Dan Gould Posted October 11, 2003 Report Posted October 11, 2003 Abso-f-ing lutely. When a seventy two year old man gets in the middle of things, goes straight at the pitcher and swings his left arm ... jeezus. And I can just see how the New York press will treat this. FUCKING CHRIST MILLAR JUST FLIED OUT. FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK Quote
Jim Dye Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Fair? Zimmer has a plate in his head from a beaning 50 years ago. Pedro nearly takes Garcia's head off, threatens to do it to someone else again. How would you react? Crazy! Quote
Matthew Posted October 12, 2003 Author Report Posted October 12, 2003 Fair? Zimmer has a plate in his head from a beaning 50 years ago. Pedro nearly takes Garcia's head off, threatens to do it to someone else again. How would you react? Crazy! Hah! Anytime a Yankee gets punked, that makes my day. Quote
Big Wheel Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 I think you could at least make a case that the beaning of Garcia was accidental, even though the timing was suspicious. Yes, Pedro usually has great control, but something was clearly wrong with his stuff in the first four innings. Even Fox's commentators noted that after Jeter's home run--the curveball was just not breaking very well at all. Maybe he was trying to gain an edge by scaring the Yankee lineup, maybe it was just a wild pitch. In any case, I was surprised to see Torre claiming after the game that the ball hit Garcia in the head, when it looked pretty obvious from replays that the ball struck him on the shoulder blade. Also, IMO it's also sorta arguable that Pedro had threatened to bean someone in the head again, if the only evidence is that gesture he made to the Yankee bench. Seems to me the TV commentators were trying to sensationalize the whole game a little bit. BTW, am I the only one who gets the impulse to stick it to my TV Elvis-style whenever Tim McCarver opens his mouth? Quote
BERIGAN Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 That Sox-Yankee game was just weird!!!(in case you didn't know that!) I was out of the house, so was just hearing about the near beaning and Pedro's pitching, on and off on ESPN radio. Joe Morgan said Pedro at some point had thrown 9-10 offspeed pitches in a row, it really sounded like he couldn't throw a fastball....Then I come home to see Pedro's antics. Pointing to Garcia, then his own head, time and time again. That pitch was clearly meant to hit him...he and Clemons love to hit guys, the closer to the head the better, IMO. ESPN kept running the Zimmer Vs. Pedro incident over and over, and it looks like Pedro grabbed 72 year old Zimmer on each side of his head to bring him down....I know if a little 72 year old came after me, I could somehow manage to keep from bringing him down to the ground face first. Pedro is a little prick, and now I won't feel so bad if/when the Yankees once again beat the Red Sox...they should have been more concerned about knocking the 41 year old out of the game..... Quote
Brandon Burke Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 I don't think Pedro tossing Zimm like a club bouncer was justified. Granted, in a situation like that, when you've got dudes coming at you from all angles, the natural reaction is to not give a damn and look out for #1. So I understand it from that angle for sure. That's just a primal thing. Anyone who's been in a fight before knows this. But all he really needed to do was simply get out of the way and usher Zimm along like a matador does a bull. Again, though, I wan't in the middle of that melle so I can't talk. When shit's real.....it's REAL so who knows how I would have reacted. Then again, I likely wouldn't have started anything with Posada from the mound either.... I'm both excited and worried about my Royals in 2004. The Beltran thing is a major concern, obviously. How long will they keep him? Will they get anyone for him? What about Randa? What about Ibanez? Etc. I'm confident that the starting rotation will have their act together by then, though. Affeldt will likely remain in the bullpen and Greinke looks very promissing. So that's comforting. Bring on Jayhawk hoops.......! Quote
Matthew Posted October 12, 2003 Author Report Posted October 12, 2003 Go Cubs! At least it looks like they'll make it. And thank all that is good: The Dodgers have finally been sold and are out of the Evil Empire. P.S. Welcome to the board a.j., nice to have you here. Quote
