Face of the Bass

I understand all that, I just think that album for album, the Impulse catalog beats the Blue Note catalog in terms of diversity of sound and quality of product. I love Blue Note. I like the Blue Note sound, but I can't deny that it gets extremely repetitive. When you think about Impulse, with all the New Thing guys, Mingus, Tyner, Oliver Nelson, J.J. Johnson, Freddie Hubbard, and others, I just think the overall quality is higher and that the product has less of a sameness to it that sometimes plagues the Blue Notes from the same period.

Also, I would agree that Andrew Hill is currently overrated. My reasons for this belief are that his music gets touted on every jazz message board, his albums from the 1960s have been getting reissued at an almost insane pace, and yet I'm almost always disappointed by the results. And it's not because I'm too "conservative." If anything, I read people talking about Hill as this incredible musical innovator and then I get excited until I listen to the product and find that it doesn't measure up to the hype. If anything, Hill wasn't radical enough. To equate him to Monk or Mingus is insane. Also, FWIW, I always get the feeling that Hill's compositions were more akin to some incredibly dry science experiment than any genuine artistic statement. You read the liner notes to his albums and it's all about how he wanted to write a tune with x number of bars in different scales or whatever. Yawn. My opinion is that the guy just didn't have that much to say. His best albums are good because of the playing of the other people, not because of his allegedly "out" playing, which actually sounds quite tame when put next to the best innovators on the piano from the time period. I listen to Monk and I hear humor and sadness. I listen to Cecil Taylor and I hear incredible energy and propulsive drive. I listen to Hill and I hear a guy searching for an identity and never quite getting there.

i understand what you're saying, but can't the same be said of riverside, prestige, et al? most labels during the time frame being discussed had a stable of players that comprised their dates which resulted in certain consistencies... the sides from some labels are simply more diverse than others due to variety in material and groupings. i don't see it as a blue note thing, although they certainly had their sound. ?, -e- Well, yes, but compare Blue Note to Impulse. Which had the more diverse sound? For me it's Impulse, hand's down.

My main problem with the deification of the Blue Note catalog during this time period is that the label was basically churning out a lot of albums, admittedly, of high quality, that sounded just like each other. Similar lineups, similar tunes, similar musical approaches. They broke out of this mold somewhat in the mid-60s with some of the albums by McLean, Shorter, Hancock, Dolphy, and Hill, but the great weakness of BN for me is that, at the end of the day, most of their stuff sounds the same, or at least, very similar.

Overrated: It doesn't necessarily mean I don't like these, but I don't think they are as essential/mind-blowing as people often make them out to be: Art Blakey - Mosaic Dexter Gordon - Gettin' Around Grant Green - Complete Quartets with Sonny Clark Herbie Hancock - Empyrean Isles Andrew Hill - Black Fire Andrew Hill - Point of Departure Lee Morgan - The Sidewinder Sam Rivers - Fuchsia Swing Song Wayne Shorter - Speak No Evil Jimmy Smith - Groovin' at Smalls Paradise Larry Young - Unity

I mean it in a good way. Of the currently in print Mosaics, I'd like to know which people like to listen to when they want to hear something that is more contemplative or melancholy, the kind of music you want to listen to while pouring yourself a stiff drink and pondering the futility of human existence.

Personally, I always demand that Mosaic authenticate each set I buy with a piece of DNA from the artist in question, which is taped (or in some cases, splattered) over the inside cover. That way if I ever want confirmation that my Stan Kenton is the real deal, I can just order an exhumation of his remains to cross-compare with the DNA sample in my booklet. Pretty simple, really.

There are three Borders near here, and I don't think any of them stocked all of the RVGs, though one stocked a few and another stocked a few. The Borders around here has definitely been slimming down the jazz selection, although one of the three seems to have become a dumping ground for discs ordered long ago that were never sold, which is nice because when I browse through there I sometimes find interesting stuff.

Thought I could restart this thread because I'm planning to put in another Mosaic order in about a week or two and I'm currently flip-flopping between getting the Gillespie or getting the Hodges. I don't really have much in my collection of either, and the sound clips for both seem pretty good to me (as do the lineups.) I guess right now I'm leaning a bit more toward the Hodges, I don't know.

I like Dexter Gordon's Dexter Calling and Kenny Dorham's Whistle Stop.

A.T.'s Delight is a nice addition.

