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Shawn

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is there so great why havent -I- heard of em??!?!

Haven't heard of Grant Green?

And you must have Johnny Acea, who played piano on Don Wilkerson's "Elder Don".

And Eddie Chamblee is just one of the most fantastic tenor players ever! If you see "The rockin' tenor sax of EC", don't hesitate to buy it.

MG

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is there so great why havent -I- heard of em??!?!

Because as much as you know, there is still more to find out.

Hell, I'm more than twice your age & I'm still learning. It never stops, and be thankful for that. When it does, it's time to die.

Now, chewy - do you know Tom Archia?

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I played parts of the Dodo last night... not unlistenable at all, but to me it sounds like in a very different tradition/line than the "mainstream" jazz singer - reminded me of some of the vocal stuff in the "Blues, Boogie & Bop" Mercury 40s set, you know, some of those tracks with anonymous bands, Helen Humes is the only bigger name in there, the others are Myra Taylor, Julia Lee and Roy Byrd. That's a more commercial kind of line, I guess, jump and blues, not "proper" jazz... if viewed as that, I have no problem with Dodo at all... and the music is not exactly the most subtle, either... just not what you'd expect to hear on Blue Note. Anyway, they did hardly any vocal sessions, and with "Portrait of Sheila" being such a great and unique album anyway, this won't stand up that comparison, but there's no need to compare it, I think.

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I played parts of the Dodo last night... not unlistenable at all, but to me it sounds like in a very different tradition/line than the "mainstream" jazz singer - reminded me of some of the vocal stuff in the "Blues, Boogie & Bop" Mercury 40s set, you know, some of those tracks with anonymous bands, Helen Humes is the only bigger name in there, the others are Myra Taylor, Julia Lee and Roy Byrd. That's a more commercial kind of line, I guess, jump and blues, not "proper" jazz... if viewed as that, I have no problem with Dodo at all... and the music is not exactly the most subtle, either... just not what you'd expect to hear on Blue Note. Anyway, they did hardly any vocal sessions, and with "Portrait of Sheila" being such a great and unique album anyway, this won't stand up that comparison, but there's no need to compare it, I think.

Dodo was a Soul Jazz singer. Compare her with someone like Della Reese, Irene Reid or Billie Poole. Not quite as good as them, I think, but not bad.

MG

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reminded me of some of the vocal stuff in the "Blues, Boogie & Bop" Mercury 40s set, you know, some of those tracks with anonymous bands, Helen Humes is the only bigger name in there, the others are Myra Taylor, Julia Lee and Roy Byrd.

Roy Byrd was Professor Longhair - not a small name, Ubu.

Julia Lee was an even bigger name than Longhair, in the '40s - 13th biggest selling R&B artist of the decade. Very, very cool lady. I wasn't aware she'd ever recorded for Mercury; she was mostly on Capitol. What is on your box must have been some early material recorded for a tiny label in Kansas City in '45. What's the track title?

MG

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Now, chewy - do you know Tom Archia?

Blew some mean tenor ... I like the stuff he did for Chess in the 40s and his backup work for Wynonie Harris.

Speaking of which, thanks for your impressions of the Dodo Greene CD, king ubu. Sounds like something I might want to add to the R&B corner of my collection one of these days.

I played parts of the Dodo last night... not unlistenable at all, but to me it sounds like in a very different tradition/line than the "mainstream" jazz singer - reminded me of some of the vocal stuff in the "Blues, Boogie & Bop" Mercury 40s set, you know, some of those tracks with anonymous bands, Helen Humes is the only bigger name in there, the others are Myra Taylor, Julia Lee and Roy Byrd.

Fine stuff on these Mercury boxes. Not bad credentials if you compare her to this material. :D

... just not what you'd expect to hear on Blue Note.

Which only goes to prove once again that you shouldn't buy records for the label (as so many BN fetichists seem to do) but for the artist and the music in its own right. :D

Julia Lee was an even bigger name than Longhair, in the '40s - 13th biggest selling R&B artist of the decade. Very, very cool lady. I wasn't aware she'd ever recorded for Mercury; she was mostly on Capitol. What is on your box must have been some early material recorded for a tiny label in Kansas City in '45. What's the track title?

