Big Beat Steve

One never knows, do one?? (As a famous subject of that "other" discography" used to say...) BTW, please note this key statement from the above link: "Discs degenerate in all adults as we grow older" :D CD owners, heed this warning! And indeed - the longer we play our vinyl (as we grow older with our vinyl) the more it invariably degenerates.

Don't have my discog handy but that sounds like a "compilation" rehash of other Tamps LPs (both Oscar Moore and George Redman had LPs of their own on Tampa). But a steal at 99c anyway.

O.K., so far, so good. And now??

Yes it is a pity that there will never be a Vol. 3 (actually I had had little hopes - if any - for it anyway). I read "The Swing Era" in the early 90s and was very impressed (though the transcriptions are beyond me too) and I still refer to it to this day. No matter whether one agrees with all of his judgments it is a very important reference work if you want to get a quick yet in-depth and to-the-point assessment even of acts who are off the trodden track of the usual bi-gstar suspects. Gunther Schuller managed to pull strings together that others seem to have become aware only recently. IMHO "colored judgments" are no issue in such books at all; I think any collector with reasonable collecting experience and a musical taste of his own will not take such books as the pure gospel anyway but rather as a source for FURTHER thought. (After all, we are not talking about extremely biased writings here such as those by Panassié! :D) The Swing years seem to have been prone to a lot of controversies as to who would qualify as a "jazz" swing musician (to be included) or a "pop" swing musician (to be excluded) anyway, and no matter what concrete complaints Brownian Motion etc. have here, he definitely is more objective than other respectable writers on the Swing era (cf. Brian Rust and his arbitrary exclusion of swing bands in his discographies, etc. etc.).

Even if he were not violating any copyright laws (with the +50-year old music being P.D.), he did misrepresent the item because if he burnt a CD-R off an LP then this is not a "CD" (as pointed out here countless times before). And even less is it a "collector's item". How can something you can make countless copies of be a "collector's item"? (Hey, if it were that easy ANYBODy with a decent laser/color photocopier and a couple of collectible original paper objects would be in the business of trading with "collectible" printed matter!!) If he had represented the item correctly it would have had to be a legit CD reissue that for some reason is really impossible to find in this very version (release, pressing, etc), maybe because it was an extremely limited run (but pressed in a proper pressing plant, not something burnt at home through the grubby hands of some geek). But as it is it is just a case of misrepresentaiton IMHO and that would be reason enough to give him 'ell. A CD-R burnt off a possibly collectible original LP is nothing but a token or favor done by somebody to make the music itself available to saomebody else but not something collectible (not by any stretch of the imagination) in the sense that we all have come to understand the term 2colectible" in THIS context. Sorry, Baker, that this has happened to you from a German seller. As a German buyer I've off and on encountered U.S. ebay sellers with highly doubtful selling and description practices who clearly tried to get away on the principle that "somebody from overseas is never going to sue me and does not have a legal handle here anyway". but still it's sad to see reverse happening.

What book would that be exactly? Cannot possibly be a belated German version of his "The Big Bands" book (belated because this major opus was released some 40 years ago!). And this book DOES have an Elliott Lawrence entry in the main section of the "major" big bands. So .... Anyway, thanks for the info. Though I am a bit wary of German translations of this kind of book (especially if the editor is Hannibal) I'll have to check out my local 2001 store, I guess. As for Elliott Lawrence discs, I personnaly did not find that companion volume to the Gerry Mulligan arrangements album on Fantasy (i.e. his "Plays Tiny Kahn and Jophnny Mandel arangements") that much of a letdown compared to the Mulligan disc. But will do some aural comparison later tonight! Also, for those who're into vinyl the earlier Eliott Lawrence recordings/airshots on the First Heard and Big Band Archives labels are interesting listening too. Great stuff to show where this band came from!

I think two aspects need to be distinguished there: - Agreed that "hate" towards other persons (including fellow forum members") isn't the way to go and can be counterproductive to one's own goals but OTOH - I felt he often had a bone to pick with the music industry at large and certain superficialities of artists, producers, the music-consuming public, etc. IMO some clear-cut language isn't always the worst thing to choose if you want to shake people out of their consuming attitude (and get them to reflect on whether the hullaballoo about this or that act maybe is just a case of the "Emperor's clothes").

