1966 Jazz Magazine Readers Poll Best Organ

[Hot Ptah]

I have a copy of the May, 1966, issue of Jazz Magazine, a publication based in New York. This issue lists its first annual Readers Poll. Here are the results for Organ:

Jimmy Smith 2297

Shirley Scott 366

Wild Bill Davis 208

Larry Young 115

Jack McDuff 104

Don Patterson 87

Richard Holmes 86

Count Basie 77

Ray Charles 71

Freddie Roach 32

I was struck by how often the members of this forum discuss the musicians listed in the results for the other instruments. I will post them if anyone is interested.

Besides the usual categories, there are categories for Jazz Composition of the Year (Top 3: A Love Supreme, Song For My Father, and Meditations on Integration) and Jazz Arrangement of the Year--I wonder what would happen if these categories were used today in the various magazine polls.

[Dan Gould]

I'd be curious whether/where Hank and Lee fit in their respective instrument's poll.

[J Larsen]

Am I crazy or did we just discuss the exact same poll last week?

(Yes, I know, not mutually exclusive, ha ha ha.)

[Hot Ptah]

Am I crazy or did we just discuss the exact same poll last week?

(Yes, I know, not mutually exclusive, ha ha ha.)

You do understand that it was the down beat poll last week? I think that you knew that, though.

[J Larsen]

No, I didn't know offhand - it just visually looked like the same list and I couldn't find the other thread quickly.

[Hot Ptah]

I'd be curious whether/where Hank and Lee fit in their respective instrument's poll.

Here are the trumpet results:

Miles Davis........................1562

Dizzy Gillespie..,..................781

Clark Terry..........................529

Freddie Hubbard...................291

Louis Armstrong...................182

Lee Morgan..........................161

Don Cherry..........................131

Kenny Dorham.......................95

Art Farmer.............................81

Carmell Jones........................61

Don Ellis................................60

Cootie Williams......................55

Thad Jones............................52

Nat Adderley..........................48

Roy Eldridge..........................46

Chet Baker............................45

Donald Byrd...........................41

Here are the Tenor Saxophone results:

John Coltrane.......................2109

Stan Getz.............................1017

Sonny Rollins.........................276

Ben Webster..........................161

Archie Shepp.........................104

Zoot Sims...............................92

Coleman Hawkins....................87

Charles Lloyd..........................65

Dexter Gordon........................61

Joe Henderson........................56

Charlie Rouse.........................52

Booker Ervin...........................48

Paul Gonsalves........................44

Stanley Turrentine...................41

Albert Ayler.............................39

Wayne Shorter........................37

Yusef Lateef............................35

Hank Mobley............................34

Bud Freeman...........................32

Sal Nistico...............................31

[Hot Ptah]

No, I didn't know offhand - it just visually looked like the same list and I couldn't find the other thread quickly.

The results are not all that different on the two Organ polls, which is one thing that interested me about it.

[J Larsen]

So in 1966 if you had put Jimmy Smith, Trane, Miles, Getz and a drummer together in a quintet, the readers of Jazz Magazine would have been pretty happy!

[Guy Berger]

Here are the Tenor Saxophone results:

John Coltrane.......................2109

Stan Getz.............................1017

Sonny Rollins.........................276

Ben Webster..........................161

Archie Shepp.........................104

Zoot Sims...............................92

Coleman Hawkins....................87

Charles Lloyd..........................65

Dexter Gordon........................61

Joe Henderson........................56

Charlie Rouse.........................52

Booker Ervin...........................48

Paul Gonsalves........................44

Stanley Turrentine...................41

Albert Ayler.............................39

Wayne Shorter........................37

Yusef Lateef............................35

Hank Mobley............................34

Bud Freeman...........................32

Sal Nistico...............................31

Interesting that Shorter ranks so low, and that Shepp ranks so high.

When was the poll conducted? Was this at the end or beginning of 1966?

Guy

[GA Russell]

I bought a couple of copies of Jazz Magazine in '67, and I noticed that the difference between it and Downbeat was that Jazz had a much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label, and didn't mind dissing "Leonard the Feather".

So it doesn't surprise me that Shepp placed so high.

[Guy Berger]

I bought a couple of copies of Jazz Magazine in '67, and I noticed that the difference between it and Downbeat was that Jazz had a much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label, and didn't mind dissing "Leonard the Feather".

