Larry Kart

Well, yes, but I still say that if a friend of yours came up to you with his hair dyed green and a nail stuck through his tongue, your first reaction would not be to judge those choices on aesthetic grounds and maybe cut him some slack because he's your friend but to wonder what the heck was going on here (unless that's how your friend looks normally). Play Wynton's "Cherokee" and tell me that it's Booker Little or Lee Morgan, and I'm thinking, "What happened [to them]?" I'd feel the same if you picked, say, a really good Bobby Hackett solo and told me that the player was Little or Morgan -- "What happened?" Your friends are your friends in part because you know who they are.

No doubt it depends on how honestly the person on the receiving end listens to music, but as several of us have said on this thread, the simple, honest answer (and we do tend to be honest about our musical tastes; otherwise, why bother to spend time at a place like this?) is: "Yes, it would receive the same criticism." Do you not believe us? Also, your question omits the fairly obvious factor that would render your implicit false labeling test an impossible-to-mount abstraction. If one were told that any number of trumpet players one admires were playing this solo, the first and probably the only question that would arise would be: "Why the heck does so-and-so sound like this? He never did before."

Just picked up a copy of "I Had The Craziest Dream," which I believe is OOP. Interesting to me but definitely a taste that many here may nnever acquire. What Jim said about those charts is certainly audible -- lots of patting your head while rubbing your stomach stuff going on inside. The sometime air of external blandness was to some degree .. external. And of course there was Don Fagerquist, a lovely player, and on some of this album, the late Bob Gordon. Part of all this is that these charts were crafted for three-minute-or-so performances; a lot of activity per unit of time. The sound is different, but think of John Kirby perhaps. In fact, Pell in his later days did do a Kirby tribute album, though I'm note sure if that dates from the time when he was cranking out tribute albums almost indiscriminately.

There are laws against that kind of thing.

No, I didn't notice that it was Wynton doing the intro, but back in 1981-2, he either had no particular reaction or a very guarded one when I played that Shavers track for him -- again, probably, because he thought the blindfold test aspect of it meant that I was trying to trick him in some way. I just thought he might dig the music and recognize a somewhat kindred soul in Shavers, and I didn't want to put Shavers' name out there before I played the track in case that might shape Wynton's response. In any case, the days of Wynton's impishness have been pretty much gone since the mid-1980s IMO; royal role models don't behave/can't afford to behave that way. To answer your original question: If I heard that music coming out of Lester Bowie's horn, I'd be astonished and dismayed and wonder what was the matter. Back in 1982 Wynton may not have even been 21. There are a lot of precocious 21-year-old players who are completely unfamiliar with Shavers and Wynton may have been no exception. On top of this I think it's not unlikely that Wynton at the time was doing the vast majority of his trumpet listening to: Miles, Booker Little, Freddie Hubbard, and Dizzy - the pre-bebop thing didn't come until later. So I'm not too surprised that he was weirded out by the Shavers thing. He wasn't weirded out by the music as far as I could tell, not at all, but was put on edge by the social situation as he saw it, as I tried to explain above. That is, I think he thought that by playing something and not telling him who it was first, I was trying to trick him in some way -- getting him to say that he liked someone he "shouldn't" like or vice versa or just trying to stump him. That wasn't my intent (see above), but I can see where he might have been wary/guarded. I should add that this turn of events came as a bit of surprise because up to that point the encounter/interview had been very relaxed on both sides.

Maybe in Riley's mind the cameras are running all the time, especially the one that feeds back to Wynton.

And what's with all that mugging by the drummer? Sure, some guys' faces respond to what other guys are playing, but this looked kinda corny to me.

What's not to like about Charlie Barnet's great-grandaughter?

Ruby Braff?? Wynton sounds more like Rafael Mendez before his morning prune juice has had time to take effect.

No, I didn't notice that it was Wynton doing the intro, but back in 1981-2, he either had no particular reaction or a very guarded one when I played that Shavers track for him -- again, probably, because he thought the blindfold test aspect of it meant that I was trying to trick him in some way. I just thought he might dig the music and recognize a somewhat kindred soul in Shavers, and I didn't want to put Shavers' name out there before I played the track in case that might shape Wynton's response. In any case, the days of Wynton's impishness have been pretty much gone since the mid-1980s IMO; royal role models don't behave/can't afford to behave that way. To answer your original question: If I heard that music coming out of Lester Bowie's horn, I'd be astonished and dismayed and wonder what was the matter.

