Commercialization of 60s and 70s Tunes

[analogak]

Granted, but just because it isn't a new development doesn't lend it "credibility" either. The damn shysters.

your racially loaded terminology offends me.

[Man with the Golden Arm]

Granted, but just because it isn't a new development doesn't lend it "credibility" either. The damn shysters.

your racially loaded terminology offends me.

scheisser / dumpy

?

[danasgoodstuff]

the scenario MG describes above is especially ironical in the case of canned Heat who made one great single, one pretty good one,and loads of worthless albums (refried Hockey Puck Boogie anyone?) Besides, haven't we already had this conversation, several times? For me the biggest disconnect was the Clash Jaguar commercial... And many 'cool' bands did coke, etc. commercials back in the day, before they discovered it was more commercial for them not to... and you can buy collections of such now.

[Tim McG]

This music was never intended to be fodder for cereal and car commercials....

I really think you're wrong there. That music was hyped as being not commercial in the sixties by the Clive Davises and Ahmet Erteguns of the world but what was happening was that, for the first time, hit albums were routinely outselling hit singles, basically because your generation had loadsamoney. Because of a slight historical disconnect (partly because so many of the big selling albums of the fifties and early sixties were jazz or jazz-related like Sinatra's), it was possible to persuade people (including the members of the new bands) that only singles were commercial. So a whole generation of kids believed that these bands were, in some way, anti-commercial, anti-establishment. But that had nothing to do with reality, which was that the moguls were making huge bucks out of supposedly non-commercial music.

MG

You may want to do a little research, MG....

First of all, this music was, in fact, anti-establishment, protest oriented, anti-war and pro free speech music. It was not at all written to be used as pop ditties for selling soap and whatnot.

Secondly, if you seriously believe that paying $2-4 bucks for a record is the same as My Generation [read the lyrics of this tune, OK?] having "loadsamoney" then there is something dreadfully wrong with your thinking here.

Lastly, the commercial business side of selling music/albums/concerts/radio air time to listeners/advertisers in order for the bands to make a living has absolutely nothing at all to do with the use of it on car commercials today.

You apparently confuse the true nature of the songs and the value they had for us in the various struggles mentioned above with making money for the people who created it. Not the same thing....ain't even close, MG.

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

Edited October 25, 2007 by GoodSpeak

[MoGrubb]

i said that wrong-mog, i enjoy your folksy and plain-spoken way of writing. you did not mean it loaded so it wasn't loaded. and yet it is an offensive term though it has a confused etymology. then again i hate myself so what do i care.

I'm not familiar with your take on how my post could be misconstrued as being racist.

I assure you that it wasn't.

[Aggie87]

From Merriam Webster:

shyster - a person who is professionally unscrupulous especially in the practice of law or politics

I'm guessing "dumpy mama" thinks there may be some racist meaning to the word as well (?).

[Chuck Nessa]

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

Those on the "inside" never recognize the image in the mirror.

If you don't think the stuff you mention is/was "commercial" you misunderstood your time in that time.

[Chuck Nessa]

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

Those on the "inside" never recognize the image in the mirror.

If you don't think the stuff you mention is/was "commercial" you misunderstood your time in that time.

[Chas]

From Merriam Webster:

shyster - a person who is professionally unscrupulous especially in the practice of law or politics

I'm guessing "dumpy mama" thinks there may be some racist meaning to the word as well (?).

Adam's pique may stem from a conflation of 'shyster' with 'shylock'

http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-shy1.htm

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

Tim , may I suggest you take a look at the Frank book that I posted upthread .

[Teasing the Korean]

I can't believe an AARP commercial is using the BUZZCOCKS!!!!!

As for Canned Heat, they sucked then and they suck now. End of discussion.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

Those on the "inside" never recognize the image in the mirror.

If you don't think the stuff you mention is/was "commercial" you misunderstood your time in that time.

There is probably an age thing at work here. You and I, Chuck, are almost exactly the same age - about 10/11 years older thn Goodspeak. That decade put us in a different position in the sixties.

MG

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

This music was never intended to be fodder for cereal and car commercials....

I really think you're wrong there. That music was hyped as being not commercial in the sixties by the Clive Davises and Ahmet Erteguns of the world but what was happening was that, for the first time, hit albums were routinely outselling hit singles, basically because your generation had loadsamoney. Because of a slight historical disconnect (partly because so many of the big selling albums of the fifties and early sixties were jazz or jazz-related like Sinatra's), it was possible to persuade people (including the members of the new bands) that only singles were commercial. So a whole generation of kids believed that these bands were, in some way, anti-commercial, anti-establishment. But that had nothing to do with reality, which was that the moguls were making huge bucks out of supposedly non-commercial music.

MG

You may want to do a little research, MG....

First of all, this music was, in fact, anti-establishment, protest oriented, anti-war and pro free speech music. It was not at all written to be used as pop ditties for selling soap and whatnot.

