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BFT #62


Nate Dorward
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Had some trouble getting the tracks in the right order - where some numbered incorrectly? (This may have been answered, but I'm avoiding reading anything here.) Anyway, here are some quick comments I wanted to post before leaving the office. Will try to elaborate more later, but I really suck at identifying players. I really dug this BFT because much of this stuff is a bit out of my “comfort zone” but I nevertheless found most of it very listenable and interesting. I'm very curious to know some of the players. Many thanks Nate!

Hm, wonder what's up with the numbering problem. You seem to have sorted it out correctly, as your descriptions all match the music.

5. Lovely! Strings/cello (?) are just atonal enough to not make this sound at all sappy. Is this Kenny Wheeler on trumpet? I really like this one and would love to hear more.

Strings, but not a standard quartet.... -- Nothing atonal here, I'd think, but the trumpeter does have a very interestingly worked-out harmonic language which he draws on for some of his recordings.

7. Solo guitar. Elliot Sharp? Andrew Cheshire? Goes on a bit too long with not enough variety for me.

Neither of them--actually, I've never heard Cheshire at all....

Glad you found the compilation of interest! Thanks for the comments.

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No peakies, mostly one-off listens. I mention this later, but I'd just started listening (started with bonus tracks) and responding when my laptop HD died. That sucked. Anyway, sorry for the delay.

Track 1 - Boppish/Tristanoesque piece. Bone is not a guy I'm overly familiar with. Nice raspy tone at points, but overall seems to lag a bit behind the beat. Tenor sound is Marsh-like, but doesn't have Marsh's warmth. I want to say Konitz playing tenor, but doesn't seem to have the polish of Lee.

Track 2 - Oh, yum! Trumpet has some Kenny Wheeler on him, but sounds more out than that. Dave Douglas, maybe? Altos sound like schooled guys, but one reminds me of Moondoc and the other of Rob Brown, but it's neither. Maybe a hyper-controlled Zorn? Recording sounds modern, but bassist reminds me of Nick Degeronimo -- but I would think him dead before this recording. Could this be a Whit Dickey record?

Track 3 - This one isn't firing for me. Seems too learned and trying to be out. A lot of guys doing this now, taking that Tristano feel and playing the learned 'outside' style over it -- doesn't work for my ears. There's nothing *wrong* with this, and that's what's wrong. Just doesn't have fire.

Track 4 - Electric bass... ugh. ;) I'd like this better without the electric guitar and electric bass. This reminds me of one of Dennis Gonzalez' bands, but doesn't quite fire for me like that does (geez I'm a negative bastard!). Alto sounds like somebody who's listened to a lot of Grover Washington -- playing very exaggeratedly off the beat much of the time; kind of reminds me of Candy Dulfer. I'm going to take a SWACG (Sophisticated Wild-And-Crazy Guess) at the guitarist, but I'm sure I'm wrong -- I like my guess better than this -- and say Vernon Reid. Even some shades of Sonny Sharrock in there. Sounds like rock-leaning people trying to play an aggressive crossover. It sort of works at times, a bit like Material.

Track 5 - Not sure I know this trumpeter. I like the mix with the strings, though. Has an ECM sound to the recording, which had me thinking Kenny Wheeler again, but it's not him -- missing that trademark sweet thing he gets up high. I like this.

Track 6 - I think I know this guy, but I can't pin him down (on second listen, now). A bit of Ricky Ford, but cleaner. Must be one of those guys on the edge of my field of listening. Reminds me of an Ellery Eskelin record I just got off eMusic (haven't played it yet, just catalogued it). He plays one of the old Gene Ammons tunes and smokes it. This guy has a more muscular tone than EE, though.

Track 7 - Eh... huh? No thanks.

Track 8 - Crazy Rhythm. Love this tune. I was going to guess Zoot early on, but the rhythm isn't spot-on like Zoot. Valve trombone. No clue.

Track 9 - Huh... shows up as "Track 2" in Quicktime. No idea, but reminds me a bit of Zappa's Jazz From Hell, which I never really cared for.

Track 10 - Shows as "Track 3" in QT. This stuff would interest me in the right setting, but it's just not stuff I'd sit down and listen to. No idea.

Track 11 - Shows as "Track 4" in QT. Not sure what it is, but the arrangements are by somebody who knows what he's doing. Very pro and tight. Sounds like Charles McPherson on alto to me. Not sure of the 'bone, at all. Modern tenor, don't care for him. Guessing a college boy -- totally loses the feel that was setup for him. Piano rings no bells.

Track 12 - Shows as "Track 5" in QT. Different, but not reaching me. Sounds like it's trying to be 'out' but, I don't know -- I like the way Bindu does it, I guess. No guesses.

BONUS DISC

Track 13 - Yeah baby! That's what I'm talkin' about! Knew this in 2 notes, and started to type my response (started with the bonus), then my laptop took a dirt-nap the next day. Tender Feelings. My guy Tyrone on tenor (solo). I believe Herbert Morgan is the second tenor on this cut. I have this on the Mosaic set, but I think the album is Contrasts. Eddie Gladden and Eddie Wright. It's not Woody Shaw... hang on, it'll come to me... Hank White! These two sides (last two discs in the Mosaic set) are some of my favorite music ever. I was actually going to include a cut from this when I did my BFT. Great choice!

