Guy Berger Posted January 2, 2012 Report Posted January 2, 2012 I was just listening to Charles Lloyd's Of Course, Of Course, which was recorded in 1964-65, and was wondering about this topic. Most of the great jazz guitarists of the 60s - Green, Burrell, Montgomery, etc - were working within various variants of the bebop style. (Even on post-bop recordings - think of how hard Miles struggled to find a guitarist for his late 60s bands!) By the late 60s we start getting a proliferation of post-bop and avant-garde guitarists cropping up all over the place. But what are the first recordings to feature a guitarist moving outside of bop - harmonically, rhythmically, or melodically? Obviously there is Szabo who started doing this around 62-63. Atilla Zoller, a little later (64? 65?). Sonny Sharrock starts showing up on recordings in 1966 (is there anything earlier?). I haven't heard Larry Coryell or John McLaughlin from this period. What about Jim Hall? Some of the stuff with Chico and Giuffre is definitely outside bop's sound world. And of course, the various guitarists in the Tristano circle. Quote
sonnymax Posted January 2, 2012 Report Posted January 2, 2012 When someone mentions Jim Hall (and I think he fits in with the discussion you've raised), I like to add another name: Joe Diorio. Terribly underrated, imo, his sound and style is beautiful yet chock full of ideas that keep you thinking. Quote
Ted O'Reilly Posted January 3, 2012 Report Posted January 3, 2012 See if you can find some of Sonny Greenwich's '60s recordings... Quote
robertoart Posted January 4, 2012 Report Posted January 4, 2012 Interesting topic. John Patton's late sixties Lp's with Jimmy Ponder and James Blood Ulmer. Also Calvin Keys. George Benson on one of Larry Young's Blue Note sessions. Quote
Guy Berger Posted January 4, 2012 Author Report Posted January 4, 2012 Interesting topic. John Patton's late sixties Lp's with Jimmy Ponder and James Blood Ulmer. Also Calvin Keys. George Benson on one of Larry Young's Blue Note sessions. I haven't heard the Benson recording in question. How does he play? On "Paraphernalia" (from Miles in the Sky) he doesn't sound particularly comfortable in a more adventurous format. Quote
robertoart Posted January 4, 2012 Report Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) The Benson track that came to mind is called "The Hereafter" from Larry Young's "Heaven On Earth", recorded only a few months before "Miles In The Sky". Benson definitely sounds more "out" on this than usual. Still, it is a later 60's era recording, as were the other examples I mentioned. I was trying to think of your question in regard to players emerging at the time from an American context, as Szabo and Zoller both learned their music in Eastern Europe (and Mclaughlin in Britain). I know Joe Diorio is mentioned in an interview by Wes Montgomery, so he must have had the ear of musicians by the late sixties or earlier perhaps. Edited January 4, 2012 by freelancer Quote
Rooster_Ties Posted January 4, 2012 Report Posted January 4, 2012 Anything in the Sun Ra catalog qualify? Practically all the Sun Ra "with guitar" I can think of is either from his brief, late 70's 'disco' era -- and some rather 'inside' (if still quirky) players on several recordings in his last decade of Ra's work. Anything earlier? Quote
Shawn Posted January 4, 2012 Report Posted January 4, 2012 Larry Coryell. Pretty much anything he recorded with "The Free Spirits" or "Gary Burton Quartet", plus his own albums and Chico Hamilton's The Dealer. Quote
7/4 Posted January 4, 2012 Report Posted January 4, 2012 Larry Coryell. Pretty much anything he recorded with "The Free Spirits" or "Gary Burton Quartet", plus his own albums and Chico Hamilton's The Dealer. At least Larry's going to say it was him. Quote
JSngry Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 Szabo, chronologically, unless you want to count Joe Cinderella. Quote
Shawn Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 Larry Coryell. Pretty much anything he recorded with "The Free Spirits" or "Gary Burton Quartet", plus his own albums and Chico Hamilton's The Dealer. At least Larry's going to say it was him. So far that's what my ears are telling me, I have never read an interview with Coryell so I don't know how he sees it. Quote
7/4 Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 He's said he's the first fusion guitarist. Quote
Chuck Nessa Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 He's said he's the first fusion guitarist. What an amazing achievement! Quote
paul secor Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 He's said he's the first fusion guitarist. What an amazing achievement! Quote
Joe Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 Szabo, chronologically, unless you want to count Joe Cinderella. I am totally counting Joe Cinderella. His playing on Gil Melle's Prestige recordings in particular in incredibly advanced (at least to these amateur ears). Quote
7/4 Posted January 5, 2012 Report Posted January 5, 2012 He's said he's the first fusion guitarist. What an amazing achievement! I wouldn't loose too much sleep over it. Quote
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