JSngry

Everybody's too busy obsessing over Stump Evans, that's why.

Adam Holzman. Played in Miles' later bands. Fine player with an interesting fusion-centric perspective on jazz that only somebody of his generation could have (Miles' fusion was his bebop, musically and spiritually). Served as co-producer of the set along w/Bob Belden.

If by "Topsy" you're using code for "In The Hall Of The Mountain King", then I'll agree with you!

C to F to E to F vs F (to C to E to F) to B to C An E over a dominant C+ is the same as a B over an tonic F7? I'm tempted to say that you shoulda sued your theory teacher, but I respect you too much to do it! And it's that respect that's gonna let me give you a pass on that "last part" business. There's a rough similarity in rhtymic/melodic contour, but a rough similarity is all it is.

And New Mexico looks just like Colorado.

OUCH!

I read that thread you linked to, John, and it is indeed pathetic, including Branford's little fit of cry-baby whining. Branford caught a hurricane-force draft and it hurt his feelings. Boo f-in' hoo. But you srill have a lot to learn. Not the least of which is that you can be mightily coked up on a regular basis and still play your ass off on a regular basis, Believe it. Also, there are many reasons why cats get high, and many of them are perfectly understandable. You already know that, it appears. Good. But what you don't seem to yet know is that choosing to get high carries with it responsibilities and well as risks, and that if and when you fail to deal, it's not completely somebody else's fault. It's not at all unlike choosing to walk a tightrope in a windstorm - you might be the baddest tightrope walker who ever lived, and you may well get across that rope any number of times year after year, often against all odds. But when the wind finally does blow you off, you can't just say that it was all the wind's fault that you fell. Sorry. You know what I'm tired of? Dogma. No matter how reality-based it is, it's the biggest obstacle to human progress around, afaic. And to say that Woody Shaw was completely destroyed because of "the system" is nothing but dogma. I really, really, don't need to be lectured about the frustrations of trying to survive as a creative musician in a hostile environment. You're preaching to the choir, dig? And I really, really, don't need to hear about how Woody overcoming all sorts of obstacles to become the titanic figure that he became is cause for celebration. More preaching to the choir. Nor do I need to hear how "the business" ate away at his psyche. It eats away at all of our psyches, even little local cats like myself. And I really, really, REALLY don't need to hear about how is it any wonder that a cat ends up getting high? No, it ain't no wonder, no even a minor one. But at the very top of the list of things I really, really, REALLY, REALLY don't need to hear is all of the above (and more!) reduced to denial and excuses. It trivializes the reality in ways that I suspect you don't understand. If you did understand, you'd not fall prey to it as readily as you seem to do. You're reducing a very real, PROFOUND human tragedy to the level of Big Evil Destroying A Helpless Black Man. Well get this, and get it right - Woody Shaw was anything but helpless. He was a strong man, and a Strong Black Man at that. But even the strongest of people have flaws. Woody's seemed to have been his erratic personality, which might well have been beyond his control. We now know a helluva lot more about chemical imbalances than we did as recently as 20 years ago, and all the anecdotal evidence I've seen/heard (by no means all of it as pathetic as the Branford bunch's) would point to the very good possibility that Woody had some sort of chemical imbalance. A person with such biochemical tendencies is not at all well-served over the long term by using cocaine (and yes, Woody used cocaine. This I know. Deal with it). The results are eventually and inevitably devastating if the useage doesn't stop. And stopping is always, 100% of the time, a matter of either a person grasping, if only for a second, the horro of what is happening to them, and then deciding, at the most primal level, to make it stop or else dying. There are no other options. That is the reality, and all the dogma in the world won't change that. Nobody with any little bit of sense claims that it's a simple matter of simply "choosing to quit". It's a helluva lot more complicated, a helluva lot harrowing, a helluva lot deeper than that. But the fact reaamins - that is the only way to get out of the trap short of dying. Confronting your darkest and innermost demons isn't enough - you then have to decide to conquer them. And that, my friend, is a motherfucker. Not everybody gets that far, and that is the real tragedy. All the rest of the bullshit is external. This is from within, and doing to yourself what others have tried and failed to do to you is about as dark a tragedy as I can think of. Woody ran out of time, simple as that. Where I see both systemic blame and personal tragedy, you seem to see systemic blame alone. So go ahead and spout all the dogma you like. To the extent that it's useful in waking people up to the reality of what a sick world this is in so many ways, it's useful. Just know that that the stronger you push the Reality Of The General, the more you obfuscate the Final Inevitablity Of The Individual, and that's the reality that ultimately determines whether a cat lives or dies. No way around that. I sincerely hope that the irony of this consequence is not lost on you. There are other "Woody Shaws" among us today, brilliant cats who are letting (yes, LETTING) the system destroy them. We're not talking people who have had a death-wish instilled in them from Day One, with little or no "counter-programming" available. That's another matter entirely. We're talking about people who have seen the light, often in blinding brilliance, yet find it difficult to hold on to it for any number of reasons. You seem to want to offer them excuses/rationalisations/whatevers, a shoulder to cry on. I want to offer them whatever internal fortification it takes to keep their beautiful asses ALIVE, if that proves to be what they really, really want. Sometimes it is, and sometimes it ain't, and I respect either choice. But ultimately, it is going to their choice. But if you choose to live, you gotta stay strong. Afaic, a fruitful survival is the ultimate revenge.