Track 14 - Not sure... reminds me of that Anthony Ortega date with Chuck Domanico, but this guy sounds a little funkier than Anthony. I don't know *who* this is, but I like it a bunch.

Track 15 - I like how this develops, but it takes awhile. This would be very interesting to watch live. Interesting and effective use of electronics, but tough to hear without seeing.

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Wow, odd that nearly everyone started with the bonus disc. I wanted to nail that Larry Young tune early, but never got back to listening before the HD died. After reading this, I probably would have been third, anyway. :D

Definitely and ear workout and I'll be chewing on my collar waiting for the answers. Way to push the envelope by including a wide variety of music.

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Thom--thanks for the comments--as you'll see, a few bullseyes....!

Track 2 - Oh, yum! Trumpet has some Kenny Wheeler on him, but sounds more out than that. Dave Douglas, maybe? Altos sound like schooled guys, but one reminds me of Moondoc and the other of Rob Brown, but it's neither. Maybe a hyper-controlled Zorn? Recording sounds modern, but bassist reminds me of Nick Degeronimo -- but I would think him dead before this recording. Could this be a Whit Dickey record?

You have the date wrong--this is from the 1970s--but yes, it's Kenny Wheeler as a sideman; he's played in a lot of freeish settings over the years aside from the more composerly stuff on ECM.

Track 4 - Electric bass... ugh. ;) I'd like this better without the electric guitar and electric bass. This reminds me of one of Dennis Gonzalez' bands, but doesn't quite fire for me like that does (geez I'm a negative bastard!). Alto sounds like somebody who's listened to a lot of Grover Washington -- playing very exaggeratedly off the beat much of the time; kind of reminds me of Candy Dulfer. I'm going to take a SWACG (Sophisticated Wild-And-Crazy Guess) at the guitarist, but I'm sure I'm wrong -- I like my guess better than this -- and say Vernon Reid. Even some shades of Sonny Sharrock in there. Sounds like rock-leaning people trying to play an aggressive crossover. It sort of works at times, a bit like Material.

Why, what's wrong with bass guitar? -- Anyway, your 2nd guess about the guitarist is much better than the first....! :) It's a Sharrock sideman appearance from his comeback period in the 1980s/1990s.

Track 6 - I think I know this guy, but I can't pin him down (on second listen, now). A bit of Ricky Ford, but cleaner. Must be one of those guys on the edge of my field of listening. Reminds me of an Ellery Eskelin record I just got off eMusic (haven't played it yet, just catalogued it). He plays one of the old Gene Ammons tunes and smokes it. This guy has a more muscular tone than EE, though.

Not a young guy here--this is a veteran. I think the reason he's not better known is that he's mostly stuck to his homebase. He's a sideman on a several of a notable singer's albums, which is probably the only place you would have heard him before.

Track 9 - Huh... shows up as "Track 2" in Quicktime. No idea, but reminds me a bit of Zappa's Jazz From Hell, which I never really cared for.

I think the goofy track numbering is due to my using 2 discs to make the compilation--I renamed the files to the correct numbering but somehow it seems to have still carried over. Anyway, you have the numbering correct. Not Zappa--it's actually (as I mentioned above) a player who's better known for his work on a different instrument entirely.

Track 11 - Shows as "Track 4" in QT. Not sure what it is, but the arrangements are by somebody who knows what he's doing. Very pro and tight. Sounds like Charles McPherson on alto to me. Not sure of the 'bone, at all. Modern tenor, don't care for him. Guessing a college boy -- totally loses the feel that was setup for him. Piano rings no bells.

The album is actually a tribute to the arranger (who had died--he's not on the track). Yeah, the alto's got that Bird line going like McPherson but it's not him.

Track 13 - Yeah baby! That's what I'm talkin' about! Knew this in 2 notes, and started to type my response (started with the bonus), then my laptop took a dirt-nap the next day. Tender Feelings. My guy Tyrone on tenor (solo). I believe Herbert Morgan is the second tenor on this cut. I have this on the Mosaic set, but I think the album is Contrasts. Eddie Gladden and Eddie Wright. It's not Woody Shaw... hang on, it'll come to me... Hank White! These two sides (last two discs in the Mosaic set) are some of my favorite music ever. I was actually going to include a cut from this when I did my BFT. Great choice!

Yeah, I figured a lot of people would have this via the Mosaic set. It's actually only one of two Mosaic sets I own (the other being the Reinhardt set). The mastering is a little dim--it could use an RVG--but anyway it's nice to have all this stuff, even if this album and Of Heaven and Earth are both very uneven. This is one of the standout tracks, of course. If both LPs were put together on a single disc (maybe dropping the vocal tracks if they would push it over 80 minutes) that would make an excellent release, but I guess that the days of plentiful Blue Note reissues are over.

Track 14 - Not sure... reminds me of that Anthony Ortega date with Chuck Domanico, but this guy sounds a little funkier than Anthony. I don't know *who* this is, but I like it a bunch.

Nope, not Ortega--this guy has recorded very little outside of a little sideman work on Latin dates in the 1960s. A Konitz protege, incidentally. You'll have the drummer in your collection, but not the bassist (whose intonation really irks me here, but I didn't put it here for his sake).

