10 reasony you/i arent rich.

[ejp626]

Mutual funds are actually a pretty horrible investment in the long run.

I guess it's all relative. Many have done quite well for long stretches. Of course, you want to find a no-load fund, and a no-load index fund is going to have the lowest annual fees. The question is whether you would do better with a broker and all the hassle associated with that. I've had pretty bad experiences with brokers and trying to pick my own stocks. Also, I find that with a mutual fund, I am a lot more likely just to leave the money invested and not trying to micro-manage and do market timing, where you almost always end up worse off.

[zen archer]

All i know is after i did my taxes this year my accountant said ..." Don't forget you need to pay 15 %

for FICA " ......aaarrrgghhh......i 'am pretty sure that even if i showed $5,000 grand . I would have to

give 15% for FICA.

Are you saying that an employee doesn't start paying Fica until after a certain amount of income ?

Sorry to keep bugging you about this - I just find equity in the tax system to be an interesting topic.

It's actually the opposite - you pay FICA on the first $x of income, not on income above $x. Last year I think it was $90K, so that after you had earned $90K you no longer paid FICA. This year I believe it is some random amount, like $92,748 (just made that up). I think the rationale behind this is to make sure everyone puts something into the system, but to not force people who have the means to invest on their own to tie up their money in a low-return compulsory vehicle. I'm not saying I agree with the rationale (I actually strongly disagree), but nonetheless I believe that is the rationale.

WOW .i didn't know that ..probably becasue it's been a while since i made over $90,000

[J Larsen]

Thanks. I forgot about the medicare component.

[porcy62]

Sorry for the digression, but FICA in italian means C**T, so when are saying "you pay FICA on the first $x of income, not on income above $x..."

[zen archer]

This year it's $97,500..

It's really 12.4% for self-employed -- the extra 2.6% comes from Medicare, which has no maximum.

Even for self employed ? you don'y have to pay once you hit $97,500 ?

[Uncle Skid]

Even for self employed ? you don'y have to pay once you hit $97,500 ?

Yes. But the 2.6% continues on all of your "earned" income -- salary/bonus/etc.

[RDK]

You're not rich because you haven't read The Secret!

[J Larsen]

Mutual funds are actually a pretty horrible investment in the long run.

I guess it's all relative. Many have done quite well for long stretches. Of course, you want to find a no-load fund, and a no-load index fund is going to have the lowest annual fees. The question is whether you would do better with a broker and all the hassle associated with that. I've had pretty bad experiences with brokers and trying to pick my own stocks. Also, I find that with a mutual fund, I am a lot more likely just to leave the money invested and not trying to micro-manage and do market timing, where you almost always end up worse off.

I realized after I left my house that my comment was a bit arrogant. I follow the markets as part of my job, so it is much easier for me to develop my own opinions and investment ideas. If I had to do so in my free time, mutual and exchange-traded funds would likely look a lot better to me.

[Jim Alfredson]

How about this one: As a musician, my average take-home pay for a gig is about $125. That's what my dad was making as a musician back in the 70s.

does this mean that the only musicians that survive on music are those that are in the educational field or give a lot of private lessons, or the few that are plugged into the system?

Pretty much. To paraphrase Corey Christiansen, who I played with last December, the only way for a jazz musician to make it these days is to teach. I don't teach because I am self-taught and I don't really know how to explain the things I know. Plus there are not too many people who want to play jazz organ.

Thankfully, my wife has a decent job with benefits, but even she hasn't gotten a cost of living increase in 2 years (due to poor management at the top). But that's another story. I just sold one of my Hammond organs yesterday so we could pay the mortgage. The gig scene has been absolutely awful since the first of the year. I've played a grand total of 7 gigs since 2007 started. But that has more to do with Michigan's terrible economy than anything else.

I should go into demolition. I just read they are going to raze two more GM plants here in town.

EDIT: To say I'm not complaining. This is the life I chose and I enjoy playing music.

Edited March 24, 2007 by Jim Alfredson

[Guy Berger]

Number 7 is curious. Of course other people know more about money than I do, particularly when it comes to tax treatment of income, etc. I can't believe he is calling for people to stop using investment professionals, which would include those running mutual funds if we took it to extremes. I guess the broader point of taking responsibility for your finances and knowing at least the basics is a good one.

Mutual funds are actually a pretty horrible investment in the long run.

I assume you aren't including index funds in that category.

Guy

[alocispepraluger102]

How about this one: As a musician, my average take-home pay for a gig is about $125. That's what my dad was making as a musician back in the 70s.

does this mean that the only musicians that survive on music are those that are in the educational field or give a lot of private lessons, or the few that are plugged into the system?

Pretty much. To paraphrase Corey Christiansen, who I played with last December, the only way for a jazz musician to make it these days is to teach. I don't teach because I am self-taught and I don't really know how to explain the things I know. Plus there are not too many people who want to play jazz organ.