Dissing Leonard Feather? Sounds like a magazine to read!

Guy

[Chuck Nessa]

I bought a couple of copies of Jazz Magazine in '67, and I noticed that the difference between it and Downbeat was that Jazz had a much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label, and didn't mind dissing "Leonard the Feather".

So it doesn't surprise me that Shepp placed so high.

Jazz Magazine (later called Jazz & Pop) was owned by Bob Thiele so it shouldn't suprise you they exhibited a "much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label".

[Dan Gould]

Thanks for posting the trumpet and tenor results.

I wonder who was tops on piano. Monk? Duke? Silver should rank highly considering that Song for My Father was one of the top compositions. But maybe Tyner was tops because of the Impulse connection.

[Hot Ptah]

Thanks for posting the trumpet and tenor results.

I wonder who was tops on piano. Monk? Duke? Silver should rank highly considering that Song for My Father was one of the top compositions. But maybe Tyner was tops because of the Impulse connection.

Piano results:

Oscar Peterson...................696

Bill Evans...........................681

Herbie Hancock...................427

Thelonious Monk.................395

McCoy Tyner......................332

Earl Hines...........................197

Andrew Hill.........................182

Denny Zeitlin......................178

Horace Silver......................174

Cecil Taylor........................159

Erroll Garner.......................157

Roger Kellaway...................121

Claire Fischer......................118

Tommy Flanagan.................110

Duke Ellington.......................94

Ramsey Lewis.......................89

Ahmad Jamal........................87

Jaki Byard............................84

John Lewis............................72

Hampton Hawes....................69

Phineas Newborn Jr...............64

Andre Previn.........................57

Teddy Wilson........................54

Les McCann..........................41

Hank Jones...........................37

George Shearing...................34

[Dan Gould]

D'OH!

[Hot Ptah]

One oddity in the May, 1966 issue of Jazz magazine--there is a feature in which they ask various people for their one desert island jazz record. Those asked include Cab Calloway, Stanley Dance, Frank Driggs, Mel Torme, David Rose, Irwin Corey, Mort Greene, and RED SKELTON.

Red says that his desert island record would have to have Lionel Hampton on one side and Stan Getz on the other.

Mort Greene picks the then recent collaboration on LP of Lawrence Welk and Johnny Hodges.

[Hot Ptah]

So in 1966 if you had put Jimmy Smith, Trane, Miles, Getz and a drummer together in a quintet, the readers of Jazz Magazine would have been pretty happy!

And the drummer would be Joe Morello, who won the drums category.

[Hot Ptah]

Here are the Tenor Saxophone results:

John Coltrane.......................2109

Stan Getz.............................1017

Sonny Rollins.........................276

Ben Webster..........................161

Archie Shepp.........................104

Zoot Sims...............................92

Coleman Hawkins....................87

Charles Lloyd..........................65

Dexter Gordon........................61

Joe Henderson........................56

Charlie Rouse.........................52

Booker Ervin...........................48

Paul Gonsalves........................44

Stanley Turrentine...................41

Albert Ayler.............................39

Wayne Shorter........................37

Yusef Lateef............................35

Hank Mobley............................34

Bud Freeman...........................32

Sal Nistico...............................31

Interesting that Shorter ranks so low, and that Shepp ranks so high.

When was the poll conducted? Was this at the end or beginning of 1966?

Guy

The issue came out in May, 1966, and the opening editorial relates how so many ballots came in around the deadline that they extended the deadline. So it must have been a year-end 1965 or early 1966 voting period.

[Hot Ptah]

I bought a couple of copies of Jazz Magazine in '67, and I noticed that the difference between it and Downbeat was that Jazz had a much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label, and didn't mind dissing "Leonard the Feather".

So it doesn't surprise me that Shepp placed so high.

Jazz Magazine (later called Jazz & Pop) was owned by Bob Thiele so it shouldn't suprise you they exhibited a "much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label".

That is very interesting, Chuck. Bob Thiele's name appears nowhere in the editorial listings. The editor is Pauline Rivelli--do you know who she was?

Associate editors were George Hoefer and Dan Priest. The list of several contributing editors includes John Szwed as "folk and blues editor". Of course, John Szwed later

authored the Sun Ra biography, among other books.

There is a round table discussion piece in this issue about the jazz avant garde, and the Letters to the Editor column contains letters in which readers state opinions about a previous piece on the avant garde by Frank Kofsky.