Track 15 - I like how this develops, but it takes awhile. This would be very interesting to watch live. Interesting and effective use of electronics, but tough to hear without seeing.

Yep, there's electronics, but some of the more unusual sounds are from the percussion...... If you i.d. the instrumentation it shouldn't be hard to figure out who/what this is.

Thanks for your thoughts!

Edited by Nate Dorward
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It took me longer than I expected to find time to listen to this, so I apologize for the delay in posting further comments.

Disc One:

track 1 - No clue who this is. The track has a very post-Tristano/Konitz/Marsh (to quote the Mosaic set) feel to it, but I don't believe either Tristano or Marsh appears on this track. It swings quite a bit, which is surprising, given how concise and almost austere the playing is. I enjoy this track quite a bit.

track 2 - Interesting opening. The bass brings an almost somber, very contemplative feel to the track that disappears completely before too long. I'm really enjoying this track. Very post-Ornetteish. This sounds like a more restrained Masada, although I'm fairly certain it's not actually Zorn and co. No clue who this is, but I'd love to hear the rest of the album.

track 3 - More post-TKM. Nice playing by all involved, but I'm not really taken by the sound the guitar adds to the ensemble. Nothing against the playing, specifically, more just personal taste. This guitar tone has always come across as very "easy-listening" to me.

track 4 - I'm not sure what to say about this track. It really doesn't come together at all for me. There are moments that work well, but it feels very "collage-y", with disparate parts that don't integrate or flow very well. The guitarist must be Sonny Sharrock. I enjoy much of what he is playing here, but I never get the sense that the players are on the same page.

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track 7 - Derek Bailey solo. This is very melodic and tuneful, compared to most of the Bailey I've heard. Very nice. This could almost be Bailey's history of the guitar. It has elements of swing, ragtime, delta blues mixed together. I'm fairly certain I don't have this, so it's not off of Aida. Based on how "accessible" this is for Bailey solo guitar I'll guess it's from this album. I've wanted to hear this disc for ages, but it appears to be hopelessly out of print.

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Thanks for the comments! Yep, Sharrock's on #4. Anyone nail the particular album? He's a sideman on this date.

The Bailey solo track is off Drop Me Off at 96th on Scatter (recorded in the 1980s, released in the 1990s). The title is "Bunn Fights", which is a reference to Bailey's hero Teddy Bunn (of the Spirits of Rhythm). -- I couldn't follow the link to the allmusic page but I'm guessing you were linking to Ballads or Standards. I have the former, & like it a lot, but I think that Drop Me Off is one of his real masterpieces.

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Drop Me Off is the Bailey disc I was attepting to link to. I'm not sure what happened with my cut and paste job there.

I've never heard it, but it is the one solo album of his that I keep seeing recommended that I've never been able to track down. It seemed like a logical enough guess based on the track.

track 5 – There is something awkward about how the strings fit into this track. The trumpet, piano and drums are nice. Fairly subdued but not boring. I find it fairly jarring whenever the strings drop in. If you told me that they were pre-recorded and added to the track in production I would believe it.

Track 6 – This is a fun track, but nothing is standing out distinctively enough for me to identify anyone. Very much in the Gene Ammons realm. Solid playing all around.

track 8 – The sound quality of the recording makes me think this is from the ‘50’s, but the playing sounds like something more recent. No clue who any of the players are. The pianists solo is interesting. While most of the tune is fairly retro, his playing on the solo is fairly modern.

Track 9 – This one is all over the place, in a good way. Shades of surf music, spy film themes, no wave, country-western, etc…all mixed together in one increasingly frenetic mix. A track like this that sounds improvised and bridges jazz with no wave makes me think of someone like Weasel Walter. No clue who this is, but this one’s a blast. I’d like to hear more from this disc.

Edited by John B
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Drop Me Off is the Bailey disc I was attepting to link to. I'm not sure what happened with my cut and paste job there.

I've never heard it, but it is the one solo album of his that I keep seeing recommended that I've never been able to track down. It seemed like a logical enough guess based on the track.

Yeah, it's a damn shame it's so hard to find. Can make you a copy if you like. I should ask Karen Brookman if the revived Incus might reissue this...... The contemporary Lace is nearly as good but this one has the edge, not least because of the more focussed (shorter) tracks & the dips into "straight" jazz guitar playing.

track 5 – There is something awkward about how the strings fit into this track. The trumpet, piano and drums are nice. Fairly subdued but not boring. I find it fairly jarring whenever the strings drop in. If you told me that they were pre-recorded and added to the track in production I would believe it.

Everyone notices the oddity of the strings.... :) There's a reason for this, but it's not because they're prerecorded. Let's just say I'm waiting for mikeweil's verdict on this track with great interest............. :) -- Someone here should be able to i.d. the pianist, he's a big name.

track 8 – The sound quality of the recording makes me think this is from the ‘50’s, but the playing sounds like something more recent. No clue who any of the players are. The pianists solo is interesting. While most of the tune is fairly retro, his playing on the solo is fairly modern.

Yes, early 1960s, but it's a previously unissued recording sourced from a radio broadcast. The pianist's untimely passing was much-mourned because he was an adventurous thinking who was clearly destined for big things but never recorded much. This is a nice memento.

