AOW November 16-22 -SAM RIVERS Fuchsia Swing Song

[Man with the Golden Arm]

impossible has tagged me for the next pick.

Sam Rivers - FUCHSIA SWING SONG (click here to buy)

certain most everybody here has this title in one incarnation or another now that the disc is readily available as a connoisseur. while i know much has been written about it i am curious to hear some more visceral takes on what is probably one of my favorite albums (considering that i only first heard it in it's entirety with the release of the mosaic set). i have passed copies of this along to many, championing that it is the most solid showcase for that bridge from everything before the middle of the sixties to what is the future.

Edited March 31, 2006 by Jim Alfredson

[Rooster_Ties]

Great choice!!! "Beatrice" is one of the most beautiful tunes ever written, IMHO. I haven't picked up the Conn (yet), but have the Mosaic - and will certainly give this a listen soon.

[Big Al]

This could be the best AOW ever!!! I can't wait for this one to start up!

[jacknife]

Another for Fuchsia Swing Song. Just wondering if there is any difference in sound between the Mosaic, which I have, and the new Connoisseur, which I don't have.

[DrJ]

Killer choice!

In my view jacknife, there's a HUGE improvement in the sound of the new Conn compared with the decent but nothing special sound on the Mosaic. Not everyone seems to agree, but on my system and with my ears, the clarity and presence, not to mention the balance of the remastering (with a lot more low end and a lot less harshness in the highs) are all way better on the Conn. You can hear air going through the sax during the opening notes on "Fuchsia Swing Song" for example, and I could never hear that kind of detail on the Mosaic (or on the TOCJ I had for years for that matter).

[couw]

Cool cover version in Mr Golden Arm's avatar!

To celebrate this event, I made this one.

It's rather obvious but nevertheless also nice (I think). Big one? Click here: Sam Rivers - Fuchsia Swing Song (360 Kb)

[Man with the Golden Arm]

Very fresh couw...I am now waiting for Mr. Shat Cat to pop his head from the bell!!!

You can see by my limited photoshopability that I perceive this album a tad more optomistic than it's morose original...I guess Mr. Miles was holding onto all that straight magenta for Hutch and Moncur.

[AfricaBrass]

Great choice!!!!

I'll be joining in on the fun.

Tony, you're killing me!

I have the TOCJ and the River's Mosaic set. Is the Conn sound that much better? If it is, you know I'll have to buy it AGAIN!!

John, great avatar! I just sent you the files with 'ol James T. Cat.

[Brad]

I haven't listened to this in a loooong time, so this is a good opportunity. I'll pull it out tonight. I only the Mosaic so I guess that will just have to do .

[DrJ]

Tony, you're killing me! 

I have the TOCJ and the River's Mosaic set. Is the Conn sound that much better? If it is, you know I'll have to buy it AGAIN!! 

Yep, sorry, but it IS that much better, at least to my ears. Heck, start selling those BN cover animations and you'll easily have enough to afford all the CDs you want!

[AfricaBrass]

Tony, you're killing me! 

I have the TOCJ and the River's Mosaic set. Is the Conn sound that much better? If it is, you know I'll have to buy it AGAIN!! 

Yep, sorry, but it IS that much better, at least to my ears. Heck, start selling those BN cover animations and you'll easily have enough to afford all the CDs you want!

Thanks Tony.

I really love this album. I told myself that I was going to stop buying remasters of CDs I already had, but now I guess I'll have to make an exception.

Fortunately, this Conn is on sale at my local Tower.

Unfortunately, I spent my cd money yesterday.

I guess I'll be skipping lunch for the next couple days.

[king ubu]

I told myself that I was going to stop buying remasters of CDs I already had, but now I guess I'll have to make an exception.

I already tried that, too...

Good choice! Though I'll most probably listen to the Mosaic, and not (yet?!) pick up the new Conn, I'll enjoy hearing it again! Great album, great band, and one of the most individualist sax players of the era!

ubu

[sidewinder]

I'll look forward to giving this one another spin when I get back to my turntable. Good choice of media available between the NY USA pressing and the Mosaic. One of my all-time faves..

Edited November 14, 2003 by sidewinder

[king ubu]

Bringing this one up! It's Rivers time, guys!