If It's Good/Show Me Missouri Blues/Lotus Blossom/Dream Lucky Blues (originally recorded for Premium in 1946, reissued elsewhere too, e.g. on her Jukebox Lil LP's)

Edited by Big Beat Steve
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That Mercury box is a marvel - there are threads dedicated to it, but here's the tracklist again:

Disk 1

Bedroom Blues - Sippie Wallace

Buzz Me - Sippie Wallace

Doin' The Boogie Woogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Oh, Lady, Be Good! - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Suitcase Blues - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Boogie Woogie At The Civic Opera - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Boogie Woogie At The Civic Opera - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Swanee River Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Why I'm Leaving You - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

I Don't Want To See You - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Red Sails In The Sunset - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Kilroy Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Deep In The Heart Of Texas Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Sweet Patooty Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

12th Street Rag - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

12th Street Rag - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

St. Louis Blues - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Shufflin' The Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Shufflin' The Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

S. P. Blues - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Hiroshima - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Roses Of Picardy - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

The Sheik Of Araby - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

You Are My Sunshine - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

In A Little Spanish Town ('Twas A Night Like This) - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Margie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Disk 2

Tuxedo Boogie - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Mr. Bell Boogie - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Bear Den Boogie - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Rhythm Boogie - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Ammons Stomp - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Baltimore Breakdown - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

When You And I Were Young, Maggie - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

The Clipper - Albert Ammons and His Rhythm Kings

Jet Propelled Papa - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Blue And Sentimental - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

I Just Refuse To Sing The Blues - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

They Raided The Joint - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Mad About You - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra / Jumpin' On Sugar Hill - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra / Flippity Flop Flop - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Today I Sing The Blues - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Time Out For Tears - Helen Humes With Unknown Orchestra

Married Man Blues - Helen Humes With Unknown Orchestra

Somebody Loves Me - Helen Humes With Unknown Orchestra

Don't Fall In Love With Me - Helen Humes With Unknown Orchestra

I've Got The Strangest Feeling - Helen Humes And The Contrastors

Free - Helen Humes And The Contrastors

Disk 3

Hootie Boogie - Jay McShann And The Boogie Woogie Trio

Garfield Avenue Blues - Jay McShann And The Boogie Woogie Trio

Crown Prince Boogie - Jay McShann And The Boogie Woogie Trio

Shipyard Woman Blues - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Ernestine - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Bucktown Boogie - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Roll On, Katy - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Voodoo Woman Blues - Jay McShann And The Sextet

I Want A Little Girl - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Jimtown Boogie - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Have You Ever Loved A Woman - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Gone With The Blues - Jay McShann And The Sextet

Barfly Blues - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Please Stop Playing Those Blues, Boy - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

All My Geets Are Gone - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Strange Woman Blues - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

W. B. Blues - Walter Brown with Jay McShann Trio

Sloppy Drunk - Walter Brown with Jay McShann Trio

Lovin' A Beggar - Walter Brown with Jay McShann Trio

Just Thinkin' - Walter Brown with Jay McShann Trio

You Didn't Tell Me - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Got You Beggin' - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Duke And The Brute - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Reach - Jay McShann & His Orchestra

Disk 4

Cherry Red Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Somebody's Gotta Go - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Too Many Women Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Just A Dream - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Mr. Cleanhead Steps Out - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

It's A Groovy Affair - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

I've Been So Good - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Juice Head Baby - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Cleanhead Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

When A Woman Loves Her Juice - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Kidney Stew Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

King For A Day Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Old Maid Boogie - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Lazy Gal - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Bonus Pay - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Luxury Tax Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Railroad Porter's Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Gonna Send You Back Where I Got You From - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

When I Get Drunk - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Oil Man Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Ever-Ready Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Wrong Girl Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Wandering Mind Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Have You Ever Missed Your Baby? - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Disk 5

Some Women Do - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

Alimony Blues - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

High Class Baby - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

I Took The Front Door In - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

Friday Fish Fry - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

Shavetail - Eddie "Cleanhead" Vinson

Her Mind Is Gone - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Bald Head - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Hey Now, Baby - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Oh, Well - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Byrd's Blues - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Hadacol Bounce - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Longhair Stomp - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Been Foolin' Around - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