Track 9 – This one is all over the place, in a good way. Shades of surf music, spy film themes, no wave, country-western, etc…all mixed together in one increasingly frenetic mix. A track like this that sounds improvised and bridges jazz with no wave makes me think of someone like Weasel Walter. No clue who this is, but this one’s a blast. I’d like to hear more from this disc.

A hint: a music-crit friend of mine picked this for his disc of the year for 2008. Glad you liked it! Nope, not Weasel. I should note that these players are all usually associated with the free-improv scene, rather than this kind of music.

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Summary of progress so far (one star for partial i.d., three stars for the fully i.d.'d tracks)

1) Everyone spots the Tristano vibe, no-one's i.d.'d the players though they all know it's not Tristano, Konitz or Marsh. Shouldn't be too hard to figure this out from process of elimination.....

*2) RDK correctly spotted the inimitable Kenny Wheeler, the rest's up for grabs.

***3) relyles got this--Fred Hess's new album.

*4) Thom Keith (2nd guess) and John B (dead-on) figured out who the much-maligned guitarist is here, the late Sonny Sharrock. So, since there aren't a lot of albums in his discography, this shouldn't be too hard to pin down now, right.....?

5) No i.d.s yet

6) Ditto

***7) relyles named Derek Bailey, & John B pinned down the album: Drop Me Off at 96th.

8) A mystery track :)

9) ditto

10) ditto

11) ditto--this is a nice patch of obscurity :)

12) ditto

*

Bonus disc:

***1) Half the posters spotted this one (well, I didn't put it on in expectations it would be that obscure... maybe in some circles, but not on a board full of organ fans & Mosaic collectors!): Larry Young, Contrasts, "Tender Feelings" by the elusive Tyrone Washington.

2) This one will defeat people, I think. I'll give a big hint & say that I included it largely because I was in my teens & present for the concert, one of the first formal jazz concerts I attended in fact. Put that together with some basic biographical facts & you can nail this. The only player anyone will know here is the drummer.

3) Ah, the BIG ONE......... No one's got close to this one yet! Tips (recapped from above): a. the bassist is present elsewhere on this BFT; b. one of the players (at least, maybe more?) is Welsh; c. the instrumentation is more or less unique so you can i.d. this easily from that & a little Google creativity, I think.

Happy hunting!

Edited by Nate Dorward
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Track 10 – Out of all the tracks so far I’ve given this one the most listens trying to figure out who this is. A very cinematic and contemporary classical feel to start, but the track soon moves into more of a free improve thing. I feel like I should know who this is, but I’m not really sure. If I had to hazard a guess I’d say this comes from the mar Erik Friedlander / Mark Feldman / Marc Ribot downtown crew, but that would just be a guess. I like this one quite a bit.

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Track 11 – Deeply in debt to Bird. Nice high-energy big band arrangement that almost feels like a small combo track. This sounds fairly modern, but I don’t have any clue who these players are. Very nice track.

Track 12 – I like this one quite a bit. Fairly martial percussion to start, then some fairly rock-ish moments. Kind of a Hamid Drake vibe, but this has less groove than I would expect from him. I’m hearing two percussionists, so I guess one could be Hamid. No clue who the unison horns are supporting the lead alto. The alto sounds very familiar. He has some of that Broztmann post-Ayler thing going on, but there is also some nice, subtle playing here. Another one that is driving me crazy as I’m sure I know who these players are.

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OK, here we go - sorry for being late, but life got in the way!

1. My first thought was that this was reminiscent of Lennie Tristano, then I thought it might be Jimmy Knepper from his rare Debut EP, reissued on the Mingus Debut box. Just now it occurred to me – this is the Ronnie Ball quintet on Savoy – Willie Dennis (trombone), Ted Brown (tenor), Ball (piano), Kenny Clarke (drums). Lovely!

2. The alto on the left has absorbed early Ornette quite well, don’t know who anyone else is. My guess is that this was recorded within the last 20-25 years. I found the composition not too interesting, but some of the players were.

3. Avant-cool! I liked this, don’t have a clue who’s playing here. I suspect that this is of recent vintage.

4. I was willing to hang in until the guitar took off. Next!

5. A nice trumpet player, but the tune really didn’t grab me. Is that a string quartet?

6. Here we have a familiar sound, never rises above the familiar for my tastes. Could be Joey DeFrancesco or Mel Rhyne, might the guitar be Peter Bernstein?

7. Drivel. Loren Mazzacane?

8. “Crazy Rhythm” – a vintage side, probably from the early 50’s. Bad rechanneled fake stereo. Something tells me this is a European group – don’t know why. I liked the tenor player, trombone is a valve instrument, maybe a mellophone or euphonium? Pianist has a few interesting ideas.

9. This does nothing for me.

10. Not a clue here, doesn’t speak to me.

11. A nice crisp modern big band, well played, but the chart is all too familiar. Good soloists. Nice trumpet, Gene Quill on alto? Bill Watrous on trombone? Not too thrilled with the tenor player.

12. Couldn’t find much to latch onto here.

Bonus disc

1. We seem to be in Larry Young territory here. I liked this track, but really haven’t a clue who this is. Don’t care for the tenor too much - Tyrone Washington?

2. For reason I want to say Lee Konitz, although I can’t find any aural evidence that it’s him! The tune is “There Is No Greater Love”. Good bass player, a nice performance all around.

