yes, I did see this one a couple of years ago. It was nuts! Scary to think that a simple piece of tape can bring down a jet

And it wasn't the first time! Eight months earlier the same thing happened to another 757, and while Boeing had sent out instructions, AeroPeru hadn't adopted them yet. So tape brought down two different jets.

[BruceH]

I think I've caught one or two episodes of Air Emergency. If it's the show I'm thinking of, I like the amount of detail it goes into. You know exactly what happened, how the flight crew dealt with it, etc.

This reminds me: Have either of you guys seen the Errol Morris series First Person? He's the documentary filmmaker who came out with The Thin Blue Line and The Fog of War. In this TV series, each pisode is an interview of someone with an unusual job, obsession, or story to tell. My favorite episode is titled "Leaving the Earth." It concerns the crash of a passenger jet in 89 or 90 on the outskirts of Sioux City, Iowa----one of the most horrific crashes ever. You see the video clip of the plane tumbling and fireballing over the runway and it seems utterly impossible that anyone could survive it, but a few did. The fact that anyone survived at all is due to the efforts of one Denny Fitch, the interviewee. He was a check pilot for an airline, someone who basically makes sure the pilots' skills are up to par. But he just happened to be on this flight because he was coming home from leading a seminar or class of some sort. So he was just a passenger on the plane when all of the jet's hydralics went out AND one of the engines stopped working. (This was supposed to be a one-in-a-billion chance, so no emergency procedures had been worked out to deal with it.) He could tell something was wrong, so he went to the cockpit and offered to do what he could to help. It's an amazing story; he takes you through it step by step so you understand what was going on and what they were trying to do to ameliorate the situation. Fitch comes across as very humble, but clearly if he hadn't happened to be there the plane would have pitched into a worse crash and killed everyone aboard. One of the most utterly riveting hours of television I've ever seen.

Edited November 6, 2007 by BruceH

[AndrewHill]

I think I've caught one or two episodes of Air Emergency. If it's the show I'm thinking of, I like the amount of detail it goes into. You know exactly what happened, how the flight crew dealt with it, etc.

This reminds me: Have either of you guys seen the Errol Morris series First Person? He's the documentary filmmaker who came out with The Thin Blue Line and The Fog of War. In this TV series, each pisode is an interview of someone with an unusual job, obsession, or story to tell. My favorite episode is titled "Leaving the Earth." It concerns the crash of a passenger jet in 89 or 90 on the outskirts of Sioux City, Iowa----one of the most horrific crashes ever. You see the video clip of the plane tumbling and fireballing over the runway and it seems utterly impossible that anyone could survive it, but a few did. The fact that anyone survived at all is due to the efforts of one Denny Fitch, the interviewee. He was a check pilot for an airline, someone who basically makes sure the pilots' skills are up to par. But he just happened to be on this flight because he was coming home from leading a seminar or class of some sort. So he was just a passenger on the plane when all of the jet's hydralics went out AND one of the engines stopped working. (This was supposed to be a one-in-a-billion chance, so no emergency procedures had been worked out to deal with it.) He could tell something was wrong, so he went to the cockpit and offered to do what he could to help. It's an amazing story; he takes you through it step by step so you understand what was going on and what they were trying to do to ameliorate the situation. Fitch comes across as very humble, but clearly if he hadn't happened to be there the plane would have pitched into a worse crash and killed everyone aboard. One of the most utterly riveting hours of television I've ever seen.

Never heard of this show...what channel is it on, and is it still on? "Leaving the Earth" sounds like an absolute nightmare for whoever was on that flight. Occasionally, other programs cover airline disastors that seem like they should've been on Air Emergency. I cannot remember what program it was but I think it was on History Channel, but anyway it was about flight 191 that crashed shortly after take off from a Chicago airport in 1979. A bystander just happened to snap a photo of the plane as it was already flying with wingtips facing the ground and the sky. What a horrific scene this must've been to witness. Oh and I just remebered why it was flying like this. It was because it lost an engine shortly after take off. I think the reason why was that it was not refastened correctly when the mechanics were doing a routine service on it.

Edited November 6, 2007 by Holy Ghost

[BruceH]

It was on for only one and a half seasons, I think, done for some cable channel; there are only 17 episodes. The DVD box set is a small box.

[Dan Gould]

I've never seen the show, Bruce, but I remember well that crash in Iowa, caught by a local TV news camera. I find it a little odd though that the passenger who helped out in the cockpit is getting all of the credit. What happened was that a fan in the center (tail) engine exploded, and ripped through the hydraulics. The pilot varied power to the right and left engines in order to steer the plane, and while I knew that a passenger had assisted on the flight deck, I don't recall any reports or TV shows that give Fitch the designation of ultimate hero of the flight. The pilot has gotten all of the accolades (not to imply Fitch doesn't deserve some) and even joked with the ATC when he was told that he had clearance for Runway 22 by saying, "oh, you want to be particular about it and make it a specific runway" or something like that.

