JSngry Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 A little voice in my head (got to get that taken care of) tells me that the conductor might be Frank Comstock (Hi-Los, R. Clooney TV show, etc.), though I can't find a Comstock photo. I remember a Comstock photo or two from some old Hi-Los albums, and I don't think so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidewinder Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 (edited) Not Riddle. Doesn't look like him at all. Almost looks like Gil. Almost... Was watching that Robert Herridge film of Gil conducting his orchestra last night. Don't think it's him - the guy looks sort of similar but the way he conducts is totally different to Gil (who seems to be very precise/economical with his conducting movements). The high-pitchings of the reeds in the arrangement are sort of Gil-ish though. Edited March 12, 2007 by sidewinder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 Ok, I sent an email to Hanover Music/Corinthian Records asking for conductor info from that show. Maybe somebody remembers. We'll see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 (edited) Hell, it's interesting to know how many great bands existed around that time, during 1950's/60's... today almost forgoten... Meanwhile, we can watch another great organization - Artie Shaw and his band: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLIh6e-U708 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpVgSxsP5V0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luH5DsVsK5U Last one shows us that "Concerto for Clarinet" was not written with fixed clarinet solo (as todays interpreteurs always play it). Great find! Edited March 12, 2007 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 (edited) People, there is no need to do our blindfold tests! Here is one that you can watch and listen with all eyes you have, but just answer one simple question - Who's the electric guitar player on this 1937. Benny Goodman clip (remember it's two years before Christian) - "One O’clock Jump" (2:10-2:25)??? Allan Reuss? But he played acoustic rhythm guitar, right - and this is advanced and surprisingly good electric guitar playing in its early form... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV2kGkpfuS8 I simply can believe my eyes and ears, last passage he plays shows his abilities and quialities buried in one chorus solo time limitation of film clips... And who is the bas player - Artie Bernstein? And who is the piano player - that sounds like it isn't Jess Stacy! Teddy Wilson overdub - listen to that harmonically complex, unusual run at the end of a solo??? Oh, do we know enough about jazz history...? Did we listen enough? Edited March 12, 2007 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 Could that be Dave Barbour? http://www.parabrisas.com/d_barbourd.php Barbour didn't join Goodman until 1942, where he met his wife-to-be Peggy Lee, but he seems to have been West Coast-based in '37, with Lennie Hayton and doing some studio work, and if this clip is from "Hollywood Hotel," Barbour might have stepped in from the soundtrack orchestra for this solo spot. The playing certainly fits in stylistically with other things I've heard from Barbour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fer Urbina Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) People, there is no need to do our blindfold tests! Here is one that you can watch and listen with all eyes you have, but just answer one simple question - Who's the electric guitar player on this 1937. Benny Goodman clip (remember it's two years before Christian) - "One O’clock Jump" (2:10-2:25)??? Allan Reuss? But he played acoustic rhythm guitar, right - and this is advanced and surprisingly good electric guitar playing in its early form... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV2kGkpfuS8 I simply can believe my eyes and ears, last passage he plays shows his abilities and quialities buried in one chorus solo time limitation of film clips... And who is the bas player - Artie Bernstein? And who is the piano player - that sounds like it isn't Jess Stacy! Teddy Wilson overdub - listen to that harmonically complex, unusual run at the end of a solo??? Oh, do we know enough about jazz history...? Did we listen enough? By the look of it, I'd say this clip is wrongly dated. Not 37 (where are Krupa, Vido Musso, Art Rollini, HARRY JAMES...?). Pianist is almost definitely Mel Powell, and whoever is the guitar player, and it could well be Barbour (like Larry said), he's doing an imitation of Charlie Christian. I'd say circa 1942. My two cents. F Edited March 13, 2007 by Fer Urbina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 I agree -- that's almost certainly Mel Powell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fer Urbina Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 I agree -- that's almost certainly Mel Powell. I'd agree. As for the guitarist, after