3. During my first runthrough I got pretty impatient with this, waiting for something to happen, asking myself why Nate would include this lengthy meandering track. Around the half hour mark, the bari solo begins, and from here on I was taken in. This is a fine and moving solo, even though I had to wait through a lot to get to it!

Thanks, Nate!

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1. My first thought was that this was reminiscent of Lennie Tristano, then I thought it might be Jimmy Knepper from his rare Debut EP, reissued on the Mingus Debut box. Just now it occurred to me – this is the Ronnie Ball quintet on Savoy – Willie Dennis (trombone), Ted Brown (tenor), Ball (piano), Kenny Clarke (drums). Lovely!

Yes, that's the album. It's an undeservedly obscure outing that is a rare example of Willie Dennis's solo work, among other things. At one point there were about 10 jillion cutout copies of this available in the bins at Sam the Record Man's, & I bought a stack of them to give to friends--unfortunately, they're all gone now, as is Sam's.

2. The alto on the left has absorbed early Ornette quite well, don’t know who anyone else is. My guess is that this was recorded within the last 20-25 years. I found the composition not too interesting, but some of the players were.

Haven't got the album here (writing from work) to doublecheck the solo order, but, anyway, yes, Ornette's a big influence on the altoist in question (& indeed the album is in some ways a response to Ornette's music). The other alto player is best known for more mainstream work, including non-jazz studio work.

5. A nice trumpet player, but the tune really didn’t grab me. Is that a string quartet?

Yep, strings, but you're right to think there's something unusual about them.......

6. Here we have a familiar sound, never rises above the familiar for my tastes. Could be Joey DeFrancesco or Mel Rhyne, might the guitar be Peter Bernstein?

These are all fairly uncelebrated, "local" players.

8. “Crazy Rhythm” – a vintage side, probably from the early 50’s. Bad rechanneled fake stereo. Something tells me this is a European group – don’t know why. I liked the tenor player, trombone is a valve instrument, maybe a mellophone or euphonium? Pianist has a few interesting ideas.

You are right to think this is not American, though it's not European either. It's early 1960s, a tape from a radio broadcast that was recently discovered & released on CD. The pianist is the main reason I included this. The saxophonist later made a name for himself in more of a retro swing style rather than the Getzian idiom here.

11. A nice crisp modern big band, well played, but the chart is all too familiar. Good soloists. Nice trumpet, Gene Quill on alto? Bill Watrous on trombone? Not too thrilled with the tenor player.

No, neither player's here. The trumpeter is the leader, a veteran of big bands from over the years.

1. We seem to be in Larry Young territory here. I liked this track, but really haven’t a clue who this is. Don’t care for the tenor too much - Tyrone Washington?

Yep, you've got this one.

2. For reason I want to say Lee Konitz, although I can’t find any aural evidence that it’s him! The tune is “There Is No Greater Love”. Good bass player, a nice performance all around.

The alto player was a student of Lee's in the 1960s.

3. During my first runthrough I got pretty impatient with this, waiting for something to happen, asking myself why Nate would include this lengthy meandering track. Around the half hour mark, the bari solo begins, and from here on I was taken in. This is a fine and moving solo, even though I had to wait through a lot to get to it!

:) something for everyone in this track......

Thanks, Nate!

Thanks for your thoughtful comments!

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Late to the party, but you know how life is sometimes...

TRACK ONE - Ronnie Ball, I believe, with Ted Brown & Willie Dennis. Good stuff.

TRACK TWO - Not sure. I'm engaged more than compelled, which is more than most things do, so hey. Sounds like these guys all have other "ways of playing" & that this is a "growth exercise" of sorts for them rather than how they play by gut. That's cool.

TRACK THREE - Funny how the Tristano influence keeps hanging on & becoming more abstract. Those who dismissed him back in the day, boy, wouldn't they be surprised! Sounds recent. Very plotted out, and to good effect in one sense, less so in another, in that I get no sense of anybody other than the composition, which might well be the point. Not sure if this is "relevant to my lifestyle" or anything, but everybody sounds like they mena it, so all's well.

TRACK FOUR - 80s? 90s? 2000s? We had a couple of things in this basic vein in Quartet Out, vampish, and...I got played out on it. I "hear the math" before I do the music, which is not the fault of these guys at all. So kinda like they used to do on To Tell The Truth, I must disqualify myself from the proceedings. But I will say this - there gets to be a quality of... specific masculinity in these type things that is not really good for anybody over the long haul.

TRACK FIVE - Now, this is charming! A little "light" over the long haul, but not defectively so. In a better world, this bunch could take it out on the road and get it a little looser. But this ain't a better world, so this will just have to do, eh?

TRACK SIX - Sounds like either a really old guy who's still at it in his last years, or else a younger "out-ish" guy who's right on the verge of getting his/her changes together. No real opinion here. People do what they do for whatever reasons they do it, and that's how it should be.

TRACK SEVEN - I must confess, I've never really checked out Derek Bailey, but this is what I've always suspected he sounded like. Sounds like he's having fun, and it's a little contagious, that fun is!

