Legacy reissues July 26

[chris olivarez]

Really looking forward to these. BTW who's the working group on "Silver's Blue"?

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Date: July 2, 1956

Location: New York City

Label: Columbia

Horace Silver (ldr), Hank Mobley (ts), Joe Gordon (t), Horace Silver (p), Doug Watkins (b), Kenny Clarke (d)

a. CO56459 To Beat Or Not To Beat - 04:02 (Horace Silver)

b. CO56460 Shoutin' Out - 06:33 (Horace Silver)

c. CO56461 How Long Has This Been Going On - 05:18 (George Gershwin, Ira Gershwin)

All titles on: - Portrait LP 12": RJ 45138 - Silver's Blue (1989)

- Epic LP 12": LN 3326 - Silver's Blue

- Epic LP 12": LA 16005 - Silver's Blue

Date: July 17, 1956

Location: New York City

Label: Columbia

Horace Silver (ldr), Hank Mobley (ts), Donald Byrd (t), Horace Silver (p), Doug Watkins (b), Arthur Taylor (d)

a. CO56824 I'll Know - 07:24 (Frank Loesser)

b. CO56825 Silver's Blue - 07:44 (Horace Silver)

c. CO56826 The Night Has A Thousand Eyes - 08:59 (Buddy Bernier, Jerome Brainin)

d. CO56827 Hank's Tune - 05:26 (Hank Mobley)

All titles on: - Portrait LP 12": RJ 45138 - Silver's Blue (1989)

- Epic LP 12": LN 3326 - Silver's Blue

- Epic LP 12": LA 16005 - Silver's Blue

======================

Mike

[chris olivarez]

Thanks Mike.

[mikeweil]

Only the first eight of the Jamal tracks Mike Fitzgerald lists are included in the Mosaic Piano Moods box. This stuff is as great as the recently reissued Argo by the trio. All of these were on two French CBS CDs I have, but someone told me the tapes used for them had some reverb added, as was common in the 1950's. Hopefully the Legacy will give us the original sound, as usual.

Mike, Claude Schlouch's Hank Mobley Discography lists two unissued alternate takes from the Silver sessions:

CO56461 How long has this been going on

from July 2, 1956

CO56459 To beat or not to beat

from July 18, 1956

The matrix numbers are identical to those of the issued takes.

The album as issued was on a Columbia CD many years ago, but sound was not exciting. I hope for an improvement.

The Dexter Gordon I always found to be very nice - but maybe it's just me as I saw this band performing most of these songs live (with Kirk Lightsey for George Cables), and it was one of the sunniest jazz experiences I ever had.

Edited May 17, 2005 by mikeweil

[Chuck Nessa]

The Dexter Gordon I always found to be very nice - but maybe it's just me as I saw this band performing most of these songs live (with Kirk Lightsey for George Cables), and it was one of the sunniest jazz experiences I ever had.

While this is probably the best of the Columbia Dexters, I think it pales when compared to the earlier SteepleChases and (especially) the Black Lions.

The band was better in person. I think my (minor) problem with this date is - I think they had too much time in the studio and tried to be "perfect". This drags down a bunch of "major label" jazz dates.

[JSngry]

And nobody, at least not to my knowledge, properly captured Eddie Gladden's cymbal whoosh in it's proper dynamic perspective.

[Chuck Nessa]

And nobody, at least not to my knowledge, properly captured Eddie Gladden's cymbal whoosh in it's proper dynamic perspective.

I wish I had THAT on tape.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

I think one of the strongest assets of Manhattan Symphonie is the repertoire: Dexter playing Moment's Notice (only recording I know of), revisiting Tanya from the Blue Note days, a nice Body and Soul (with respect paid to Coltrane's version), George Cables's piece I Told You So, the first Dexter recording of As Time Goes By, and Long Tall Dexter, which goes all the way back to 1946 on Savoy.

I agree there is something kind of "pristine" about things - but it works, for me. This is the mate to Sophisticated Giant, which is Dexter in a great large ensemble, courtesy of Slide Hampton. The blowing on the Black Lion and Steeplechase stuff is indeed great, but as "albums" I choose these.

Mike

[Free For All]

George Cables's piece I Told You So

I forgot about this one. It's very nice tune, melodic with interesting changes. George Cables wrote some good tunes-another one is "Think On Me" which was on Woody Shaw's Blackstone Legacy and also Woody Herman's Giant Steps.

Both of these tunes should be heard more often IMHO.

Edited May 18, 2005 by Free For All

[JSngry]

To me, Manhattan Symphonie is as much a cultural triumph as a musical one.

[JSngry]

And nobody, at least not to my knowledge, properly captured Eddie Gladden's cymbal whoosh in it's proper dynamic perspective.

I wish I had THAT on tape.

Word.

I've got it in my memory, but how long is that gonna last?

[Chuck Nessa]

To me, Manhattan Symphonie is as much a cultural triumph as a musical one.

'Twas the beginning of the end for Dextah in my book. Not a happy thought.

It was a marketing triumph.

[JSngry]

To me, Manhattan Symphonie is as much a cultural triumph as a musical one.

'Twas the beginning of the end for Dextah in my book.

