Big Beat Steve

Trying to narrow down the track you are looking for to identify the album you bought in 1971: If you say the album does not appear in any listing, could you describe its cover as closely as you recall it? Normally it should be somewhere in the Discogs listings after all. It cannot be THAT obscure ... And after all it would be "only" the LPs released up to 1971 that would have to be checked. Considering you are in NZ, my guess is it is not unlikely it was a UK or Australian pressing you bought. And since you say that you "listened to many tracks but still can't locate the song", could you name the songs you listened to that are NOT the "first" track from that LP you are looking for? At least those "other" tracks you remember? All this just as an orientation for those trying to identify the LP.

Just an update about whatever vinyl "resurgence" there is in the music buyers' world: Returning from another of those 2-day clearout sales at our #1 local record store (whch yielded a fair share of "great finds" for me too, but at 1 EUR apiece you cannot often go totally wrong anyway ), I found my impressions of the two sales days of last year confirmed again throughout all the hours I spent there on Friday and Saturday: The percentage of young'uns (between, say, 15-16 and 30) was really high, and a fair share of them were female. This was particularly evident in the vinyl rooms (the share of youngsters in the CD room seemed lower). From what I noticed at casual glances at the stacks these youngsters had pulled out or what I overheard of their discussions, even jazz and jazzish pickings were not that rare. Though of course they often searched out the well-known names such as Louis Armstrong, Frank Sinatra, Ella Fitzgerald, a.o.). What also baffled me were those two kids in their early 20s who patiently dug through the crates of 78s in the regular shop section. Some patience I hardly ever can muster anymore because there is very little of interest in the fields of jazz, R&B or rock'n'roll in there. You usually have to dig through about 100 or 200 items of popular ("Schlager")/light classics/folk pop etc. dross before finding anything of some interest. The only marked generational difference I noticed was (as always) that the early birds who lined up well before the shop opened to get an early start on everyone else were almost all of them well past 40 or even 50. Even at other recent trips to the shop I noticed that vinyl does attract a lot of youngsters, and nowhere near all of them hung out around the hip-hop or Metal crates. Anyway, nice to see vinyl isn't something only for the 50+ or even 60+ generation yet.

Maybe it's different in the USA, but over here they are often dismissed as the usual "cheapo student pad furniture" that won't last too long. However, it seems to me IKEA have improved the BILLY range over time. I have three older ones (shelf width 75 cm) from the 90s (discarded by my office partner and taken home by me in 2005 or so) and am using these mostly to hold car magazines stored in magazine holders (most shelves are crammed full), and the shelf boards indeed tend to flex to some degree. And I've had to add some reinforcements here and there to prevent the side walls from bowing out under the load and allowing one or the other shelf to drop. But the BILLY shelf units I've bought new myself (long ago too - 20+ years) still hold up very well, even though they are also loaded to the limits (some of them with car mags and books too, but most of them with LPs now) they stand up very well and don't budge to any singificant degree. In fact they seem almost as solid overall as some significantly more expensive shelving units I've bought specifically for my vinyls back in the 90s (and these are no longer made either, alas). Checking those BILLYs over I noticed on those I bought myself that Ikea have added some extra screws (with the socket hex heads visible from the outside) to hold the center shelves (at half-height of the full shelf) firmly in place so the side walls cannot bow out. These, by the look at it, were missing on the older ones, so this may be ONE reason for the somewhat seedy reputation of the BILLY range.

IKEA seems to be all over the place for CD (and vinyl) storage shelves. But it really seems they do not keep any of them available nearly long enough. And what you all have mentioned here matches none of the two different systems for CD storage I've bought at IKEA in the past. (Will have to search for the names but cannot locate the info sheets or receipts right now.) They are used in different areas in my music room so the mismatch is no big problem. But I really regret those I bought in 1999/2000 are long-discontinued. It was a wall-mounted cupboard to hold about 350 CDs each (I bought two of them at the time) with glass doors. Smart ... Apart from that, the oft-maligned BILLY system holds up well and serves me well for storing my LPs that overflowed from my actual music room into the adjacent room where vinyls are gradually taking over now ...

I can only speak for myself. So far I have not had any really bad experiences with publishing and shipping dates via Amazon Germany as compared to Amazon.com USA, even for books that I preordered. The last such case for a preordered book was the Don Byas bio, and IIRC my copy arrived here at about the date announced, even some time before some of the U.S. Organissimo forumists had received theirs. The only potential snag these days might be that it happens increasingly often that the (paperback/softcover) books are actually print-on-demand books. So even the PRINTING occurs here in Europe. On the one hand this should speed up delivery (it actually did in several cases), on the other there might be worries about printing and binding quality (I haven't had any problems in recent times, but "one never knows, do one?" - and I'd hate to se this happen for the first time in years with THIS book ). What worries there are may be due to the fact that this printing on demand can occur almost anywhere around here. My US-published books bought via Amazon in very recent years have been printed in Germany, the UK, Poland and France - randomly with no detectable reason of why which book is printed where. So if it is going to be print on demand this time you just don't know where it will be handled this time. But of course if what I ordered and am set to receive is a hardcover after all (the amazon site does not look like it, though) this might change things about the actual delivery date. (Because I don't think Amazon does print-on-demand for hardcovers.) But even there I cannot remember any complaints about unduly delayed deliveries for brand-new books in the past. I'll keep my fingers crossed it's not going to be a "first" now. List price at amazon.de is similar to what you quote for amazon France; my guaranteed preorder price was 49 EUR plus some cents.

