JSngry

As well as intuitive/evironmental/etc factors like accent, dialect, enunciation, "coded" tones to express certain emotions, stressing of certain syllables, etc. There's a lot more that goes into a speaking voice than just the mechanics. There's the use to which it's put in any given situation, and that use can/does affect the sound of what is being spoken. It's here that environmental and personality bear on the physical parameters, perhaps even pushing them to their limits. Rare is the person who speaks in one "tone" to convey all ideas, and rare (until relatively recent) is the jazz musician who does that with their instrument.

The motion has then been seconded! Of the two, I'll give the nod to Absolute Quintet. The less "traditional" (relatively) lineup & compositional material, along with a cameo by Henry Threadgill & the wider color pallate engendered by th keyboards (including organ), keep me listening closer for longer. But they're both most interesting releases, and Prieto is some sort of a special freak. Rat Own!

A sound is a voice, somple as that. The same things that give you your speaking/singinging/cursing/cumming/etc voices are the same things that give you an instrumental voice. Only the mechanaical implements are different.

http://ssl.adhost.com/jazzloft/baskets/newsteep.cfm The email sez:

Especially if the cab driver's a jazz fan...

Yep. (Free For All - Freddie) + Lee/(Reggie Workman-Jymie Merritt). I still think that FFA's overall "favored" status over Indestructable is a residual function of the latter having been OOP as an LP for may years while FFA stayed in print. Otherwise, hey, they're both topshelfstellardefinitive classics, but if I could only have one, it would be my orange and black buddy, But having said all that, Wayne on the RTE Olympia sides is Nutz Skwared. Or does that not count?

Dude, you're taking this shit way more personally than is healthy or realistic... What I wonder is this - why does the "high regard" of the "white community" matter so much to you? Are you "white" first or are you a musician first? Whoever you are first is the community whose "regard" you should be concerned with, and even then only up to a point. What this is all about is far bigger than music. It's about the way that our society (and that of the world when you get right down to it...) has been set up for people to fit into preconceived slots that facilitate an easy ride for all concerned (and if "easy" does not always = "of maximum benefit" to one, some, or all concerned, well hey...). Anytime anybody finds themself rolling around outside those slots, it generates all sorts of "identity crises" for all types of peoples. Some of this is really and truly innocent, grassroots naivete, and some of it's not. There are all kinds of forces at work here... I suggest that you read some Anthony Braxton (Forces In Motion is a good "entry point", even if Braxton's not the author per se). Seriously. Whether or not you can handle his music is besides the point. The guy is by far and away the most perceptive commentator/analyst/whatever on all aspects of the musician/society dynamic I've yet to read. Trust me. There are (at least) two thing you need to know (and should know) if not now, then ASAFP- 1) "Identity" & "usefulness to society" are paths that are very much entwined, and you can best believe that a lot of that is not coincidental. 2) "Whiny White Guy Who Can't Understand Why People Want To Factor In His Race When Evaluating His Playing And Gets Bent Out Of Shape About It" is yet another Music Business Cliche and as such is a way to navigate deeper into the problem, not out of it. "The Powers That Be" just love cliches. It makes their job so much easier... This shit was in place long before we (as in you & I, as in jazz, as in America, as in Western Civilaiztion, as in etc.etc.etc.) got here, and it'll be here long after we (as in you & I, as in jazz, as in America, as in Western Civilaiztion, as in etc.etc.etc.) leave. The best advice I can offer you or anybody else is to understand how/why all this came to be (in the broad sense), how/why it's so easy to perpetuate (including accepting that the stereotypical Jive White Guy With at Best Half A Clue But at Least Some Of The Money is not totally without justification and how that can be exploited by everybody concerned for their own benefit), check yourself as often as needed x 1.25 to see how things in your world are getting played (out or otherwise), accept that life in a world of perpetual attempted manipulation may or may not be better than death in a world without it, but until you're willing to find out for yourself, hey. Proceed accordingly.

Word... I lived in Oakland from 12/85 to 11/89 and though there were many things I loved and miss, there were many things I too don't miss like the congestion, cost of living, earth quakes, and the $40 jazz gigs.. ...And I don't remember EVER paying $40 for a gig at Yoshi's... Dude - he's talking about what the gigs pay, not what they cost.

Oh my!

Well, the downside of that is obvious, but the upside is that many of his ideas/sounds/whatever would have continued to subliminally infiltrate the mainstream's ear, and that the definition what "sounds wierd" to the Average Joe might have gotten stretched just a little. Or not. Like you siad, who knows? But hey, if you're into film scores on their own terms, sheck this one out:

And no way could there be a cover as truly....whatever as this one:

A consistently fine player he's been, actually, quiet as it's kept. His playing could easily be of the "uber-competent studio player for all occasions" variety, and its roots might well be there, but there's always been a little something extra to go along with it, and yeah, that matters. But for the type of people this thread was likely predicated upon, the type who only listen with their eyes and seek confirmation of "authenticity" thereby, dude, he ain't got a chance!

Too bad it wasn't a monster hog.