Thankfully, my wife has a decent job with benefits, but even she hasn't gotten a cost of living increase in 2 years (due to poor management at the top). But that's another story. I just sold one of my Hammond organs yesterday so we could pay the mortgage. The gig scene has been absolutely awful since the first of the year. I've played a grand total of 7 gigs since 2007 started. But that has more to do with Michigan's terrible economy than anything else.

I should go into demolition. I just read they are going to raze two more GM plants here in town.

EDIT: To say I'm not complaining. This is the life I chose and I enjoy playing music.

[porcy62]

How about this one: As a musician, my average take-home pay for a gig is about $125. That's what my dad was making as a musician back in the 70s.

does this mean that the only musicians that survive on music are those that are in the educational field or give a lot of private lessons, or the few that are plugged into the system?

Pretty much. To paraphrase Corey Christiansen, who I played with last December, the only way for a jazz musician to make it these days is to teach. I don't teach because I am self-taught and I don't really know how to explain the things I know. Plus there are not too many people who want to play jazz organ.

Thankfully, my wife has a decent job with benefits, but even she hasn't gotten a cost of living increase in 2 years (due to poor management at the top). But that's another story. I just sold one of my Hammond organs yesterday so we could pay the mortgage. The gig scene has been absolutely awful since the first of the year. I've played a grand total of 7 gigs since 2007 started. But that has more to do with Michigan's terrible economy than anything else.

I should go into demolition. I just read they are going to raze two more GM plants here in town.

EDIT: To say I'm not complaining. This is the life I chose and I enjoy playing music.

Interesting post... ... or repost

[alocispepraluger102]

How about this one: As a musician, my average take-home pay for a gig is about $125. That's what my dad was making as a musician back in the 70s.

does this mean that the only musicians that survive on music are those that are in the educational field or give a lot of private lessons, or the few that are plugged into the system?

Pretty much. To paraphrase Corey Christiansen, who I played with last December, the only way for a jazz musician to make it these days is to teach. I don't teach because I am self-taught and I don't really know how to explain the things I know. Plus there are not too many people who want to play jazz organ.

Thankfully, my wife has a decent job with benefits, but even she hasn't gotten a cost of living increase in 2 years (due to poor management at the top). But that's another story. I just sold one of my Hammond organs yesterday so we could pay the mortgage. The gig scene has been absolutely awful since the first of the year. I've played a grand total of 7 gigs since 2007 started. But that has more to do with Michigan's terrible economy than anything else.

I should go into demolition. I just read they are going to raze two more GM plants here in town.

EDIT: To say I'm not complaining. This is the life I chose and I enjoy playing music.

it's one thing to sit in a club or put on some phones and enjoy so many wonderful musics, with little or no expenditure on my behalf, without realizing this music is too often someone's lifelong passion, pain, and sacrifice.

my sincere thanks, guys.

stan getz said that music cost him everything he ever loved.

[porcy62]

How about this one: As a musician, my average take-home pay for a gig is about $125. That's what my dad was making as a musician back in the 70s.

does this mean that the only musicians that survive on music are those that are in the educational field or give a lot of private lessons, or the few that are plugged into the system?

Pretty much. To paraphrase Corey Christiansen, who I played with last December, the only way for a jazz musician to make it these days is to teach. I don't teach because I am self-taught and I don't really know how to explain the things I know. Plus there are not too many people who want to play jazz organ.

Thankfully, my wife has a decent job with benefits, but even she hasn't gotten a cost of living increase in 2 years (due to poor management at the top). But that's another story. I just sold one of my Hammond organs yesterday so we could pay the mortgage. The gig scene has been absolutely awful since the first of the year. I've played a grand total of 7 gigs since 2007 started. But that has more to do with Michigan's terrible economy than anything else.

I should go into demolition. I just read they are going to raze two more GM plants here in town.

EDIT: To say I'm not complaining. This is the life I chose and I enjoy playing music.

it's one thing to sit in a club or put on some phones and enjoy so many wonderful musics, with little or no expenditure on my behalf, without realizing this music is too often someone's lifelong passion, pain, and sacrifice.

my sincere thanks, guys.

stan getz said that music cost him everything he ever loved.

Now, that makes sense!

And what he said, thanks guys

[Jazzmoose]

Sorry for the digression, but FICA in italian means C**T, so when are saying "you pay FICA on the first $x of income, not on income above $x..."

Yeah, well we have to pay that in addition....

[porcy62]

Sorry for the digression, but FICA in italian means C**T, so when are saying "you pay FICA on the first $x of income, not on income above $x..."

Yeah, well we have to pay that in addition....

Bizarre, because I thought that above $$$$$$$ usually you don't have to pay for that...