About that final quote you stated (rawness and grit to the sound of sax players): I'd sure like to know, then, what he thinks of latter-day Don Byas and his changes of tone in the 60s? Still Lester-Young-ish? (Which indeed was wrong from the start) Or, for that matter, all those 40s/50s honkers, starting with Illinois Jacquet and continuing to (name your faves here)? Agreed with Rabshakeh, all these statements are bad - and at least bizarre, to put it mildly. But he achieved one major goal that some scribes seem to be out for. Get talked about!! Maybe a goal they seem to be out for even more today than ever before?

Thank you for this information. Keeping fingers crossed now that things will work out as your publisher told you and Amazon will follow suit ASAP with their shipments ...

Nice, though I imagine the walls in that room aren't actually as curvy as they look here.

Of course they didn't need to. But considering how many of them literally drooled over Robert Johnson as the messiah of blues it now strikes me as funny that most (or maybe all) of them at least in this case never heard what the people back in the 30s ACTUALLY listened to. Yes, I'm being a bit sarcastic here about that "messiah thing" - this simply is colored now by what I learnt about their "reception" of the blues in my young record buying and collecting days in the 70s - and honestly, once I had heard the Robert Johnson "Crossroads" (Take 2) on that CBS LP (that I bought during a stay in London at age 16 in 1976) I found it harder to connect it to the "boogied-up" version by Cream that was one of those records that cemented the Robert Johnson legend in late 60s and 70s rock circles. Funnily this is quite similar to other niches of rock (such as among the rockabillies) where certain 50s tunes have acquired cult status and were covered by numerous younger groups although the original recording had remained unreleased in the 50s and did not see the light of the turntables until the 70s or 80s when it cropped up on a Charly or Ace LP (or the like). Which almost inevitably led to comments by some nitpickers along the lines of "what you pick up from the 50s wasn't even heard in the 50s ... " Much the same thing with the 60s blues rock men, then, after all ...

About the actual release date now ... Until yesterday Amazon advised me my copy was to arrive this Monday. But this morning I received an "update" that indicated a delay and a new delivery date sometime between 10 July and October 2026 (!!). Checking Amazon.com (USA) it says the release date is 10 June 2026. Whereas on German amazon.de it still says it's (been) released on 10 April but on the other hand indicates a delivery period between 10 July and 28 October. This time span seems VERY vague to me. Anyone know anything from some other source about what happened or what the publication snag now is? I've waited for about 10 months for the book so can and will wait some more but it's a pity - something I'm reminded of whenever I look at the space kept free for this book on my otherwise crowded racks of jazz books in my music room.

Indeed. I just listened to the song back to back on vinyl (CBS 62456) and on CD (Columbia Roots'n'Blues 2-CD set), and that test pressing indeed sounds markedly clearer. But since this test pressing is Take 2 again, one thing baffles me: How come the originally issued master (take 1) apparently was bypassed in favor of take 2 for many (most?) reissues from the 60s onwards? CBS 62456 (originally Columbia CL 1654) has take 2, Goodrich & Dixon also list several reissues for take 2 but none for Take 1. The first reissue of Take 1 I've found is on the Roots label from 1971. Reissues that have take 2 started in 1961, however. So did those blues rock legends of the 60s who absorbed RJ for inspiration ever get to hear the ACTUALLy released version of that tune back in the day, I wonder? The Roots'n'Blues set has both takes, and they are interesting to compare. To me the vocals on take 1 do sound rougher.

Indeed some intriguing recommendations of relatively "recent" recordings here ... Many of which I cannot recall having ever come across before. Maybe time to look closer as and when the occasions present themselves ...

I've hardly ever looked actively for those latter-day recordings as in my (admittedly not comprehensive) experience they are often "plagued" by certain "updated" traits (not necessarily in the leader's playing but just as much with the backing musicians or the overall arrangements) that don't do that much for me. But one I've come to like is the "Dave Pell Octet Plays Again" set (Fresh Sound FSR-101) recorded in 1984. https://www.discogs.com/release/5582953-The-Dave-Pell-Octet-The-Dave-Pell-Octet-Plays-Again Straight-ahead jazz that retains a "modernized" Westcoast vibe and shows Pell blowing more than on some of his comparatively polite 50s records. Another one I enjoy from time to time is "Bill Holman: A View From The Side" (JVC-2050-2) recorded in 1995. https://www.discogs.com/master/829495-The-Bill-Holman-Band-A-View-From-The-Side But remember - I never explored those later works by West Coast artists in greater depth, so what I like may well be among the "also-rans" among other forumists' lists of favorites.

