JSngry

Dude, can I tape your shows?

Uptown still gets my vote for the Bird/Diz, but yeah, those who did not live in the past are blessed to rehear it!

If I'd known then what I know noe, I'd have bought more than one $1.99 copy out of the Peaches cutout bins... Here's one that will likely never see the light of day again - "A Fresh Viewpoint" and Muriel Winston. "A Fresh Viewpoint" seems to have been a Bill Lee assembly consisting of himself, Clifford Jordan (on flute all the way), Stanley Cowell, & Billy Higgins. Winston's a not particularly grand singer, and there's a children's chorus on a lot of it but the second side is all Tadd Dameron tunes, all but one of which seem to be flat-out pop (as in pre-rock) tunes written in collaboration with one Irving Reid, none of which I'm aware of being recorded elsewhere, although I'd not make book on that. A piece of ephemera, to be sure, but "Dameronia" nonetheless. And two of the girls in the chidren's chorus have the last name Roche. Did Betty have babies?

The Leon Thomas Album has been reissued on vinyl.

The first JATP on Asch, when was that issued?

C'mon Al!

Thanks Allen! A few Real Audio clips of Europe's Society Orchestra can be found here: http://www.redhotjazz.com/eso.html

In a manner of speaking...

Allen - I've not heard but a very few of Europe's Castle Orchestra recordings, just one or two online clips (one of them "The Ragtime Druumer" - or some similar title - with an amazing drum solo). How would you rate their "jazziness" in comparison the the Hellfighters ones (of which I have the Memphis Archives set)? Europe was a fascinating man, from what I've learned about him.

Surrender to the tentacles...

Yes, screaming. Real screaming.

Tina's dad's a cop. She made it home perfectly safe and sound.

I remember her mentioning Harry James. Seriously! If you believe Sonny, she wasn't really a jazz trumpeter until he took her under his wing. How true that really is, I can't say. But she sounds like she wasn't really into heavy improvising before she met Sonny. No mention of Booker Little or anybody like that. I always thought that she captured the spirit of Donald Ayler and played his ideas (figuratively, not literally) the way a "trained" trumpeter would. To me, that speaks to both the brilliance of Donald and to the courage of Barbara. That sound! The material on the Cadence sides, is almost enitely hard bop (you get ample doses of Carter Jefferson, btw). Yet she plays that material the same way she played the free stuff - and she makes the changes perfectly. What an amazing player!

Hey - the tip-jar is an "idea", so we don't even have the right to that!

AFAIC, it is earth-shattering, like the 1960 Paris gig w/Miles, only bumped up another notch or six. I mean, you got motherfuckers in the audience (a NYC audience at that) SCREAMING, it's so intense. Mileages may vary on that, though, I'll admit. For some, it might well be too intense. But imo, this material comes as close to capturing the "ecstasy" that we so often read about in contemporaneous reviews of Trane's live gigs as any recordings that I've heard so far.

No argument here, just a bit of chain-yankin' from somebody who feels your pain. Laughing to keep from crying, as it were...

I agree that Impulse! is not to be commended for its handling of this reissue. But then again, maybe they legitimately (in their minds, anyway) determined that the market would not tolerate a larger issue (the whole of the material easily fits on 2 1/2 CDs, and, as I received it, the third was filled out with a cut from The Penthouse, in Seattle, from 9-30-65 with Pharoah on boord and an intensely different vibe). But - I made a pact with myself (and either god or the devil, never can be too sure about which is which when it come to making pacts and such...) a long time ago that whenever I obtained bootleg material that I really dug, I would buy it if and when it was legitmately released. A deal's a deal, so I'm buying this, as well as the perhaps inevitable Volume 2. But only once, and not necessarily at full retail price. A deal ain't a deal without a loophole or two...

Much love for Lester - deep love - in this house (on this - and every - morning ) as well.

Gotta give you fullest loveprops for that first sentiment, but to the second, I gotta ask - do you play your albums only one time and then throw thew away?

No, I would agree with that. But the guy's, what, 26? That will come, most likely. Until it does, I very much like the youthful energy put to the service of some invigorating (and often irreverant, as a younger person should be, I think) music. Hey - he's got the rest of his life to get old, but he's only gonna be young for a little while.

Management that no doubt renders all their services (which when you come right down to it are nothing but "ideas" put into motion, right?) for free...