Also, of 296 passengers and crew, 184 lived, a much greater proportion than you remembered.

Let me just say at this point that in searching for info, I found this web page which has a very informative article written by the captain about what allowed them to get the aircraft down without killing everyone on board. His description of Fitch's contributions go like this:

... we were advised that Captain Dennis E. Fitch an instructor pilot for the DC-10 - was a passenger in our aircraft. Considering the aura that surrounds flight instructors we, naturally, invited him to the flight deck. Maybe he knew more about the systems than we did and could help us out of our dilemma. He arrived, took one look at the instrument panel and that was it that was the end of his knowledge, too. He also had not faced this situation before.

... I asked Fitch if he would go back into the cabin and look at the controls. He came back and said, "The controls aren't moving, how can I help now?" We were still struggling with the yoke and the throttles at the same time, and once again, out of the blue came a decision, "Take the throttles and operate them in response to our commands. Take one throttle lever in each hand - you can do it much smoother than we can and see if we can't smooth this thing out and get a little better control of the airplane". For the next 30 minutes, that is how we operated. And working together like that is how we flew the aircraft to Sioux city's Gateway Airport.

At one point, Fitch traded seats with Dvorak about the time we were ready to land. I said "Let's get ready for landing. Denny [Fitch], you sit here and strap yourself in". Then, Dvorak swung around into a position where he could reach the throttles, and began to manipulate them. Fitch had been handling the throttles for about 20 minutes and he had a feel for what it took to give us what we needed. Dvorak, of course, did not have the benefit of that practice. He responded according to our calls such as "we need a wing up", "need to add power", and Fitch was adding adjustment commands like "you need a little more", "that's not enough", or "we need a little less turn", "you need a little more turn".

It soon became obvious that, although Dvorak was the regular crew member of the two, Fitch had developed a level of expertise at this entirely new skill. In another instance that illustrated the benefits of CRM, at Dvorak's suggestion, we decided it was better that Fitch sit by the throttle controls because he had been doing it. Dvorak got up and gave Fitch his seat and Dvorak took the seat behind me, the jump seat. That is why the deadheading Captain was sitting in the Second Officer's seat when we landed.

So, I don't want to take away from Fitch, the flight crew needed all the help they could to control the plane and he helped a great deal. But it sounds like because he was the source for the TV show, the impression might have been given that he was the sole reason that there were survivors. I think its fair to say that the entire flight crew, led by the Captain, had a big part in that also.

[AndrewHill]

I've never seen the show, Bruce, but I remember well that crash in Iowa, caught by a local TV news camera. I find it a little odd though that the passenger who helped out in the cockpit is getting all of the credit. What happened was that a fan in the center (tail) engine exploded, and ripped through the hydraulics. The pilot varied power to the right and left engines in order to steer the plane, and while I knew that a passenger had assisted on the flight deck, I don't recall any reports or TV shows that give Fitch the designation of ultimate hero of the flight. The pilot has gotten all of the accolades (not to imply Fitch doesn't deserve some) and even joked with the ATC when he was told that he had clearance for Runway 22 by saying, "oh, you want to be particular about it and make it a specific runway" or something like that.

Also, of 296 passengers and crew, 184 lived, a much greater proportion than you remembered.

Let me just say at this point that in searching for info, I found this web page which has a very informative article written by the captain about what allowed them to get the aircraft down without killing everyone on board. His description of Fitch's contributions go like this:

... we were advised that Captain Dennis E. Fitch an instructor pilot for the DC-10 - was a passenger in our aircraft. Considering the aura that surrounds flight instructors we, naturally, invited him to the flight deck. Maybe he knew more about the systems than we did and could help us out of our dilemma. He arrived, took one look at the instrument panel and that was it that was the end of his knowledge, too. He also had not faced this situation before.

... I asked Fitch if he would go back into the cabin and look at the controls. He came back and said, "The controls aren't moving, how can I help now?" We were still struggling with the yoke and the throttles at the same time, and once again, out of the blue came a decision, "Take the throttles and operate them in response to our commands. Take one throttle lever in each hand - you can do it much smoother than we can and see if we can't smooth this thing out and get a little better control of the airplane". For the next 30 minutes, that is how we operated. And working together like that is how we flew the aircraft to Sioux city's Gateway Airport.