Good point, MG. Some people sometimes need a kick in the you know where so they realize they'd better reconsider their positions, even if it only comes to musical preferences. Complacency and/or being stuck in a rut is not tackled by lulling people in further. I admit I often did not get the point that Clem tried to get across either but it was always obvious to me that there was something there that would warrant deeper thinking. Not that I could always be bothered to give the matter THAT much thought to investigate, but on those occasions that I did I very often had to agree that he had a point.

Sounds quite alright to me (for what you can expect from mid-40s 78rpm indie labels) on the PRESTIGE LP compiling all the above Joe Davis master takes. One of my 40s small-group swing favorites ever since I bought this one in my early collecting days.

Don't worry, Michel, I am not talking about auction characters like "ondemand12" etc. They've been around the block, that's for sure. :D But every additional far-east newcomer hipped to certain items slims the perspectives down for us over here.

Well, check eBay or German fleamarkets. I own one of those three EPs and in fact found it at a local fleamarket (though sometime in the 90s). As a matter of fact I've seen another copy of this EP I own on eBay several years ago but the winning bid price was kind of silly... You're not the only one who's on the lookout for items like that (I've been aware of these ever since I got hold of a 1960 issue of the "Bielefelder Jazz Katalog" (no doubt you know what THAT is) in my early collecting days in the 70s). But of course with "Eurojazz" it's a chancy thing, and maybe we're both doing ourselves a disservice by discussing those items in public here because as you might know there has been a FATAL tendency for certain Asian speculators (I cannot use the term "collector", seeing how they ruin the market - sorry) to snap up ANYTHING that reeks of European jazz from the 50s/60s. And that automatically makes those items (which are part of OUR OWN jazz heritage) quite unaffordable for anybody outside those Asian places. I've never heard of any reissues either - sorry. But it might be high time ...

Isn't music history full of such "borrowings" throughout the entire history of jazz, blues, country music, etc.? ;) If it is a case of borrowing (or more) at all in the sense that "stealing" is persecuted in court today, even if it boils down to 2-second snippets only (as seen in recent cases in the pop music field).

Sad ... another one from the golden age of jazz who's gone. RIP. Time to pull out his Sextette album on ABC Paramount or "The Mitchells" album "Get Those Elephants Outta Here" on Metrojazz and give them a spin.

This was out on two Prestige LPs back in the 80s. Haven't listened to them very often yet; IIRC the fidelity is just so-so but the music is fine and does have a lot of "blowing" atmosphere. If you like on-location recordings from that period, go grab it!

Snapped up an original of this one a couple of years ago on eBay and liked it a lot. Modernized 50s cool-school swing a bit like Al Cohn on alto, with maybe a hint of Lee Konitz thrown in (Dick Johnson is his own man, though, but this should broadly describe his stylistic position within the 50s jazz styles). Been a while since I listened to it, so thanks for the reminder!

No matter what his later recordings may have achieved, his definitive recording of NIGHT TRAIN will grant him a place in jazz and R&B history!

So this O'Donnell feller took his inspiration for this album from LEE DORSEY?? :rolleyes:

My DUAL turntable (bought new sometime in the 90s) has 33, 45 and 78 rpm (one of the last they made with 78 rpm) so playing them would not require much effort (except to change the stylus). But I don't get around to spinning them that often, and they days when I actively sought them out at garage sales and auctions really are more or less over. I have about 800 or 900 78s (mostly U.S. and European swing, bop, R&B, country/Western Swing, rock'n'roll/rockabilly, plus some assorted quantities of 40s and 50s pop), but the 78s that I tend to spin most often are late 40s/early 50s bop and R&B items on various indie labels that aren't easily available as reissues. Now how about another thread "What 16 RPM are you spinning right now?" :D That's where the question of the equipment to play them really becomes crucial. If I'd want to spin mine (one Prestige, one Vogue, so not exactly mvery many), I'd have to really pull out one of my portable 50s "Dansette"-type turntables.