TRACK EIGHT - "Crazy Rhythm", by one of those old school badass motherfuckers who could just wail on anything. Jug, Tom Archea, Eddie Chamblee, cats like that. Trombonist is kinda...working on it. Pianist is kinda showing off ain't he? Like he's more advanced than everybody else. He plays one of the trombonist's licks back at him, that "Parisian Thoroughfare" thing. And he is more advanced. But advanced and better ain't the same thing, so him & the tenor player are totally peers in my estimation, at least at this time and in this place, which was when, half a century ago?

TRACK NINE - Repeated listening find me either getting all the way into this or else just not giving a shit at all. Depends on how I'm feeling at the time. Either way, "self-indulgent" is the phrase that keeps coming to mind. Which is not necessarily a bad thing, mind you. But...

TRACK TEN - Rightly or wrongly, this simultaneously reminds me of the 80s and Abbey Road. The latter, I still dig, the former less so. So you can see my quandary.

TRACK ELEVEN - A wild stab here - Bobby Shew? Lanny Morgan? Highly competent all the way around, the chart is kinda Boss Brass-ish, which is not really my bag, but I've played a lot of those charts, and they do require some panache. Pete Christlieb? I'm definitely feeling West Coast/studio players here, guys who can all play one thing and make a living playings anything. Nivce work if you can get it! Truthfully, in my younger, more ideologically-driven days, I would have hated this. Now I respect the hell out of it, and even kinda like it. You just don't get to this point of competency without paying some dues. And if the dues you pay to get here are not the dues that others have chosen to pay to get someplace else, oh well.

TRACK TWELVE - Oh geez, I know that alto player. Or else I know who he's copping from. These days.... Very late-60s/early 70s-ish, and if it's retro, they've kept the spirit and not just the excution, so good for them.

BONUS DISC

TRACK THIRTEEN - Oh HELL yeah! Larry, from CONTRASTS. UN-mistakeable! godDAMN this is the shit right here! Not in "style", but in spirit. Tyrone's tune, "Tender Feelings". This is what playing live over time in the context of a real, all-purpose, uncontrived scene will get you. If I said to accept no substitutes, I would be being cruel and unreasonable. Things have changed and irrevocably.

Nevertheless...

TRACK FOURTEEN - For some reason, this player reminds me of Frank Strozier, particularly his features with Oliver Nelson & Don Ellis. At least on the a cappella intro. Less so as it goes on. Veteran playing all the way around. Probably too long, but oh well. Anybody who checks out something like this in the first place probably ain't gonna be too upset by that anyways.

TRACK FIFTEEN - Oh, ok. HARDCORE! :g Let's hear it for the true BELIEVERS! Seriously!

Hey Nate, that was fun. Sorry I took so long to get in, but even for this, I had to put aside some things that "others" were insisting I do. You know how that goes...

But for real - a nice collection. Enjoyed it.

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Hey Jim--thanks for the comments! All very interesting, & some spot-on....

TRACK TWO - Not sure. I'm engaged more than compelled, which is more than most things do, so hey. Sounds like these guys all have other "ways of playing" & that this is a "growth exercise" of sorts for them rather than how they play by gut. That's cool.

You're right that these are all guys who can/could swing both ways, as it were. Kenny Wheeler on trumpet, as someone noted above, & his presence should help i.d. the rest of the players.... I guess for some of them this is a growth exercise, in that since the period of the recording (1970s) some have gone on to "mainstream" themselves; in fact neither alto player does a lot of free playing any more.

TRACK THREE - Funny how the Tristano influence keeps hanging on & becoming more abstract. Those who dismissed him back in the day, boy, wouldn't they be surprised! Sounds recent. Very plotted out, and to good effect in one sense, less so in another, in that I get no sense of anybody other than the composition, which might well be the point. Not sure if this is "relevant to my lifestyle" or anything, but everybody sounds like they mena it, so all's well.

relyles spotted this earlier--it's Fred Hess's most recent disc. He's never said anything explicitly about a Cool School influence, but I find it hard not to think he's done a lot of listening to Marsh in particular. The short, tight arrangement & brisk round of solos was intended, he says in the liners, to be a tribute to Shorty Rogers' charts.

TRACK FOUR - 80s? 90s? 2000s? We had a couple of things in this basic vein in Quartet Out, vampish, and...I got played out on it. I "hear the math" before I do the music, which is not the fault of these guys at all. So kinda like they used to do on To Tell The Truth, I must disqualify myself from the proceedings. But I will say this - there gets to be a quality of... specific masculinity in these type things that is not really good for anybody over the long haul.

Mid-1980s. Yeah, I'm somewhat ambivalent about this kind of music, but, hey, I found myself enjoying this more than I thought I would the most recent time I pulled it out for a listen, & it's certainly got rarity value, so I thought, hey, let's put it on the BFT...... :) -- You have any clues to the saxes? I was wondering what your thoughts were on the tenor in particular (who's spoken of respectfully in these parts from time to time).

TRACK SIX - Sounds like either a really old guy who's still at it in his last years, or else a younger "out-ish" guy who's right on the verge of getting his/her changes together. No real opinion here. People do what they do for whatever reasons they do it, and that's how it should be.

It's an oldster on the sax, I think the rest are all young guys.

TRACK SEVEN - I must confess, I've never really checked out Derek Bailey, but this is what I've always suspected he sounded like. Sounds like he's having fun, and it's a little contagious, that fun is!