[J Larsen]

Number 7 is curious. Of course other people know more about money than I do, particularly when it comes to tax treatment of income, etc. I can't believe he is calling for people to stop using investment professionals, which would include those running mutual funds if we took it to extremes. I guess the broader point of taking responsibility for your finances and knowing at least the basics is a good one.

Mutual funds are actually a pretty horrible investment in the long run.

I assume you aren't including index funds in that category.

Guy

Actually I am. After fees, index funds are guaranteed to (slightly) underperform the market, plus there are usually restrictions on when you can pull out. I'm not personally interested in an equity investment that is going to tie up my cash and yield a below-average return. I can see why they are attractive to others, though.

[Jim Alfredson]

it's one thing to sit in a club or put on some phones and enjoy so many wonderful musics, with little or no expenditure on my behalf, without realizing this music is too often someone's lifelong passion, pain, and sacrifice.

my sincere thanks, guys.

stan getz said that music cost him everything he ever loved.

Like I said, I'm not complaining. Being a full-time musician means I can be a stay-at-home dad to my daughter, something I would not trade for all the money in the world. When I was growing up my dad worked his ass off so my mom could stay home and raise the seven of us. I think it is important to have a parent at home, but all too often people can't afford to do so and that's a shame.

I don't really care about money. As long as we have enough to pay the bills and put food on the table, I'm happy. It has never been a goal of mine to be rich. So I guess I'm a success!

[porcy62]

it's one thing to sit in a club or put on some phones and enjoy so many wonderful musics, with little or no expenditure on my behalf, without realizing this music is too often someone's lifelong passion, pain, and sacrifice.

my sincere thanks, guys.

stan getz said that music cost him everything he ever loved.

Like I said, I'm not complaining. Being a full-time musician means I can be a stay-at-home dad to my daughter, something I would not trade for all the money in the world. When I was growing up my dad worked his ass off so my mom could stay home and raise the seven of us. I think it is important to have a parent at home, but all too often people can't afford to do so and that's a shame.

I don't really care about money. As long as we have enough to pay the bills and put food on the table, I'm happy. It has never been a goal of mine to be rich. So I guess I'm a success!

Wise man.

[alocispepraluger102]

Number 7 is curious. Of course other people know more about money than I do, particularly when it comes to tax treatment of income, etc. I can't believe he is calling for people to stop using investment professionals, which would include those running mutual funds if we took it to extremes. I guess the broader point of taking responsibility for your finances and knowing at least the basics is a good one.

Mutual funds are actually a pretty horrible investment in the long run.

I assume you aren't including index funds in that category.

Guy

Actually I am. After fees, index funds are guaranteed to (slightly) underperform the market, plus there are usually restrictions on when you can pull out. I'm not personally interested in an equity investment that is going to tie up my cash and yield a below-average return. I can see why they are attractive to others, though.

many domestic index funds have fees in the .25% or lower range.

here's a forum for you;

http://diehards.org/forum/index.php

Edited March 24, 2007 by alocispepraluger102

[J Larsen]

Yes, and exchange-traded funds are generally a decent way to go, *if* you are interested in trading in funds rather than individual stocks. I realize a lot of this comes down to individual preferences/risk tolerance, but I'm still fairly firm in my personal views.

[alocispepraluger102]

Yes, and exchange-traded funds are generally a decent way to go, *if* you are interested in trading in funds rather than individual stocks. I realize a lot of this comes down to individual preferences/risk tolerance, but I'm still fairly firm in my personal views.

my lack of stock knowledge would kill me trying to do that.

[catesta]

Also , to be rich you have to BUST your ASS.

Or, you could just inherit the money as so many of the fuckheads today have. Grandpa busted his ass so William Jr. and his kids would never have to work.

My favorite is to be an incompetent executive, drive a company into the ground and still collect a ridiculous amount of money, get fired, collect even more money and never have to do a fuckin' thing ever again.

Seriously, busting your ass is still a key ingredient for most, I know.

[alocispepraluger102]

Also , to be rich you have to BUST your ASS.

Or, you could just inherit the money as so many of the fuckheads today have. Grandpa busted his ass so William Jr. and his kids would never have to work.

My favorite is to be an incompetent executive, drive a company into the ground and still collect a ridiculous amount of money, get fired, collect even more money and never have to do a fuckin' thing ever again.

Seriously, busting your ass is still a key ingredient for most, I know.

we all know too many of those worthless clowns.

[J Larsen]

Yes, and exchange-traded funds are generally a decent way to go, *if* you are interested in trading in funds rather than individual stocks. I realize a lot of this comes down to individual preferences/risk tolerance, but I'm still fairly firm in my personal views.

my lack of stock knowledge would kill me trying to do that.

I realize a lot of people don't have the time to devote to learning the markets, which is why my initial comment on this topic was a bit arrogant.

I have to say that it is a little frustrating to me that a lot of stock prices are now driven more by funds that they belong to than fundamental valuation!