Thanks for making this public! Nice to see one of the players of the Swing era still being around, especially since he outlived sooo many of subsequent generations of jazz musicians. Maybe someone really ought to seek him out and record his memoirs and reminiscences for posterity before it is too late and another link to the past is severed. BTW, among all the RIP threads of last year, the passing of another notable Swing-era jazzmen seemed to have gone largely unnoticed: Franz Jackson passed away the past year at 94. If I look at who else got an obit here, it certainly was NOT a matter of obscurity that this passing went largely unnoticed but really only a matter of awareness on the part of those who go for those obits. (As for my last statement, I stand corrected: Franz Jackson DID get an obit thread of his own - well deservedly)

My vote (maybe heresy to some around here ): Stan Kenton's version with vocals by June Christy (the flipside of "Fantasy" on Capitol). Probably not not a "favorite" version ("Willow" isn't one of the tunes I tend to think of in terms of "favorites") but certainly the one that's impressed me most (possibly because it was one of the first I was thoroughly exposed to).

A name that does ring a bell ever since I bought that Specialty "This Is How It All Began" compilation LP in the mid-70s (that introduced me to a lot of variants of post-war R&B - and paved the way for a LOT of further record purchases ). Like others here (and not being a gospel specialist) I wouldn not have imagined he was still around. Amazing! R.I.P.

Is there any legal way I can get a copy? Do you know anyone or place that will sell one? If you cannot get a copy of the 78rpm or 10in releases on Skylark via eBay or the like, try the other reissues. There is a late 50s compilation album on the Tampa label that reissued "Big Boy" and other former Skylark/Tampa tracks, and this compilation again has been re-reissued on another label in the 70s (with ghastly artwork). I have one of those reissue pressings; will seach for it later among my LPs to get the details.

That just about sums it up, although one might also add the following 'sentence': "These are "Live" performances some sound quality imperfections may exist". O.K., I agree with all these - but if you insist that "A Train" is incorrect (and not just sloppy) as the correct title is "Take The A Train" then you might also add that "In My Solitude" more commonly (FAR more commonly) goes under the title of "Solitude" only. @TTK - re- your last post: Open any newspaper or mag and you will see that this species is virtually extinct these days when it comes to printed media.

I admit I'm unfamiliar with the "Jazz Gráfico" book but it apparently covers a lot of ground covered elsewhere. However, for 10-inch and 78 rpm covers this one seems to be for you: In the Groove - Vintage Record Graphics 1940-1960, by Eric Kohler (Chronicle Books) Far from comprehensive but it complements the other record cover books named above as it puts the focus on earlier records and some artists overlooked elsewhere,e g. Jim Flora. And since Baker named it, I am slightly underwhelmed by the recent jazz record cover book issued by Taschen. I browsed through it extensively the other day in a book store but found that in the end it did not include all that much that had not yet been covered by Jazzical Moods, Jazz West Coast, California Cool, East Coasting and the Blue Note books when it comes to 50s/early 60s covers, and it definitely has WAAAY too much late 60s/70s covers with that weird psychedelic/flower power/pop art artwork. Pretty garish, some of them ... (but that's only my personal taste) Maybe that Japanese website with all those 78rpm/10in record cover scans ought to be made into a book??

Wow - I'd love a copy of that one. Have never seen it ! 'Unpredictable' is a pretty accurate description. Actually that's one of the very few "Jazz In Hollywood" series LPs on Liberty that I don't have. I'd like to listen to that one too but OTOH it has one side of instrumentals and one side of vocals and that bad, bad, bad review of the vocals in Down Beat really frightened me away. Even if I disregard the fact that the DB reviews aren't necessarily the final word I know my taste as far as MALE vocals in 50s jazz go, so I definitely would not be prepared to pay top money for such an item (and on eBay I would have had to shell out top money each time I bookmarked that one - at least way more that I'd have been prepared to spend). A candidate for a Fresh Sound reissue??