Dan Gould Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Forget the seventy two year old man excuse, who went after who? Zimmer went after Pedro, and threw a left hand when he did. Zimmer absolutely got what he deserved, and I think its quite possible that out of everyone, Zimmer is going to get fined or suspended. I saw in the paper that MLB expects coaches to act as peacemakers, not instigators. And what about the scrum in the Yankee bullpen? I thought I heard it was a fan jumping in, but it turns out to be a Fenway groundskeeper, assigned to the Yankee bullpen, who was cheering for the Sox and waving one of those rally towels. The Yanks told him to shut up or leave, and the next thing you know, the guys at the bottom of a pile and ends up in the hospital with CLEAT MARKS on his neck, back and arms. And that punk Karim Garcia bloodies his knuckle on the back of his head but says he didn't do anything to the guy. The Sox say groundskeeper may press charges and I hope he does. According to one of the Red Sox relievers, Nelson sucker-punched the guy. I mean, what's more likely-you're alone with the enemy, and you start swinging? I doubt it. And as far as Garcia/Pedro goes, number one, did anyone notice that Varitek set up on the inside corner? Or did Varitek know what was coming and was just offering Pedro some protection so he could claim it just got away from him. Yes, first base was open, but why load the bases with no outs? And as for Pedro and what he said, my guess is it was something along the lines of "I want to hit you in the head, I'll hit you in the head" because that pitch got close to the asshole's head when he ducked his head down. If he stands up and turns away, it hits him square in the back. Quote
Matthew Posted October 12, 2003 Author Report Posted October 12, 2003 The miracle of the Zimmer thing is this: He was able to remove his lips from Torre's ass long enough to get out there! Quote
Jim Dye Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 (edited) If you want to read some really funny stuff, check out the forums at nyyfans.com. Thread titles like: Pedro: Complete Pussy and The "Mike Tyson" of baseball: Pedro Martinez Edited October 12, 2003 by Jim Dye Quote
Soulstation1 Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 that's like throwning your grandfather down.... ss1 zimmer did eat a dirt samwich. Quote
Dan Gould Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 If you want to read some really funny stuff, check out the forums at nyyfans.com. Thread titles like: Pedro: Complete Pussy and The "Mike Tyson" of baseball: Pedro Martinez Well, the people at that board won't let people register from hotmail.com or yahoo, which is freaking ridiculous, so I had to use my work e-mail, so I can't post any messages before Monday to show those morons why everyone else in baseball recognizes that Zimmer is in the wrong. Probably just as well, as by that time, Zim will have been suspended or fined and I'll be able to point that out to the loser Yankee fans. But, I did just get an awfully nice chuckle out of their registration message: "Thank you for registering, Yankees SUCK ASS. An e-mail has been dispatched ...." How much do you want to bet my registration will be deleted by the time I get to the office tomorrow? Quote
Dan Gould Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 (edited) Anyone with real player needs to check out rtsp://necn.mirror-image.com/media/video/101203_pedro_12p.rm for an "exclusive" first base-side view of the Pedro/Zimmer clash. Its about 35 seconds long, but around 13 seconds in, you see Zimmer, eyes ablaze, and in the next frame you can see that Zimmer has his hands balled up in a fist, and then Pedro is flipping him over. SUSPEND ZIMMER NOW! Hey, it worked on Greg, maybe it will work here. EDIT: Or, go to: http://www.boston.com And the link to the video is just below the headlines. Edited October 12, 2003 by Dan Gould Quote
Noj Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 (edited) As a Dodgers fan, I could care less about either of these teams--just to let everyone know I'm impartial. From what I saw, Zimmer was running and appeared to be throwing something of a punch with his left just as he got to Pedro. My dad and I agreed that Pedro should have just side-stepped him and avoided him, but we also agreed that Pedro seemed suprised. Maybe he expected Zimmer to stop and confront him verbally rather than physically, and didn't have time to do anything else. I dunno, an old man like Zimmer, you'd think Pedro could have just grabbed him. Either way, I thought Pedro's gestures to the Yankee bench in the top half of the inning showed a lack of class. Edited October 12, 2003 by Noj Quote