In retrospect, yeah, that's indeed what it was.

But who knew that at the time? Then, it seemed like a helluva good album from a giant who was finally getting the "royal treatment" from both his label and his country. Marketing, yes, but there was definitely a sense of justice about the whole thing, or so it seemed to me then.

Of course, now, it might be easier for me to say that Dexter might have been better served in the long run by staying in Europe and not becoming a "star". But that's the 20/20-ness of hindsight, as well as a little better appreciation of the axiom that whom the gods would destroy, they would first make famous.

[Chuck Nessa]

To me, Manhattan Symphonie is as much a cultural triumph as a musical one.

'Twas the beginning of the end for Dextah in my book.

In retrospect, yeah, that's indeed what it was.

But who knew that at the time? Then, it seemed like a helluva good album from a giant who was finally getting the "royal treatment" from both his label and his country. Marketing, yes, but there was definitely a sense of justice about the whole thing, or so it seemed to me then.

Of course, now, it might be easier for me to say that Dexter might have been better served in the long run by staying in Europe and not becoming a "star". But that's the 20/20-ness of hindsight, as well as a little better appreciation of the axiom that whom the gods would destroy, they would first make famous.

Well, I was "bummed" at the time - no hindsight involved. Just some experience watching these things.

Way too much "blow" in the biz at the time and too many "execs" looking the other way.

[marcello]

And nobody, at least not to my knowledge, properly captured Eddie Gladden's cymbal whoosh in it's proper dynamic perspective.

You have strong feelings FOR and I feel the opposite.

I always HATED Gladden's cymbal work; if fact I used to avoid him like the plague.

I tried, having heard him not only on recordings, but seeing him many times in person.

I always thought that "whoosh" was just either bad equipment or sloppy playing or both.

I't been a while; maybe time to re-listen.

[JSngry]

Well, I was "bummed" at the time - no hindsight involved. Just some experience watching these things.

Way too much "blow" in the biz at the time and too many "execs" looking the other way.

You had the experience then that I didn't yet have. Getting some of it, though.

Oh well, life is for the learnin' as they say...

[JSngry]

And nobody, at least not to my knowledge, properly captured Eddie Gladden's cymbal whoosh in it's proper dynamic perspective.

You have strong feelings FOR and I feel the opposite.

I always HATED Gladden's cymbal work; if fact I used to avoid him like the plague.

I tried, having heard him not only on recordings, but seeing him many times in person.

I always thought that "whoosh" was just either bad equipment or sloppy playing or both.

I't been a while; maybe time to re-listen.

Nah, that whoosh IS Eddie Gladden!

I'm a huge sucker for cymbal whoosh, when a drummer really works the overtones of he cymbals into their sound and it creates a luxurious sonic cushion. Gladden, Tony, David Lee, those guys play cymbals the way I like to hear 'em played. Can't STAND that dry "ping" sound that has been so much in favor for the last 25 or so years. No sounds, no character, no flayvah. Gimme the whoosh any day!

[marcello]

I understand you, Jim.

One of my favorite current drummers is Jeff "Tain" Watts, who has a "whoosh" that has so many levels that he is creating a whole new language for cymbals.

[JSngry]

I love cymbals.

[marcello]

I love cymbals.

You should check out another master of the pie-tins: Gary Novak

Listen to him on Joe Locke and 4 Walls of Freedom's cds "4 Walls Of Freedom" (with Bob Berg) and "Dear Life" (with Tommy Smith).

You'll cream your jeans ( with a whoosh ).

Edited May 18, 2005 by marcello

[JSngry]

Not with THAT mug on my mind I won't!

[marcello]

This is better, Jim:

Cindy Blackman

And she's a BAD player too!

[Morganized]

While this is probably the best of the Columbia Dexters, I think it pales when compared to the earlier SteepleChases and (especially) the Black Lions.

The band was better in person. I think my (minor) problem with this date is - I think they had too much time in the studio and tried to be "perfect". This drags down a bunch of "major label" jazz dates.

Couldn't agree more. I never really got the Dex craze until I hit the Black Lion stuff. It is just too great. Now saving up for the Steeplechase box.Someday soon I hope!

[mikeweil]

I can see what you all mean when you compare the SteepleChase albums to the Columbias: The former (finally, after many years of hardships) had Dexter in relaxed form, focussing himself (Biting The Apple is my favourite), the latter were "productions" - both have their pros and cons.

In my special case there is some nostalgia involved - I saw that band, as I said, on a 11.00 am gig, and just when they hit the first chord of Moment's Notice, the sun burst through the clouds and lighted up the stage! I will never forget this. They played all the tracks from Manhattan Symphonie, which was a statement, to make a jazz classic, not just another album, and I think it was intended that way. I see a little too much of a jam session approach in much of the European albums, especially the Black Lions, with some exceptions, of course, like the great strings album on SteepleChase. Just my taste, of course.

Edited May 18, 2005 by mikeweil

[mikeweil]

I love cymbals.

Glad to hear you do. But most people - musicians included - hate cymbals exactly for that wash. Engineers top the list, at least over here. Can't handle it - you never will with close miking.