Secondly, if you seriously believe that paying $2-4 bucks for a record is the same as My Generation [read the lyrics of this tune, OK?] having "loadsamoney" then there is something dreadfully wrong with your thinking here.

Lastly, the commercial business side of selling music/albums/concerts/radio air time to listeners/advertisers in order for the bands to make a living has absolutely nothing at all to do with the use of it on car commercials today.

You apparently confuse the true nature of the songs and the value they had for us in the various struggles mentioned above with making money for the people who created it. Not the same thing....ain't even close, MG.

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

I think I might, just, agree with you, if you were talking about making ads out of Gil Scott-Heron's "The revolution will not be televised" or "Home is where the hatred is", or the Last Poets' "Run nigger" or "Niggers are scared of Revolution". But you're not, are you?

MG

[MoGrubb]

From Merriam Webster:

shyster - a person who is professionally unscrupulous especially in the practice of law or politics

I'm guessing "dumpy mama" thinks there may be some racist meaning to the word as well (?).

Adam's pique may stem from a conflation of 'shyster' with 'shylock'

http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-shy1.htm

......

...Whatever its origin, we use shyster to mean a person who uses unscrupulous, fraudulent, or deceptive methods in business....

Even though both shyster's and shylock's defined origins can be construed as anti-Semitic, it is not thought of in that light today, certainly not by me. A shylock is a money-lender, a particular kind of shyster, synonymous with a loanshark. Edited October 25, 2007 by MoGrubb

[JSngry]

All kinds of shit ends up being something else.

And yet life goes on.

[Tim McG]

This music was never intended to be fodder for cereal and car commercials....

I really think you're wrong there. That music was hyped as being not commercial in the sixties by the Clive Davises and Ahmet Erteguns of the world but what was happening was that, for the first time, hit albums were routinely outselling hit singles, basically because your generation had loadsamoney. Because of a slight historical disconnect (partly because so many of the big selling albums of the fifties and early sixties were jazz or jazz-related like Sinatra's), it was possible to persuade people (including the members of the new bands) that only singles were commercial. So a whole generation of kids believed that these bands were, in some way, anti-commercial, anti-establishment. But that had nothing to do with reality, which was that the moguls were making huge bucks out of supposedly non-commercial music.

MG

You may want to do a little research, MG....

First of all, this music was, in fact, anti-establishment, protest oriented, anti-war and pro free speech music. It was not at all written to be used as pop ditties for selling soap and whatnot.

Secondly, if you seriously believe that paying $2-4 bucks for a record is the same as My Generation [read the lyrics of this tune, OK?] having "loadsamoney" then there is something dreadfully wrong with your thinking here.

Lastly, the commercial business side of selling music/albums/concerts/radio air time to listeners/advertisers in order for the bands to make a living has absolutely nothing at all to do with the use of it on car commercials today.

You apparently confuse the true nature of the songs and the value they had for us in the various struggles mentioned above with making money for the people who created it. Not the same thing....ain't even close, MG.

Now if you are suggesting the Bubblegum Pop and later the Glitter Rock and Disco bullshit of the late 70s is commercial and therefore something nobody should complain about if it appears on TV commercials, then you would be right. Canned Heat [same All Over], Led Zeppelin [Rock and Roll], Buffalo Springfield [For What It's Worth], The Chambers Brothers [Time Has Come Today], O'Jays [Money] or Steppenwolf [born to be Wild], etc are not at all equatable with those venues at all and have no business being used on a TV commercial. The message in the lyrics [Led Zep being the least edgy, but surely not appropriate for a luxury vehicle] is being washed over in favor of a sound recognition/nostalgia teaser to get you to listen to the commercial. That is total bullshit and an insult to those of us who lived in those tumultuous times.

That is what I object to.

I think I might, just, agree with you, if you were talking about making ads out of Gil Scott-Heron's "The revolution will not be televised" or "Home is where the hatred is", or the Last Poets' "Run nigger" or "Niggers are scared of Revolution". But you're not, are you?

MG

Only if you discount the free speech movement, the anti-war movement and social change.

Not everything important is tied into race, MG.

[JSngry]

Only if you discount the free speech movement, the anti-war movement and social change.

Got any #s on what % of that same generation went Yuppie, not to say voted for Reagan, Bush, & Bush?

Myself, I'm a Boomer, and I got over it a loooong time ago.

[Tim McG]

Only if you discount the free speech movement, the anti-war movement and social change.

Got any #s on what % of that same generation went Yuppie, not to say voted for Reagan, Bush, & Bush?

Myself, I'm a Boomer, and I got over it a loooong time ago.

Not sure what you're meaning here, but there were plenty of conservatives and money grubbers in the Boomer Generation.

Why should that surprise anyone?

Edited October 25, 2007 by GoodSpeak

[JSngry]

Why should any of this surprise anyone?

[Tim McG]

Why should any of this surprise anyone?

It shouldn't.

My point went to disgust not to surprise.