Dan Gould Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 I suggest you look at the video I linked above. Zimmer's eyes look like saucers and both fists are clenched. What else is Pedro supposed to do? I agree that grabbing him by the head was not the best method, but then again, look at old Zim. Try grabbing him and NOT getting his head! And as for Pedro's mouthing off-it all came about because of Garcia's nonstop cursing when he ran off the field following his dirty slide into the second baseman. Garcia walks off the field, nothing happens. Pedro said nothing and made no gestures until Garcia and the rest of the Yankees started yelling. Quote
Noj Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Dan, I definitely didn't mean to say that it was Pedro's fault, and I think Zimmer behaved foolishly. I was with the announcers on Pedro's gestures to the Yankee bench, but who knows what was really being said. Quote
ghost of miles Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 I'm just glad that Clemens beat Martinez this time around (in the 1999 ALCS he got blown out of the game at Fenway). I didn't see the game, but most of the accounts I've read on the Web today lean towards the opinion that Martinez was going after Garcia. C'mon, guys, the Bosox ain't no saints either, and I say that as somebody who roots second for them after the Yanks. At least the news from the NLCS is all good--unless you're a Marlins fan! Quote
ghost of miles Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Sounds like MLB took a pretty evenhanded stance in meting out punishment: Martinez, Ramirez, Zimmer and Garcia fined By RONALD BLUM, AP Sports Writer October 12, 2003 BOSTON (AP) -- Pedro Martinez and Manny Ramirez of the Boston Red Sox were fined Sunday along with Don Zimmer and Karim Garcia of the New York Yankees for their actions in Game 3 of the AL championship series. Bob Watson, baseball's vice president in charge on discipline, did not announce specifically why the four were being fined, other than to say it was for their behavior in the fourth inning of Saturday's game. The amounts of the fines were not disclosed. Quote
Dan Gould Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 OK, well, Zimmer should have been suspended. A coach is supposed to be a peacemaker not an assailant. (Has anyone looked at that video I linked to? I'm not saying that its the zapruder film, but it does show you what came at Pedro rather than the common view of Pedro looking toward the dugout, saying "what?" and then flinging a senior citizen to the ground.) Is Manny fined for "over-reaction"? I assume Pedro is fined for pointing at his head and saying whatever it was he said. Why is Garcia fined? For screaming "F-You" at Pedro on his way to the dugout? That's the only thing he did, the takeout slide at second was dirty but part of baseball. Well, we still have hope that Nelson and Garcia will be arrested. The latest is that the Boston PD is asking for witnesses to come forward so they can sort out who started what. But a Red Sox reliever and Boston policemen in the bullpen confirmed the account that Nelson sucker-punched the groundskeeper. What else do you need? Quote
BERIGAN Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 (edited) Dan, I checked out the video, and I don't think it proved anything except that Pedro is a pussy thru and thru, standing back from the action.(I know, he just wanted to stay in the game) Who knows what he had said to Zimmer and the rest of the Yankee dugout. He just was glad to mix it up with a man only 40 years older than him, and shorter to boot. He clearly is a poor sport for giving up some hits and reacting that way. Just like Clemons who also has pinpoint control, when they throw a ball at someone's head, it is always after giving up hits ....the pussy is incapable of winning big games, he belongs on the Braves...when his fastball is no longer over 90, I am sure we will sign him. Edited October 12, 2003 by BERIGAN Quote
ghost of miles Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Brother Berigan, verily, I hardly believe mine eyes... are you defending the Yankees, even if only indirectly? The world has indeed changed! I'll get those "I bark for Clark" campaign buttons in the mail to you tomorrow! Quote
ghost of miles Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Well... at least the Cubbies have Prior and Wood for Games 6 & 7 (if necessary)--and it'd be nice to see them take the pennant at Wrigley. Quote
JSngry Posted October 12, 2003 Report Posted October 12, 2003 Zim is a trip. Has been for as long as I can remember. If there was true justice in the cosmos, he would still be managing the Cubs as they prepare to meet their destiny, whatever that proves to be. And Ryne, Dunston, Grace, & Andre would be his coaches. So would Billy Williams, Ron Santo, Don Kessinger and Ernie Banks. But not that damn Bob Buhl! Quote
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