Think there were some other Onyx things had Newman material, iirc.

Now that you mention it, no.

You, sir, have a lot to learn.

All of what you say is true, but the fact remains - Woody off coke would've stood a much better chance of survivng (mentally and physically, but especially mentally) than Woody on coke, which is the Woody that eventually fucked himself up. And no, that's not necessarily true of everybody... Yes, it's a "demon", and no fault is to be found for those unable to conquer their demons. Sometimes, sometimes, the worst enemy lies within. With all the very real enemies without, if you can't conquer the one within, you don't stand a chance. The bastards are out to get you, and any help you can offer them just makes their job that much easier. See if they try and stop you... That's a tough lesson to learn, but if you don't learn it...

Yeah, I, too, have often felt "refreshed" after purging my stomach of all its contents...

La Grange, eh? How CONVINIENT!

Nothing ventured...

Oh, 9-75 then. Time is compressing in my mind, it seems... But I'm pretty sure that there's another interview somewhere (maybe not DB) from somewhat the same time where he talks about the Turner gig. Says he did it for a week or two and just quit. Couldn't handle it. That's what I recall, anyway. And that's nothing to make book on these days...

Gotta part ways here. I rank em late BNs, early Milestones, early BNs. The Milestones are excellent at their best, but like akanalog I get a little ear fatigue. Maybe it's the production. The late BNs seem to have a bit more space. Plus you have both Wayne and Gary in the front line on two of those. Guy ← I think that both Wayne & Gary did much better work elsewhere than they did on those albums. Same w/Woody. Wayne's playing in particular sounds to me like that of a man who just doesn't fit in with the leader's concept, which is no slight to either man, just a recognition that the Wayne Shorter of 1968, and especially the Wayne Shorter of 1970, had a different "agenda" than the of just a few years earlier, when they collaborated exquisitely. Wayne was already fully breaken away from the jazz orthodoxy (well, he was that from the git-go in many ways, but you know what I mean, I hope), whereas McCoy was still looking for that definitive vision, which was still a few years away. Also, I also prefer the Milestone production over the later BNs as well. The later, post-Lion, BN sides get lost in a swath of reverb (at least on the LPs, which is all I have), which does no favor to the playing and composing, which is already a bit on the nebulous side, at least in comparison to Tyner's work before and after. He seems to be searching for a direction that really suits him, and doesn't always find it. The Milestone stuff, especially the earlier things, are fully former, and equally fully "in your face", which to me reflects Tyner's "coming into his own" as player, composer, and bandleader. To be sure, though, that's a matter of personal preference. But as long as we're ranking. let's not overlook the impulse! albums. A mixed batch, to be sure, but Inception and Reaching Fourth still go down well here.

A Tyner interview from the early 70s (post Sahara but pre-1975) in Down Beat, IIRC. '69 sounds about right.

I'd rather contribute towards getting Larry a new computer.

Yeah, besides driving a cab, he took a gig w/Ike & Tina Turner that he could only stand for a few days. Seems unbelievable now but... I agree that the Milestones, especially the earlier ones, are outstanding. I much prefer them to the later BNs, in fact. Sahara really was a "breakthrough". It propelled Tyner from the "cult favorite" that he had been to the icon that he is now. Just like that, it seemed. The fact that he followed it up with a series of brilliant sides certainly didn't hurt, but that one album really, really woke a lot of people up to McCoy Tyner. Of course, as time went by and he was releasing 2-3 albums per year, the overexposure and "sameness" issues came into question (as did a little bit of "lessening" of his working group), and at the time, yeah, that's how it seemed. But today, we have all those albums to choose from at our leisure. Its an embarassment of riches, mostly. McCoy Tyner is one of the greats of jazz, period, and a defining one at that. If his "style" is problematic, it's not his fault.

No, it's just that everybody needs to upgrade occasionally, whether they need to or not. It's our patriotic duty!

Larry needs a new computer!

My fridge is beerless at the moment. But the one on the left is no stranger. It's none too bad for the quick slam, and as a "freebie" on tap at a gig, it's actually nice. The one on the right, however...

At her request, or in an attempt to hide?

With that picture, you never would.

Yeah, but mine's an IMPORT!