Yep, it's Derek, paying tribute to his hero Teddy Bunn. He doesn't usually reference jazz so explicitly. Aside from the bursts of chording, one reason I like this particular album is that you can actually hear an implied time-feel in a lot of the tracks--you can actually tap along to long stretches of it.

TRACK EIGHT - "Crazy Rhythm", by one of those old school badass motherfuckers who could just wail on anything. Jug, Tom Archea, Eddie Chamblee, cats like that. Trombonist is kinda...working on it. Pianist is kinda showing off ain't he? Like he's more advanced than everybody else. He plays one of the trombonist's licks back at him, that "Parisian Thoroughfare" thing. And he is more advanced. But advanced and better ain't the same thing, so him & the tenor player are totally peers in my estimation, at least at this time and in this place, which was when, half a century ago?

Like another track here (Bonus #2) this is included partly because I actually saw the saxophonist in concert (though of course not this particular performance, which was way before I was born). Not a big name, though I think he recorded a disc or two for Concord near the end of his career. The pianist took his life a year or two after this recording was made, & remains something of a "what-if?...." A shame.

to be continued....

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TRACK ELEVEN - A wild stab here - Bobby Shew? Lanny Morgan? Highly competent all the way around, the chart is kinda Boss Brass-ish, which is not really my bag, but I've played a lot of those charts, and they do require some panache. Pete Christlieb? I'm definitely feeling West Coast/studio players here, guys who can all play one thing and make a living playings anything. Nivce work if you can get it! Truthfully, in my younger, more ideologically-driven days, I would have hated this. Now I respect the hell out of it, and even kinda like it. You just don't get to this point of competency without paying some dues. And if the dues you pay to get here are not the dues that others have chosen to pay to get someplace else, oh well.

You're right to hear the west coast vibe here, & yes that's Lanny Morgan--there's a particular Birdish lick he tends to play every 8-16 bars that gives him away! Shew is in the band but isn't the trumpet soloist. Not Christlieb. I included this in part just because I really like listening to these kind of dazzling workmanlike players who really feel the music. I was reviewing this album at the same time that Dave Holland's first big band album was getting a lot of press & I was thinking how the Holland album sounded like it was the work of players who really had very little big band experience mostly & how much it sounded like that. & while, yeah, the chart's not anything that speaks to me, I still like the panache with which it's delivered, especially the trumpet solo.

TRACK TWELVE - Oh geez, I know that alto player. Or else I know who he's copping from. These days.... Very late-60s/early 70s-ish, and if it's retro, they've kept the spirit and not just the excution, so good for them.

Definitely not a player you know, so I guess he's just got good taste! :)

TRACK THIRTEEN - Oh HELL yeah! Larry, from CONTRASTS. UN-mistakeable! godDAMN this is the shit right here! Not in "style", but in spirit. Tyrone's tune, "Tender Feelings". This is what playing live over time in the context of a real, all-purpose, uncontrived scene will get you. If I said to accept no substitutes, I would be being cruel and unreasonable. Things have changed and irrevocably.

Nevertheless...

Yeah, this is such a great track--it's a shame that Young's work for Blue Note gets so piecemeal after the trios/quartets with Green & Jones. I mean--Unity is such a lonely peak, there ought to have been so much more like it.... & though this album & the other post-Unity albums are kind of uneven & sometimes even lousy (the vocals), it would have been great if Young could have done a lot more with these guys. Reminds me that I really do need to hear Washington's sole leadership album for the label....

Young was a big obsession with me back in the 1990s (it was a period I was trying to make a go of it playing piano, & my main listening at the time was Young's "Monk's Dream" and Pepper's Meets the Rhythm Section and Intensity). The Young was the first & for a long time only Mosaic set I owned, because NOTHING of his was in print beyond that pathetic one-CD compilation.

TRACK FOURTEEN - For some reason, this player reminds me of Frank Strozier, particularly his features with Oliver Nelson & Don Ellis. At least on the a cappella intro. Less so as it goes on. Veteran playing all the way around. Probably too long, but oh well. Anybody who checks out something like this in the first place probably ain't gonna be too upset by that anyways.

Yep, all veterans, playing very much on-the-hoof. (Not Mover, though.) It's a bit messy & everything, but there's just so little on disc of the alto player that this will have to do..... He spent time in the 1960s NY scene but ended up teaching in a real musical backwater. & then just as he was thinking of getting back into a more productive musical scene, he was hurt in an accident & his embouchure was wrecked. He's been struggling to recover since--I haven't heard him for a few years, but hope he's on the road to recovery. This date is from the early 1990s, & I was present for the concert.

TRACK FIFTEEN - Oh, ok. HARDCORE! :g Let's hear it for the true BELIEVERS! Seriously!

Yeah, judging from the responses I don't think there were too many true believers on this one! :) But really, I wasn't expecting a high like/hate ratio with any of this stuff--some of it's music that means something to me for a variety of reasons but might not to others. Really, it's nice if anyone gets something out of just two or three tracks....

Hey Nate, that was fun. Sorry I took so long to get in, but even for this, I had to put aside some things that "others" were insisting I do. You know how that goes...

But for real - a nice collection. Enjoyed it.

Great--always a pleasure to hear people riffing on the music....