IMO - no. Weren't the Norman Granz sessions rather different and more swing-mainstreamish in their concept and therefore intentions? At any rate Prestige involved a wider range of musicians (and styles), didn't they? I am not sure if it is totally fair to blame Bob Weinstock that much for lack of preparation, etc., as it happens in that Jazzprofiles text. But who knows - maybe some of those Prestige sessions are part of why those "blowing sessions" were dismissed (and sometimes even made fun of) by some jazz scribes and reviewers when the releases were all new in the 50s? (Though in fact Down Beat reviewers tended to fault some Blue Note releases for an all too loose "blowing session" setup too)

Yes, this is a recurrent problem, not just in the field of (music) history books.

I just read the entire FB discussion linked above, and - apart from the fact that, for a FB page, this is some serious and enlightened discussion - he may indeed be making too much of this particular passage if this was the only sore spot. But was it?? I don't know so I'd not judge that book myself. In general, though, I'd find such nonsense almost as grating as Allen did. Why do these authors have to resort to such clichés? And why can't they link the elements of their reasoning more properly so the reader isnt left wondering what the author actually meant to say? Do they really expect that their bluff won't be called by some readers if it can be called that easily? (In fact they ought to be glad that readers out there read their elaborations that attentively, instead of just glossing over them ... ) I guess I've been overly critical with some books I've read and commented upon here on that forum too. But one basic premise just is and remains: Get your facts right!

A fine set and worth revisiting anytime. But IMHO it's a pity they focus quite a bit on the known names of the "usual suspects" who have been graced by reissues elsewhere too. So others "who also were there" (and who you come across when you leaf through "First Pressings" a.o. and then start wondering about them) fell by the wayside. But - yes, I realize you cannot please everyone and such box sets cannot easily be designed as "fillers of the gaps left by others".

Since this is a Decca/Brunswick release it cannot be part of that "editing" controversy that involved George Avakian and Columbia Records in the mid-50s for certain Louis Armstrong recordings and caused quite a bit of indignation in jazz circles IIRC. But others may have been going that route too.

Why leave out his Vanguard LP (for example), while you're at it?

I tend to agree, unfortunately. I added a few of these to my collection during recent months too and felt much like you did. Apparently contrary to how others on thos forum feel about these. (As shown in recent discussions here). Somehow his JATP and Granz Jam Session presence does more for me. But tastes differ and one man's meat, etc ... Congrats on your CC Benny Carter CD purchases. I bought two of these long, long ago to round off (more or less) my vinyls of his 30s and 40s recordings. Which I feel have a punch and edge that the backing groups of his later recordings somehow smother too often.

Re- "Ben Webster meets Don Byas" (SABA): You all sure made it hard for me to listen to this without any preconceived notions based on what's been written on that session. So I listened a bit closer now, and as I'm no musician nor a musicologist and not out to dissect such recordings academically, my bottom line is: "No desert island disc but no train wreck either." To my ears, Don Byas indeed sounds more assertive whereas Ben Webster is more in what has been described as his "coasting" mood. As for their interplay, we know why 2 of the 6 tracks are vehicles for one tenor only and elsewhere their cooperation sounds somewhat loose and disjointed, but not excessively so, at least to me and given the known circumstances. The way they alternate with one being up front and the other in the back has its moments too. Besides, weren't there many late 50s or 60s jazz recordings where anything loose or disorganized or everyone going off into whatever direction was just as likely to be construed by reviewers or listeners as "advanced" or similar, in a sort of "anything goes" state of mind? I'm not sure how regularly I'll targetedly revisit this LP; but it is a notable document of a phase in the careers of both of these legends. Warts'n'all.

I see there are a huge variety of different listening prefernces among Bird fans, either complete with all the laternates or master takes only. So, further to the JSP public domain set that Mikeweil showed, here is another approach that might satisfy those who like to experience the music in the exact compiling and track order of the original or "period" releases from way back. (Yes I know the CD set shown under the below link is one of those P.D. sets that some will immediately sneer at. But if found cheaply ... - My copy, for example, came my way at a clearout sale several years ago - and at 1 EUR for a TEN-CD set you cannot go wrong and might as well consider it a freebie ). Anyway ... this set combines the music "as is" from a number of 10" and 12" LPs originally released in the 50s and early 60s on Dial, Savoy, Mercury, Clef, Jazz Workshop, Le Jazz Cool and some others. So as a complementary item with a somewhat different compiling order it might serve some purpose here and there ... https://www.discogs.com/release/11693423-Charlie-Parker-Milestones-Of-A-Legend

So Büchmann-Møller did not dwell on the clash of personalities or animosities that seems to have developed between Webster and Byas during that session (as Con Chapman explained in his Byas biography)? It seems easy to imagine that they were not at their top on that occasion, given these problems. Will try to listen to that disc with a "blank sheet" approach anyway. @Late: Thanks for your feedback.

Sooo ...@Late: What are YOUR impressions of the presence of the harpsichord on that album, then?

Interesting ... and apparently totally under everyone's radar with all that "Listening" talk about Prestige during recent months ... But ouch ... what a hefty price. I'm tempted but am very much on the fence, given how many Prestiges are on my shelves anyway and how many have been shown "for art's sake" in previous books such as "East Coasting" and "Jazzical Moods". We'll see ...