Christian died he was replaced by either Mike Bryan or Tom Morgan. Bryan he isn't (there's a LoC picture by Gottlieb - I think Bryan was playing rhythm with the orchestra while CC played electric with the sextette in 1941), but Morgan did play electric guitar as part of the Goodman sextette. I have no pictures of Morgan, so I can't tell for sure. Can't find my copy of "BG on the record" F Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 I'd say circa 1942. My two cents. F OK, that sounds reasonable... but where is Big Sid Catlett then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 Other BG drummers from around that time were Ralph Collier and Hud Davies, maybe a few more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 I'd say circa 1942. My two cents. F OK, that sounds reasonable... but where is Big Sid Catlett then? What's the first appearance in a Hollywood film of an integrated band? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 You mean integrated big band? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 Yeah, but either would do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fer Urbina Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) Yeah, but either would do. Off the top of my head, I'd say the Goodman Quartet with Teddy Wilson, Lionel Hampton and Gene Krupa in 1937. However, and I can't remember whether it was for musical or "chromatic" reasons, while Goodman had Charlie Christian in the small group, he normally used a different, and white, guitarist with the big band (Arnold Covarrubias and then Mike Bryan, although the former was most probably of hispanic origin). I can't watch it now and wouldn't like to speculate, but IIRC the drummer is always kept off-camera, and that does seem a bit weird (being such a visual part of a band). F Edited March 13, 2007 by Fer Urbina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) Yeah, but either would do. As far as I know (and I don't know too much) probably Goodman/Wilson/Krupa/Hampton at that 1937. "Hollywood hotel" can be first appearance of integrated small group on film. I also have few radio broadcasts from the same group from 1937, so this could be the answer. Now speaking of drummer, around 1941. Goodman really recorded bigband without the drummer. Got to check my old Columbia/CBS vinyl, but I'm almost certain it was around that time. Edited March 13, 2007 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 26, 2007 Report Share Posted March 26, 2007 Ok, I sent an email to Hanover Music/Corinthian Records asking for conductor info from that show. Maybe somebody remembers. We'll see what happens. Jim, anything as an answer from Corinthian Records? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 26, 2007 Report Share Posted March 26, 2007 Nope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 (edited) BTW is it Geroge Van Eps at the guitar here in this film clip? I'm almost certain that our friend Hans Koert (Durium) from Holland will be delighted to see this! Still, we do not know what band supports Jo... Edited April 2, 2007 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Alfredson Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 I'd say circa 1942. My two cents. F OK, that sounds reasonable... but where is Big Sid Catlett then? I would say late 40's, early 50's at the latest, but 1942 is too early, imo. Stafford had a hit with that tune (The Gentlemen is a Dope) in 1947, so it has to be later than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 BTW is it Geroge Van Eps at the guitar here in this film clip? It really does look like Van Eps. He freelanced in the forties in the Hollywood area! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 BTW is it Geroge Van Eps at the guitar here in this film clip? It really does look like Van Eps. He freelanced in the forties in the Hollywood area! Yep, but we've discovered that this clip is form mid to late fifties... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Van Eps was freelancing around Hollywood during the fifties too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Van Eps was freelancing around Hollywood during the fifties too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted May 6, 2007 Report Share Posted May 6, 2007 (edited) About identification of the band supporting Jo Stafford. This link: http://2.upload.dailymotion.com/tag/big/vi...eman-is-a-dope1 says it's Jo with her husband Paul Weston, and that clip is from 1947. Well, I'm not sure about that. It is not from 1947, I'm almost certain. There is another data here: http://relativeesoterica.blogspot.com/2006...4852449230.html This Stafford performance of a tune that was clearly one of the singer’s favorites, “The Gentleman is a Dope,” comes from a 3/8/60 telecast, The Swingin’ Singin’ Years. So this could be the guide... Edited May 7, 2007 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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