Between The Night And Day - Roy Byrd And His Blues Jumpers

If It's Good - Julia Lee With Tommy Douglas's Orchestra

Show Me Missouri Blues - Julia Lee With Tommy Douglas's Orchestra

Lotus Blossom - Julia Lee With Tommy Douglas's Orchestra

Dream Lucky Blues - Julia Lee With Tommy Douglas's Orchestra

Take It Easy, Greasy - Myra Taylor With Jimmy Keith's Orchestra

Tell Your Best Friend Nothin' - Myra Taylor With Jimmy Keith's Orchestra

The Spider And The Fly - Myra Taylor With Jimmy Keith's Orchestra

Still Blue Water - Myra Taylor With Jimmy Keith's Orchestra

Disk 6

Boy Meets Horn - Rex Stewart And His Sextet

Jug Blues - Rex Stewart And His Sextet

B. O. Blues - Rex Stewart And His Sextet

That's Rhythm - Rex Stewart And His Sextet

Dateless Brown - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

You Got Me Cryin' Again - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Desperate Desmond - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

It Couldn't Be True - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Quiet Riot - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Baby, Baby All The Time - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Route 66 - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

The Iggity Song - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

It's About Time - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Ready To Go Steady - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Rich-Ual Dance - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

Oop-Bop-Sha-Bam - Buddy Rich And His Orchestra

You Talk A Little Trash - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Typhoon - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

I Love You, Yes I Do - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Smooth Sailing - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

'Gator Tail, Part 1 - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

'Gator Tail, Part 2 - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Let 'Em Roll - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Slidin' And Glidin' - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Mercenary Papa - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

You Got To Pay Those Dues - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Disk 7 (alternates & rarities)

Oh, Lady, Be Good! - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Oh, Lady, Be Good! - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Oh, Lady, Be Good! - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Kilroy Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Kilroy Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Kilroy Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

St. Louis Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

St. Louis Boogie - Albert Ammons And His Rhythm Kings

Jet Propelled Papa - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

I Just Refuse To Sing The Blues - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

They Raided The Joint - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Mad About You - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Flippity Flop Flop - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Today I Sing The Blues - Helen Humes With Buck Clayton's Orchestra

Bucktown Boogie - Jay McShann And His Sextet

Voodoo Woman Blues - Jay McShann And His Sextet

Br'er Rabbit - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Boogie Woogie Holliday - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Too Many Women Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

I Like To Be Home Blues - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Three O'Clock In The Morning - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Gonna Send You Back Where I Got You From - Eddie 'Mr. Cleanhead' Vinson and His Orchestra

Typhoon - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Mercenary Papa - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Doin' The Gator Tail - Cootie Williams And His Orchestra

Just An Idea - Mary Lou Williams

Just You, Just Me - Mary Lou Williams

*****************************************************************

No offense intended to Profossor Longhair, with whom I am not familiar at all. Maybe the comparisons are ambitious one - I really don't know enough about this kind of music to make valid comments and comparisons, my point was just that this is the place where I feel Dodo Greene's coming from.

I am not sure the "soul jazz" label is a very useful one... Mingus has at least as much soul as what the etiquette is more often attached to... but I think I know what you mean, MG!

Sorry if my lack of knowledge leads to wrong conclusions... I'm merely a youngster interested in the history and music of jazz and have not delved too deeply into lots of pre-bop and the entertainment/jump/blues/whatever genre(s).

The point about not buying stuff because it's on a particular label is a good one. On the other hand, with this method you may end up with some great stuff that you wouldn't have encountered otherwise... with my own sponge-like way of proceeding, this certainly is a great way of finding out about new stuff... the Blues, Boogie & Bop set was a similar one - I got it because it looked great, it was a minor obsession to locate one that I could afford, and then there are the Cleanhead and McShann cuts I wanted, plus the Rich and also the Ammons... most of the rest I was unfamiliar with (actually I was unfamiliar with Cleanhead and Ammons, too), so this was a great way of finding out about something new to me.