Ok, I'm probably one of the bigger Sco fans on this forum, but isn't this a little over the top?? ← No more over the top than that inspiring call to arms ← Although, to be hionest, the "ownership of ideas" is a rather bogus concept. What's not bogus, however, is the ownership of what results from those ideas. Kinda like potential energy vs kinetic. Now, once an idea gets realized, a "product" results, and there's only two ways that product can be distributed - for free or at a cost. If anybody wants to argues that all product should be given away, be my guest, but I gotta go out for a little while. This is Tina, she'll be your sitter for the evening. Don't worry, Daddy will be home before your bedtime. The other alternative (the only sane one, usually) is for there to be an exchange of some sort between consumer and provider. The terms of that are indeed open to both material and philosphical "negotiation" beteeen parties, and I'm certainly no hide-bound traditionalist in that regard. Now in music, sure, nobody "owns" an idea. An idea is an inspiration, and as Ra stated, the inspiration comes from someplace else. But the transformation of the idea into a realization, the change from potential to kinetic, inevitably belongs to somebody. Yeah, Ra's ideas weren't his, but he made one helluva lot of recordings of those ideas, and who owns those (rhetorical question)? Can't tell me that all those recordings just magically appeared one day, or that they were "gifts" to the world. No - the cat sold them! Did he have no right to do so? Of course he did! Did the Arkestra play every gig for free? Of course not! And face it - not every musician has either the ability or the skills to organize successful recording sessions, much less handle the logistics of a tour. So they gotta get somebody else to do it for them. That is a service rendered, and who's gonna pay for that? Surely nobody's gonna make the claim that these services should be rendered with no compensation whatsoever! Again, terms of that exchange are up to the individuals involved, but the point is that, to paraphrase Sam Cookem an exchange is gonna come. I'm repeating myself, but apparently my thoughts are proving "difficult to understand" for some, so let me say it yet again in another way. Unless and until musicians' (hell, every human's) material needs are totally provided for up front (as if...), there will be "product". And as long as there's "product", money will, indeed, must change hands, be it for recordings or concerts or t-shirts or whatever in order for the musician to function at his/her profession w/o having to fall back on "supplemental income". This argument/discussion/tirade/whatever this is ought to be about newer/better/different ways for the musicians to legitimately earn and keep more of that money and how to generate more exchanges of it in the first place (which it could have been until the "utopian" blahblah came into it), not about how they don't deserve any in the first place because nobody "owns" the results of an idea. To the end that taping and trading of shows can be used to facilitate that first set of objectives, I'm all for it, provided that, as with all exchanges, the terms are mutally agreed on and mutaully beneficial. Beyond that, hey, whatever works, dig? Keep it there, and I'm on your side all the way. But when I start hearing simple-minded blather, such as "ideas belong to the universe" (hey - asparagus belongs to the universe too, but unless I find some growing wild on some public land, somebody pays for it in some form or fashion before I eat it) and such in defense of the second proposition, yet again I say - fuck that.

Believe it's been on Japanese CD. I found the LP back in the 70s. Most of the cuts, as well as overall playing time, tend to be short. It's an "interesting" side, good-not-great, and somewhat "commercial (but not disgracefully so). One or two "straight ahead" things thrown in. Worth having if you're a CJ fan (and I am), but not worth paying megabucks for. imo.

Yes, so it seems...

Bands who want to encourage taping and trading as a means to expand their audience base/bond closer with their fans/whatever should be free to do so. Personally, I don't think it's a bad idea at all, and have never said no when asked by an audience memeber if they could tape and exchange a show. So it's certainly not the concept that I have a problem with. What I do have a problem with is the attitude that anybody/everybody who doesn't "play along" is an enemy of the people or some such. That's bullshit, as is the attitude that the very notion of IP rights is malevolent. You can certainly make arguments against (and for) certain implementations of the laws as they currently exist, but to say that the concept itself has no merit is just plain nonsense. What such absolutist thinking promotes is the destruction of balance - balance of power, balance of rights, balance of compensation, every kind of balance, including, perhaps most importantly the balance of mutual respect. Those who want to take part in a mutual attempt to redefine that balance are doing a beautiful thing, I think. On the other hand, those who seek to impose it across the board come hell or high water can go fuck themselves. Tyranny is tyranny, period. There ain't no "one size fits all". Ever.