The man is huge, has a huge discography, yet most of his records are quite difficult to find (at least this side of the water, high up in the swiss alps).

I hope I'll find the time to listen to Fuchsia Swing Song somewhen this week and type some of my ideas here.

And that's probably my favorite photo of the man:

ubu

[king ubu]

Then, this site provides more info on him than one earthly being could digest in a lifetime: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/RIVERS.disc.html

ubu

[clifton]

Outstanding! I've got the Mosaic set, and I'm not that much of an audiophile so I probably won't buy the Conn. For my Rivers BN fix I usually wind up with "Contours", however.

[skeith]

One of my all time favorite albums. Great tunes, great players and great playing. It's a monster.

[DrJ]

So I'll jump in with more detailed comment to get the dialogue rolling...

This album is a classic for so many reasons. The things that continue to knock me out the most are:

1. The absolutely perfect mix of musicians. For that moment in time you simply could not have picked four more simpatico players, their concept and approach meshes magically. I'm not sure it would have worked nearly as well 5 or even 2 years later; by that time there was enough divergence and change in approach for at least some of the players that the balance would have been lost, I believe. Rivers' chops have certainly continued to grow, but I'm not sure he's ever played a better session start to finish, and it's nice to hear him sticking with tenor throughout. A lovely sound, full yet craggy, intensely personal.

Tony Williams changed a lot over the next few years in particular - and personally, I don't think he was ever a more MUSICAL drummer than in that 1963-65 period. After that, to my ears, while obviously he was still a giant and played beautifully on so many occasions, he went in for greater and greater proportions of bombast and more rockish playing - not something I'm always against, but he had such a great thing going before, that ability to drive a group at will, steering it almost to his will, yet with great delicacy and taste. This music required that approach. His work on the title track is simply astonishing, as great as anything he recorded with Miles (including a tour de force like "Footprints" on MILES SMILES).

It's certainly too bad Lion didn't put this configuration in the studio more often that same year, though, who knows how much great music could have been put down? Maybe Rivers just wasn't up for it at that time. Both Rivers and Byard have that thing where they sound modern and advanced yet there are readily audible references to the whole of jazz history in almost every measure. Probably has to do with how they came up, their formative influences, paying some dues playing more traditionally, etc. Byard is clearly inspired, just stoked by what's going on around him and stoking the fires in turn. I've never heard him play better...he was so damn adventurous that in his playing on some sessions things would suddenly fall apart mid-tune as he'd paint himself into a corner...but here the music just flows.

Carter takes some hits on the board for his playing in other contexts, but I think he's the perfect man for the job here. His tendency to hold notes for a longer decay works in his favor for this music. As great as someone like Richard Davis might have ostensibly been here, I think he would have changed that delicate balance unfavorably, just as exchanging Williams for, say, Joe Chambers would have (another favorite of mine, but not the right man for this gig).

2. The "stick in the head" nature of the tunes...since the first time I played this album, they've become a permanent part of my consciousness. Simple and elegant melody lines, always kept in sight throughout the improvisations. One of the greatest jazz ballads ("Beatrice") ever written. The proof of this assertion is that Rivers (and others) continue to return to some of these tunes almost 40 years later.

3. Some would criticize the album for being too safe, not edgy enough...and certainly Rivers would range much further afield in the near future. But I think this wholly satisfactory straddling of past, present, and future is perhaps the greatest accomplishment of this session. This is the quintessential "inside/out" (rather than "outside/in") jazz album of the 60's, certainly one of the best of the rather large subset of Blue Note titles that fall into that camp, and the one I play for someone who has been bitten by vintage hard bop and then wants to start venturing beyond that.

If it seems like I'm gushing, I am. I have loved this album from first listen and have yet to tire of hearing it. Masterpiece.

[John Tapscott]

Listened to it yesterday from my Mosaic set. A wonderful, wonderful recording. One of those magical times when everything just fell into place and probably exceeded everyone's expectations. Tony Williams - simply magnificient. And I still have "Beatrice" running through my head this morning. I'm going to listen to this one again soon.

[JohnS]

I've not got a lot to say about this wonderful record. If Rivers never made another album his reputation would be assured. Byard adds so much to the success of the album, a touch of early Cecil Taylor here, a spot of stride there. The alternates are a real bonus, especially the blues. It's a shame these fade, it sounds like Rivers doesn't want to stop. A dream rhythm team too.