Thanks. That 12/23 session with Heywood on piano is the one I want. I heard it on vinyl at a friend's house last week and was stunned by his bass solo on Crazy Rhythm with that breathing. You can really see how he played the bass like it was a wind instrument, and also hear his influence on guys like Paul Chambers, etc. I will check out the Classic Tenors disc.

Hey- I'm looking for the best CD reissue of the Dec. 1943 recording session with Coleman Hawkins and Oscar Pettiford. I think the recording date was Dec. 23, 1943. I've seen a couple tracks offered in compilations, but I'm looking for the entire session, and the best sound that I can find. Thanks for any help.

Well Valerie Wilmer's book has this to say: That's not really an answer to the question, though.

I'm having a hard time with this one. Szwed's Ra biography just says that Sanders worked his way into the band. A couple newspaper articles online state that Sanders was working as a waiter and selling his blood for cash at this time. Then he moved into the Arkestra's house, but I'm not sure what he was doing other than getting lectures from Ra.

Hooked onto this thread, way too late, but here's my offering based on the artists I have multiple albums of in my collection: AMM - Newfoundland Art Ensemble of Chicago - Les Stances A Sophie Albert Ayler - Slug's Saloon Derek Bailey - Improvisation Billy Bang - Commandment Art Blakey - Free For All Anthony Braxton - For Alto Sonny Clark - Cool Struttin' Ornette Coleman - The Shape of Jazz To Come John Coltrane - A Love Supreme Miles Davis - Miles Smiles Eric Dolphy - Out To Lunch Jimmy Giuffre - 1961 Dexter Gordon - Our Man in Paris Grant Green - Idle Moments Herbie Hancock - Maiden Voyage Andrew Hill - Judgment!!! Freddie Hubbard - Night of the Cookers Bobby Hutcherson - Oblique Booker Little - Out Front Jackie McLean - Let Freedom Ring Charles Mingus - Charles Mingus Presents Charles Mingus Hank Mobley - Soul Station Thelonious Monk - Monk's Music Lee Morgan - Search for the New Land Sachiko M - Good Morning Good Night Toshimaru Nakamura - Side Guitar Sonny Rollins - Saxophone Colossus Keith Rowe - Duos for Doris Wayne Shorter - The All Seeing Eye Taku Sugimoto - Live in Australia Sun Ra - When Angels Speak of Love Cecil Taylor - Indent

I have for trade the 9 disc Sonny Stitt set from Mosaic. The entire thing is in like-new condition. PM me with any offers.

I prefer to get the box sets because, unlike the individual cds, you can bludgeon people to death with them. This one guy came in to my house once and I surprised him by beating him repeatedly over the head with the Coltrane Prestige box, and then switching to one of the Miles' metal spine boxes. He was gone inside of 10 minutes. But then once I tried the same thing with this OTHER guy, but instead had to use a Japanese mini-LP, and was less impressed with the results. The guy just said "Can you quit doing that, please?"

Last year I was having a REALLY bad day and in order to cheer myself up I just went to Borders and unloaded full price for this set. It made me feel good at the time and I'm still glad I did it, even though now I could buy it from Concord for about 25 percent of what I paid last year. Also, this set is a fucking monster. It will eat your children for breakfast and crap them out before lunch time.

It's pretty funny, actually. A thread about a thread. The Jazzcorner thread is pushing 500 posts, this one is pushing 100+...let it never be said that Stanley Crouch fails to draw a crowd.

Or better yet, judging by the enthusiasm for Mosaic's products, you could reserve one last box set of every OOP set in their back catalogue. Hide them all in a room full of straw that goes up to your knees. You have five minutes. Go.

Seriously, that's a pretty lame contest. What they should do instead is make it like that game show for kids in the 80s where they had to run around a toy store frantically throwing as many toys as they could into their shopping cart. Same deal, except cds. Aisle after Aisle of common, uncommon, hard-to-find, and OOP cds from the Concord vaults. You get a shopping cart and five minutes. Go.

Holy crap, when do you guys have that kind of time to listen to 30+ discs from one shipment? I mean, if you buy too much heroin you just overdose, but you actually have to listen to the CDs, you can't just inject them into your arm...

Yeah, the thread is getting uglier. Lois has really shot herself in the foot with her behavior. It's not a good idea to piss off the people whose participation keeps your site active.

Well, I've been posting at JC for almost three years. It's like a strange addiction. I've been trying to move over here for jazz-related discussion, as there is little to be found there, but it's hard to do. I used to post at JC as crawjo, now I go both there and here as Face of the Bass. JC does have a lot of nice people there, and it is a great place to talk about sports and the like. Hi Chris.