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No sweat about definitions, Ubu. They're a marketing aid, which means if there is general agreement on what they cover, that can serve as pointers for people to follow to other things. But they're no more than that.

I've never come across that set before. Thanks for going to the trouble of posting the tracks. Looks very good to me and I haven't got much of it. What's it called?

MG

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I want the dodo because of the dodo... see my avatar :crazy:

You think that Jesus was a flightless bird?

Interesting theory, but it's already been proven that he was black & Canadian.

Maybe you meant Jeeves, of "Ask Jeeves" fame. Him I could see as a dodo.

Time has passed, the world has a new executive board, and ubu a new avatar... old one below, sir.

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No sweat about definitions, Ubu. They're a marketing aid, which means if there is general agreement on what they cover, that can serve as pointers for people to follow to other things. But they're no more than that.

I've never come across that set before. Thanks for going to the trouble of posting the tracks. Looks very good to me and I haven't got much of it. What's it called?

MG

older thread

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No sweat about definitions, Ubu. They're a marketing aid, which means if there is general agreement on what they cover, that can serve as pointers for people to follow to other things. But they're no more than that.

I've never come across that set before. Thanks for going to the trouble of posting the tracks. Looks very good to me and I haven't got much of it. What's it called?

MG

older thread

Thanks Ubu. I'll look into that when I've absorbed all my New Orleans, swing bands, Stitt and Cousin Joe boxes (where's the smiley for wiping the sweat off your brow?)

MG

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Thanks Ubu. I'll look into that when I've absorbed all my New Orleans, swing bands, Stitt and Cousin Joe boxes (where's the smiley for wiping the sweat off your brow?)

MG, just a word of caution regarding the box set that King Ubu mentioned above.

It IS a great one but if you eventually would like to get more of the music recorded by the artists featured on this set during roughly the same period you wil find that a LOT of these Mercury tracks have been reissued elsewhere (particularly the Ammons, Byrd, Vinson, Lee and Humes tracks) so you might end up with these tracks on other reissues over and over again. And I do think all the Rex Steward and Cootie Williams tracks have been reissued on the Chronological Classics CD series as well.

So if you are both into Jazz and into R&B you might perhaps be better off checking out the other 8-CD box set mentioned in the earlier set:

"The Mercury Blues'n'Rhythm Story 1945-1955".

It has a far larger variety of artists and tracks and quite a few that have never been graced with reissues elsewhere.

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Thanks Ubu. I'll look into that when I've absorbed all my New Orleans, swing bands, Stitt and Cousin Joe boxes (where's the smiley for wiping the sweat off your brow?)

MG, just a word of caution regarding the box set that King Ubu mentioned above.

It IS a great one but if you eventually would like to get more of the music recorded by the artists featured on this set during roughly the same period you wil find that a LOT of these Mercury tracks have been reissued elsewhere (particularly the Ammons, Byrd, Vinson, Lee and Humes tracks) so you might end up with these tracks on other reissues over and over again. And I do think all the Rex Steward and Cootie Williams tracks have been reissued on the Chronological Classics CD series as well.

So if you are both into Jazz and into R&B you might perhaps be better off checking out the other 8-CD box set mentioned in the earlier set:

"The Mercury Blues'n'Rhythm Story 1945-1955".

It has a far larger variety of artists and tracks and quite a few that have never been graced with reissues elsewhere.

Thanks Steve - I've got the Williams and Lee tracks plus one or two by Ammons father & son (pre Joey De & Papa John De) - they're the only ones I have on this comp. Helen Humes, Vinson and Ammons are the two others I'm really keen on in this and I doubt whether I'd be getting round to this material of theirs anytime soon. I have all the Humes Contemporaries to get first. But I'll think about this issue deepy before I decide.

MG

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Lee Morgan - The Procrastinator (TOCJ) (includes bonus session) - $17

Julius Watkins - Sextet Volumes 1 & 2 (Connoisseur) - $15

Jack Wilson - Something Personal (Connoisseur) - $15

Junko Onishi - Cruisin' - $15

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PM for the Watkins Conn and the Onishi. Thanks. You're one of the best sellers on here.

Edited by trane_fanatic
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