What more could you want. Five stars.

[JSngry]

For that moment in time you simply could not have picked four more simpatico players, their concept and approach meshes magically.

No doubt, and I think there's a Boston thing going on here, w/Carter being the ringer, although one who fits in perfectly (when he's good...). Kinda makes you wish/wonder if there's a treasure trove of live tapes from Boston from this time and a few years before, doesn't it?

That's one of, maybe, coming to it ex posto facto so to speak (ie - I didn't hear it when it was REALLY new), the things that makes this album so fresh for me - the lack of a "New York" vibe. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Far from it, of course. But I've always been a big enthusiast for Regional Cuisine, and this is no exception here.

[Man with the Golden Arm]

I was hoping for that call and going to sing praises myself of the whole Boston sinew running through the session. JSngry do you care to elaborate on the meat of those two vibes?? While I am not from Boston and removed from it's jazz more than I'd like (even though I can see it from certain lookout points) I can only imagine what must have been going on in those days. Little has been made of Herb Pomeroy's initiation of Rivers as well as Byard's hold on much of the educatable community at that time. Anyone here be familiar with what these guys might have been like 'live' as Jim alludes to? Twardzik was a legend for just a decade, Byard was at Lennie's and folks from "the city" were staking claim at Sandi's in Beverly, MA. To have been able to hear and just witness a barely drinking age Williams stoking (drj, it's truly perfect here as one can envision one of those cartoon trains taking tracks and all over the edge of some blind curving precipice while keeping right on course) behind someone of Byard's phenomenality must have been something to behold.

Edited November 18, 2003 by Man with the Golden Arm

[JSngry]

I was hoping for that call and going to sing praises myself of the whole Boston sinew running through the session.  JSngry do you care to elaborate on the meat of those two vibes??

Can't say that I'm well enough aware of the totality of the Boston scene to break it down into specifics, just that I hear a "difference" in feel and approach, and given the Bostonian roots and mutual admiration between Sam, Jaki, & Tony dating from their time together there, it seems only logical to me that there's that element to this music.

I guess I hear a more "fluid" approach to time, harmony, and timbre (did I leave anything out? ), one that feels comfortable being whatever it needs to be at the time, as opposed to the admittedly stereotypical "New York" vibe of that, or any other, time, which seems to be about finding "it", whatever "it" is at any given tiome, and just nailing the shit out of it the very best you can.

Again, one way is in no way "better" than the other. They're just different, that's all. Maybe what I hear on FSS isn't a Boston thing as much as it is a Sam/Jaki/Ron/Tony thing. Could be. But you can't overlook the influence of Bostonians Alan Dawson and, earlier, Roy Haynes on Tony at this stage of his development, as well as Twardzick's general eccentricism on Byard (although given their respective ages, it's possible that it's the other way around!). Sam's always been Sam, I gather, but Boston certainly seemed to be a good fit for him in terms of having a town to keep busy and develop in. Definitely an area I need and want to learn more about, that's for sure.

Like the discussion of Chicago elsewhere, I think it's a concept worth considering that although New York might have long been the "final step" in perfecting one's craft/art, and definitely in getting one's career into full gear, it has not necessarily always been the place where a lot of great musical personalities get formed. Refined, defined and finished (in several different ways, possibly...), yes. But actually formed? That can happen anywhere. And does!

Edited November 18, 2003 by JSngry

[couw]

Like the discussion of Chicago elsewhere, I think it's a concept worth considering that although New York might have long been the "final step" in perfecting one's craft/art, and definitely in getting one's career into full gear, it has not necessarily always been the place where a lot of great musical personalities get formed. Refined, defined and finished (in several different ways, possibly...), yes. But actually formed? That can happen anywhere. And does!

--and is maybe even more probable to occur in relative seclusion, no?

[couw]

I have been spinning this album non-stop this morning and last night and I like the hell out of it, but have a real hard time nailing it down. The music is definitely inspired, at times sounds haunted, and there's a lot of blues in it. Other than those incredibly non-expressive qualifiers (how DO you come up with it couw...!) I have to agree with DrJ on the tunes entering my subconsciousness the first time I heard them never to leave the place, probably as long as I live. Now THAT's definitely worth something in my book.