Edited by Nate Dorward
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TRACK FOUR - 80s? 90s? 2000s? We had a couple of things in this basic vein in Quartet Out, vampish, and...I got played out on it. I "hear the math" before I do the music, which is not the fault of these guys at all. So kinda like they used to do on To Tell The Truth, I must disqualify myself from the proceedings. But I will say this - there gets to be a quality of... specific masculinity in these type things that is not really good for anybody over the long haul.

Mid-1980s. Yeah, I'm somewhat ambivalent about this kind of music, but, hey, I found myself enjoying this more than I thought I would the most recent time I pulled it out for a listen, & it's certainly got rarity value, so I thought, hey, let's put it on the BFT...... :) -- You have any clues to the saxes? I was wondering what your thoughts were on the tenor in particular (who's spoken of respectfully in these parts from time to time).

Starts out very Wayne-ish, and goes from there. Good use of space too.

Is this a Laswell thing?Sounds like him, but...not Last Exit, surely?

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TRACK EIGHT - "Crazy Rhythm", by one of those old school badass motherfuckers who could just wail on anything. Jug, Tom Archea, Eddie Chamblee, cats like that. Trombonist is kinda...working on it. Pianist is kinda showing off ain't he? Like he's more advanced than everybody else. He plays one of the trombonist's licks back at him, that "Parisian Thoroughfare" thing. And he is more advanced. But advanced and better ain't the same thing, so him & the tenor player are totally peers in my estimation, at least at this time and in this place, which was when, half a century ago?

Like another track here (Bonus #2) this is included partly because I actually saw the saxophonist in concert (though of course not this particular performance, which was way before I was born). Not a big name, though I think he recorded a disc or two for Concord near the end of his career. The pianist took his life a year or two after this recording was made, & remains something of a "what-if?...." A shame.

to be continued....

Fraser MacPherson?

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TRACK ELEVEN - A wild stab here - Bobby Shew? Lanny Morgan? Highly competent all the way around, the chart is kinda Boss Brass-ish, which is not really my bag, but I've played a lot of those charts, and they do require some panache. Pete Christlieb? I'm definitely feeling West Coast/studio players here, guys who can all play one thing and make a living playings anything. Nivce work if you can get it! Truthfully, in my younger, more ideologically-driven days, I would have hated this. Now I respect the hell out of it, and even kinda like it. You just don't get to this point of competency without paying some dues. And if the dues you pay to get here are not the dues that others have chosen to pay to get someplace else, oh well.

You're right to hear the west coast vibe here, & yes that's Lanny Morgan--there's a particular Birdish lick he tends to play every 8-16 bars that gives him away! Shew is in the band but isn't the trumpet soloist. Not Christlieb. I included this in part just because I really like listening to these kind of dazzling workmanlike players who really feel the music. I was reviewing this album at the same time that Dave Holland's first big band album was getting a lot of press & I was thinking how the Holland album sounded like it was the work of players who really had very little big band experience mostly & how much it sounded like that. & while, yeah, the chart's not anything that speaks to me, I still like the panache with which it's delivered, especially the trumpet solo.

I've had the same reaction to a lot of big-band albums made of all/mostly soloists. There's a reason there's parts, and there's a reason people who play them well had a valued place in a time when most music had parts. Sure, the feel comes first, if you have to choose, but if you do have to choose, you should be asking youself why.

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TRACK EIGHT - "Crazy Rhythm", by one of those old school badass motherfuckers who could just wail on anything. Jug, Tom Archea, Eddie Chamblee, cats like that. Trombonist is kinda...working on it. Pianist is kinda showing off ain't he? Like he's more advanced than everybody else. He plays one of the trombonist's licks back at him, that "Parisian Thoroughfare" thing. And he is more advanced. But advanced and better ain't the same thing, so him & the tenor player are totally peers in my estimation, at least at this time and in this place, which was when, half a century ago?

Like another track here (Bonus #2) this is included partly because I actually saw the saxophonist in concert (though of course not this particular performance, which was way before I was born). Not a big name, though I think he recorded a disc or two for Concord near the end of his career. The pianist took his life a year or two after this recording was made, & remains something of a "what-if?...." A shame.

to be continued....

Fraser MacPherson?

Yes, that's him. It's an all-Canadian group, in fact.

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TRACK FOUR - 80s? 90s? 2000s? We had a couple of things in this basic vein in Quartet Out, vampish, and...I got played out on it. I "hear the math" before I do the music, which is not the fault of these guys at all. So kinda like they used to do on To Tell The Truth, I must disqualify myself from the proceedings. But I will say this - there gets to be a quality of... specific masculinity in these type things that is not really good for anybody over the long haul.

Mid-1980s. Yeah, I'm somewhat ambivalent about this kind of music, but, hey, I found myself enjoying this more than I thought I would the most recent time I pulled it out for a listen, & it's certainly got rarity value, so I thought, hey, let's put it on the BFT...... :) -- You have any clues to the saxes? I was wondering what your thoughts were on the tenor in particular (who's spoken of respectfully in these parts from time to time).

Starts out very Wayne-ish, and goes from there. Good use of space too.

Is this a Laswell thing?Sounds like him, but...not Last Exit, surely?

Not Laswell, but it's indeed Sharrock on the guitar.

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