From the very first, I've thought that Wynton's secret musical soulmate was Charlie Shavers -- that is, that the kind of musician that Wynton was at heart (and at best) before he tied himself up in knots of pseudo-nobility was akin to Shavers' impish/playful temperament. In fact, I once played a Shavers' solo for the young Wynton (the title track from Shavers' great album with Coleman Hawkins, "Hawk Eyes") to see what he would make of it, but Wynton was understandably skittish, as though I were trying to trick him in some manner, and had little to say. In any case, Shavers IMO could play rings around the (to my taste, quite static) Wynton of that "Cherokee" clip, as this clip of Shavers, in good form with Buck Clayton, may demonstrate: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9j5y84t0X4 More startling Shavers' solos are to be found (e.g. "Hawk Eyes"), but not on video ASFAIK.

Some info on Lou Mecca (1927-2003): http://www.guitarsite.com/newsletters/021118/3.shtml http://classicjazzguitar.com/artists/artis...e.jsp?artist=40 http://classicjazzguitar.com/albums/artist...m.jsp?album=640 Be sure to check out the last link, which has a decent-sized clip from his solo on "Bernie's Tune" from his Blue Note album.

Melle had great taste in guitarists -- Tal Farlow, Cinderella, and Louis Mecca, the latter two little known other than for their work with Melle. In fact, Melle needed such guitarists; his writing for them in his piano-less groups being quite novel and demanding, though perhaps Cinderella and Mecca brought some of their own ideas into play there.

Just the words, apparently. When was the first jazz recording of Willow? The earliest I've heard is by Boots and His Buddys from 1937. Did Art Tatum do it before then? That must be Greta Keller, not "Grace Keller": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoVmvL9LxYQ http://www.amazon.com/Remember-Me-Other-In...s/dp/B000EBGFQ8 http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Greta-Keller

Oh, that's a good one!

It's important IMO to keep stuff like that straight. It's not always the end of things, but some dumb things get said and thought that are based on mis-information at that level.

Similar in spots, notably the bridge, but not a direct contrafact by any means. "Inspired by" is about as close as I'd go. Thanks for the correction. I was "inspired by" that similarity.

Sinatra's on "Only the Lonely." Maybe the best thing he ever did, though clearly there's a lot of competition. The way he colors and links together the song's vowel sounds is uncannily poetic -- in effect, he uncovers a deeper song beneath the one Ronnell wrote, and the one she wrote was already pretty deep. Also, though I'd have to listen again to be sure, I think Sinatra's only means there are timbre coupled to insight; I have no memory of him changing the rhythmic value of a single note. For some reason, when I hear that track, I think of Lester Young listening to it -- not that I know he did, but... And now that I think it, my favorite Pres solo from his time with Basie is on "Taxi War Dance," and that tune is on "Willow Weep for Me" changes, which is nutty because Pres famously launches that solo with a quote from "Ol' Man River."

The pianist on "Everything I've Got" was Ehud Asherie, from his recent trio album "Swing Set" (Pentatone). The transition from Ayler to that rather genial track was jarring, though I'd liked the Asherie outside of that context.

I don't think that's the one, because "Luminescence Live" is a quartet recording and this one is a duo. Didn't see a title at the time, but I have a copy at home, still packed way though, I think, so it may take me a while to check. It was issued in an edition of 100 or so copies and has a beautiful handmade cover.

I see you were listening.

Nope -- just Chuck wondering why I picked a Walt Weiskopf record. There was one limp transition, after an Ayler recording, but what can follow Ayler? Otherwise, it was fun, at least in the studio.

BTW, that Zoot Sims' alto solo I extolled on John Benson Brooks' "Folk Jazz USA" was on "Turtledove," not "Saro Jane." His "Black Is the Color of My True Love's Hair" on that album is also very nice.

Yes , keyboard duties in that band were handled by Ray Santisi . Thanks. Very curious to hear this Pomeroy session... Don't have the album anymore (one of those that mysteriously evaporated at some point in my life) but recall liking it a good deal. On the other hand, I have no memory of any Byard tenor solos on it (all the tenor solos IIRC were played by ringer Zoot Sims), though there is a fine Byard chart on his piece "Aluminum Baby" (based on you know what). Also no longer have (for the same mysterious reason) its successor, "Band in Boston," on United Artists, which was also very good, though I do have the CD reissue of the Irene Kral-Pomeroy album "The Band and I."

Warne Marsh's "All Music" and Von Freeman's "Have No Fear." Thanks to Chuck, I was present for parts of both of them, though he'll never forgive me for talking to someone down the hall while Warne was recording a take.