Another letter to the editor complains that the March issue was largely devoted to Lawrence Welk. The editor replies that he was news, because Johnny Hodges had just done a collaboration LP with Welk.

[Guy Berger]

Here are the Tenor Saxophone results:

John Coltrane.......................2109

Stan Getz.............................1017

Sonny Rollins.........................276

Ben Webster..........................161

Archie Shepp.........................104

Zoot Sims...............................92

Coleman Hawkins....................87

Charles Lloyd..........................65

Dexter Gordon........................61

Joe Henderson........................56

Charlie Rouse.........................52

Booker Ervin...........................48

Paul Gonsalves........................44

Stanley Turrentine...................41

Albert Ayler.............................39

Wayne Shorter........................37

Yusef Lateef............................35

Hank Mobley............................34

Bud Freeman...........................32

Sal Nistico...............................31

Interesting that Shorter ranks so low, and that Shepp ranks so high.

When was the poll conducted? Was this at the end or beginning of 1966?

Guy

The issue came out in May, 1966, and the opening editorial relates how so many ballots came in around the deadline that they extended the deadline. So it must have been a year-end 1965 or early 1966 voting period.

I am guessing that had the poll been conducted a year or two later, Charles Lloyd would have been much higher.

Guy

[Chuck Nessa]

Jazz Magazine (later called Jazz & Pop) was owned by Bob Thiele so it shouldn't suprise you they exhibited a "much more positive attitude toward the Impulse! label".

That is very interesting, Chuck. Bob Thiele's name appears nowhere in the editorial listings. The editor is Pauline Rivelli--do you know who she was?

Correct, Thiele's name is nowhere in the mag but is was common knowledge at the time. Met Rivelli once and corresponded with her a bit. Some said she and Thiele were involved but I don't know if that is factual. I do know I once stopped at her office and was told she was "in California on business". The next day I stopped by Thiele's office and was told he was "in California on business".

Thiele started a Jazz Magazine in the late '30s while a teenager - just before he started Signature. Both names were later resurrected.

Writers for the magazine were frequent liner note writers for Impulse and Flying Dutchman and both of those labels got fairly "heavy" coverage in the magazine.

I still have a bunch of the magazines from '63 to '71.

Edited May 30, 2007 by Chuck Nessa

[Hot Ptah]

Thanks for the information, Chuck.

Most of the poll results are close to what you might expect. The Jazz Arrangement of the Year category winner is Roswell Rudd--"Niema". No album is listed. Does anyone know what 1965 album contains this arrangement?

[Guy Berger]

Thanks for the information, Chuck.

Most of the poll results are close to what you might expect. The Jazz Arrangement of the Year category winner is Roswell Rudd--"Niema". No album is listed. Does anyone know what 1965 album contains this arrangement?

I think this is "Naima" off Shepp's Four for Trane, misspelled on the original release.

Guy

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I find it very interesting that, while the organ poll show the same huge disparity between Jimmy Smith and Shirley as the Down Beat poll, there isn't anywhere near the dominance of the trumpet, tenor and piano by the winners. Indeed, for all practical purposes, the piano is a dead heat. This bears ot what I was saying inrelation to the DB poll.

Smith's name was probably the only one a lot of people knew.

MG

[Hot Ptah]

I find it very interesting that, while the organ poll show the same huge disparity between Jimmy Smith and Shirley as the Down Beat poll, there isn't anywhere near the dominance of the trumpet, tenor and piano by the winners. Indeed, for all practical purposes, the piano is a dead heat. This bears ot what I was saying inrelation to the DB poll.

Smith's name was probably the only one a lot of people knew.

MG

I agree--and along those lines, some other categories were even closer. Richard Davis won the Bass category by three votes over Charles Mingus, 1051-1048. (Ray Brown was third with 381).

Miles Davis won Small Group by 16 votes over Dave Brubeck, 497-481 (John Coltrane's group was third with 362).

Buddy DeFranco won Clarinet by 18 votes over Pee Wee Russell (766-748), with Jimmy Giuffre third at 329.

Three flute players were close at the top of the Flute category: Yusef Lateef--760, Roland Kirk--729, Herbie Mann-706.

Jim Hall had a 1063-984 vote margin over Kenny Burrell in the Guitar category. Wes Montgomery was third at 561.

Edited May 30, 2007 by Hot Ptah