At one point, Fitch traded seats with Dvorak about the time we were ready to land. I said "Let's get ready for landing. Denny [Fitch], you sit here and strap yourself in". Then, Dvorak swung around into a position where he could reach the throttles, and began to manipulate them. Fitch had been handling the throttles for about 20 minutes and he had a feel for what it took to give us what we needed. Dvorak, of course, did not have the benefit of that practice. He responded according to our calls such as "we need a wing up", "need to add power", and Fitch was adding adjustment commands like "you need a little more", "that's not enough", or "we need a little less turn", "you need a little more turn".

It soon became obvious that, although Dvorak was the regular crew member of the two, Fitch had developed a level of expertise at this entirely new skill. In another instance that illustrated the benefits of CRM, at Dvorak's suggestion, we decided it was better that Fitch sit by the throttle controls because he had been doing it. Dvorak got up and gave Fitch his seat and Dvorak took the seat behind me, the jump seat. That is why the deadheading Captain was sitting in the Second Officer's seat when we landed.

So, I don't want to take away from Fitch, the flight crew needed all the help they could to control the plane and he helped a great deal. But it sounds like because he was the source for the TV show, the impression might have been given that he was the sole reason that there were survivors. I think its fair to say that the entire flight crew, led by the Captain, had a big part in that also.

Is that Iowa crash footage available on line? Sounds incredible that someone managed to capture it on film.

[Dan Gould]

I've never seen the show, Bruce, but I remember well that crash in Iowa, caught by a local TV news camera. I find it a little odd though that the passenger who helped out in the cockpit is getting all of the credit. What happened was that a fan in the center (tail) engine exploded, and ripped through the hydraulics. The pilot varied power to the right and left engines in order to steer the plane, and while I knew that a passenger had assisted on the flight deck, I don't recall any reports or TV shows that give Fitch the designation of ultimate hero of the flight. The pilot has gotten all of the accolades (not to imply Fitch doesn't deserve some) and even joked with the ATC when he was told that he had clearance for Runway 22 by saying, "oh, you want to be particular about it and make it a specific runway" or something like that.

Also, of 296 passengers and crew, 184 lived, a much greater proportion than you remembered.

Let me just say at this point that in searching for info, I found this web page which has a very informative article written by the captain about what allowed them to get the aircraft down without killing everyone on board. His description of Fitch's contributions go like this:

... we were advised that Captain Dennis E. Fitch an instructor pilot for the DC-10 - was a passenger in our aircraft. Considering the aura that surrounds flight instructors we, naturally, invited him to the flight deck. Maybe he knew more about the systems than we did and could help us out of our dilemma. He arrived, took one look at the instrument panel and that was it that was the end of his knowledge, too. He also had not faced this situation before.

... I asked Fitch if he would go back into the cabin and look at the controls. He came back and said, "The controls aren't moving, how can I help now?" We were still struggling with the yoke and the throttles at the same time, and once again, out of the blue came a decision, "Take the throttles and operate them in response to our commands. Take one throttle lever in each hand - you can do it much smoother than we can and see if we can't smooth this thing out and get a little better control of the airplane". For the next 30 minutes, that is how we operated. And working together like that is how we flew the aircraft to Sioux city's Gateway Airport.

At one point, Fitch traded seats with Dvorak about the time we were ready to land. I said "Let's get ready for landing. Denny [Fitch], you sit here and strap yourself in". Then, Dvorak swung around into a position where he could reach the throttles, and began to manipulate them. Fitch had been handling the throttles for about 20 minutes and he had a feel for what it took to give us what we needed. Dvorak, of course, did not have the benefit of that practice. He responded according to our calls such as "we need a wing up", "need to add power", and Fitch was adding adjustment commands like "you need a little more", "that's not enough", or "we need a little less turn", "you need a little more turn".

It soon became obvious that, although Dvorak was the regular crew member of the two, Fitch had developed a level of expertise at this entirely new skill. In another instance that illustrated the benefits of CRM, at Dvorak's suggestion, we decided it was better that Fitch sit by the throttle controls because he had been doing it. Dvorak got up and gave Fitch his seat and Dvorak took the seat behind me, the jump seat. That is why the deadheading Captain was sitting in the Second Officer's seat when we landed.

So, I don't want to take away from Fitch, the flight crew needed all the help they could to control the plane and he helped a great deal. But it sounds like because he was the source for the TV show, the impression might have been given that he was the sole reason that there were survivors. I think its fair to say that the entire flight crew, led by the Captain, had a big part in that also.

Is that Iowa crash footage available on line? Sounds incredible that someone managed to capture it on film.

I'm surprised if you've never seen it, it was seen so much back when it happened. I found this link through Wikipedia:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=52...mp;q=flight+232

[Dan Gould]

Haven't seen this show, and due to my fear of flying, it probably isn't a good idea to watch!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=52...mp;q=flight+232

Don't click the link, CT!