Getting back to the original thrust of this thread... Lew Soloff vs Branford Marsalis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZjmrb3bjVo&NR=1 The Gil context gives all concerned cachet (and insporation, no doubt) , but left alone, who's going to tell me that, at this moment anyway, a hip young African-American saxophonist from New Orleans is "deeper into the music" than a bald, middle-aged New York Jew? You could argue that age and experience give Soloff an unfair avantage here, but hey - plenty of older and more experienced dumbass fools are still going around making noise that ain't about shit. So give it up for Lew Soloff and let that be that, ok? Examples like this might not abound, but they do exist on a level that is not extremely rare, not by a long shot. So anybody, anybody, who tries to frame the issue as a case of simple either/or, only need to listen/feel with your eyes, is obviously a threat to humanity and should be exterminated as quickly and painlessly as possible. If you ain't got the guts to do ityourself, surely you got $500.00 and a phone. And WOE be unto those who think that something like this means that anybody can do it just by saying that they are. 50% off for that deal, I'm told...

The prelude:

Geez, he was only 43 when he died. Started playing professionally at 15, so that's a 28 year career whose "profile" didn't begin to reacht the main stage until 1959, when he was 27. The man made a helluva lot of music for recorded consumtpion in 16 years, not all of it "essential" by any means, but damn... 43 is "too young" for anybody to die, but hey...it happens, right? Let the record show that Oliver Nelson unambiguously carpe diemed like a mofo, and even if doing so minght have been a part of what killed him (stories abound of his willingness to tackle a superhuman workload and of his ability to complete it, on schedule), oh well. Still, you gotta wonder what he had that he didn't get a chance to get to (literally and metaphorically), as well as if he ever would have slowed down long enough to get to it. No matter - maximum love for Oliver Nelson quite often in reality, and always in principle.

And what could possibly be better? Kenny Burrell, Midnight Blue Grant Green, Idle Moments Hmmm...how late into "late night" are we going here. who are we going there with, and what's on the itenerary? When "Jean De Fleur" comes on, I'm thinking it's either time to call a cab or time to make breakfast...

Was it just me, or did it look for a second like Tony was going to shoot himself through the mouth when he laid down in bed at the end of the episode?

Ok, first of all, I'd ahte to be thought of as Organissimo's "Voice Of House" or anything like that. I don't go clubbing, I'm a 51 year old white male not that far out of the JazzCave (but never in its deepest bowels either...), and I've just been into it for about a year. What I've heard and what I hear is very much from/through/off/whatever the Internet. So asking me for any "real" information is like going to some heavy metal board, finding a guy who's got more than 15 jazz sides and hitting him up like the "resident jazz expert", dig? But my impressions based on what I've seen/heard is this - this is not necessarily a "record store/hardware" driven music. There's umpteen jillion (literally!) DJ mixes, podcasts, etc. available online, and the house industry doesn't seem too bugged by it. I hear a mix or a song or a mix of a that I really dig, go to look to buy it, and at least 80% of the time it's only been available as a 12" that long ago sold out of how many ever copies of it were pressed. And a lot of the really hip mixes are "White Label", which means that they're totally bootleg remixes that somebody did and then circulated amongst fellow DJs, with maybe a few copies leaking out for sale on the street. Can't say that I've seen those for sale on the net, even though some seem to have gotten really popular amongst the cognoscenti. What you can buy w/o too much difficulty is mp3 downloads of individual songs/mixes (this is very much a "singles" market, albums, with the exception of the really top-tier names, are almost alwasy compilations of singles. People with a sense of history will recognize this pattern from god knows hoe many other forms of popular music over the years...). And downloads, of course, can be and are available in damn near every corner of the planet, after which local entrepreneurs can have a blast... As you can see form the links above, house has caught on in South Africa at least. Where else, if anywhere else, in Africa I don't have a clue. But I do know that African/African-based music is no stranger to the dance underground, and I suspect that with the ease of which music is transmitted globally over the net, it's out there elsewhere and that any "breakthrough" into the local marketplaces is due as much to local preferences and/or availability of dance clubs/DJs wanting/needing to play it as it anything. As for the technology, here I really don't know what you really "need". If you got a drum machine to program beats, then all you really need is something to put on top of it, if that. And that can be as little or as much, as local or global, as sampled or as live as it wants/needs/is able to be. Of course you'd need something to record/mix it on, either old-school "studio equipment" or new-school computer tools, but who wouldn't need that? I can also say this - this music is truly "underground" even in places its popular. It's main means of dissemenation and measurement of popularity is in clubs, not radio/tv, its labels are almost all indie/local, and its artists are the producers/djs (yes, contrary to Caveman Dogma, some of these cats have incredibly musical ears and chops), and occasionally some really badass singers like Jocelyn Brown. There ain't no "industry" to it in the MegaMajorLabel Music Machine sense, not at all. So sniping about how it's only for Westerners is not only not fully accurate (I don't think that Japan or South Africa were "Western" last time I looked...), it's pretty naive in its assumptions about where the music "is" in terms of overall "industry status". Not for nothing is it called the "dance underground"...

https://foryourears.com/frames.php?main=lab...amp;sub=grooved

http://www.podcastdirectory.com/podcasts/8360

http://www.nextaid.org/PressReleases/pressrelease-reBOOT.htm

http://www.chico.mweb.co.za/art/2006/2006j...60630-vega.html