iTunes - new version

[JSngry]

Trying to keep myself from having a hard time...all I use iTunes for is to load stuff on my iPod. Been using the Windows version for a while now w/no real issues (can't say the same about the iPod, though, but...). Has there ever been a time when an older version of iTunes has gotten so obsolete that it more or less shuts itself down, or something weird like that? I know RealPlayer (shudder/shiver/reach for sharp objects) would do that sometimes.

Basically, I'm of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. My iTunes ain't broke (although it does seem to have more features than I need, but you can't get an iPod to work without it, right?). Aside from a hard drive crash or something like that, will there come a time when I have to get a newer version of iTunes? And if so, will it have to be the very latest version, whatever that is?

[JSngry]

That Cover Flow carousel of album covers was something I would play with just for fun. It was like having a jukebox in my lap, which in real life would not be something to enjoy.

[Jim R]

I see some things as a little better and some a little worse, but nothing radical either way.

Considering the fact that most of us here have large collections, I'm kind of amazed that nobody but me seems to be complaining about (or just disappointed with) the new search function. As I said, I used it frequently, and it was an amazing tool. The way it worked in 10.7, you could (for example) search for all the versions of "Walkin'" by Miles Davis, just by typing in "Miles walkin". Because I stored personnel data in the "comments" field, I could even add a third element in the search- the name of a sideman. You could just type in the text ("Miles walkin Cannonball"), and every track containing those words would come up in a list (not a dropdown menu), which you could scroll through, sort, edit, whatever. Just an amazing resource, not just to find something to listen to, but to look at things like a discographer, or to edit files as a group.

They have almost completely taken that function away now. I miss cover flow like most people who are unhappy with 11, but that's a relatively minor beef for me, compared to the butchering of the search function.

I've been on the Apple forums looking for info on downgrading/reverting back to 10.7, and there's one person who is telling me I can easily achieve it by using Time Machine (which we bought along with an external backup drive about two years ago). If anybody here has thoughts on this, I'm still seeking more opinions from anyone who is computer savvy.

[Jim R]

Okay, time to step up and admit when I'm (at least partially) wrong. Score one for Shawn and others who urged patience and study...

I just found something that tempers my frustration and disappointment (I still think I may go back to 10.7 if it's not too difficult, though). After spending many hours over the past few days seeking info about 11, I just discovered that the search function was not in fact ruined. Going to the dropdown menu under the search window's magnifying glass, you can de-select "search entire library" (not sure why this was set as a default setting when I upgraded), and it seems to work pretty much the way it used to- even finding criteria from multiple fields as I described above, and bringing them up in a list that can be interacted with. I guess tutorials (and just about every damned review I've read) don't have time to get into these kinds of details.

[Eric]

I see some things as a little better and some a little worse, but nothing radical either way.

Considering the fact that most of us here have large collections, I'm kind of amazed that nobody but me seems to be complaining about (or just disappointed with) the new search function. As I said, I used it frequently, and it was an amazing tool. The way it worked in 10.7, you could (for example) search for all the versions of "Walkin'" by Miles Davis, just by typing in "Miles walkin". Because I stored personnel data in the "comments" field, I could even add a third element in the search- the name of a sideman. You could just type in the text ("Miles walkin Cannonball"), and every track containing those words would come up in a list (not a dropdown menu), which you could scroll through, sort, edit, whatever. Just an amazing resource, not just to find something to listen to, but to look at things like a discographer, or to edit files as a group.

They have almost completely taken that function away now. I miss cover flow like most people who are unhappy with 11, but that's a relatively minor beef for me, compared to the butchering of the search function.

I've been on the Apple forums looking for info on downgrading/reverting back to 10.7, and there's one person who is telling me I can easily achieve it by using Time Machine (which we bought along with an external backup drive about two years ago). If anybody here has thoughts on this, I'm still seeking more opinions from anyone who is computer savvy.

Not only did they kill the cover flow, but they also removed the cover art from the sidebar view. I know it is now at the top, albeit in a smaller version (which can be clicked on to produce the larger image). Makes you wonder why they decided to semi-crap on the whole cover art concept? Like Jim, I never really used cover flow other than for fun, but it was fun

[Noj]

Okay, time to step up and admit when I'm (at least partially) wrong. Score one for Shawn and others who urged patience and study...

I just found something that tempers my frustration and disappointment (I still think I may go back to 10.7 if it's not too difficult, though). After spending many hours over the past few days seeking info about 11, I just discovered that the search function was not in fact ruined. Going to the dropdown menu under the search window's magnifying glass, you can de-select "search entire library" (not sure why this was set as a default setting when I upgraded), and it seems to work pretty much the way it used to- even finding criteria from multiple fields as I described above, and bringing them up in a list that can be interacted with. I guess tutorials (and just about every damned review I've read) don't have time to get into these kinds of details.

I found that drop down and it still didn't work for me. The search function still doesn't access my iPod, it only searches my iTunes library. Maybe it's because my machine is back on Snow Leopard, and not the current OS. I had high hopes that changing that search setting would alleviate my problem, but it didn't. Still bitter over here.

[Jim R]

Okay, time to step up and admit when I'm (at least partially) wrong. Score one for Shawn and others who urged patience and study...

I just found something that tempers my frustration and disappointment (I still think I may go back to 10.7 if it's not too difficult, though). After spending many hours over the past few days seeking info about 11, I just discovered that the search function was not in fact ruined. Going to the dropdown menu under the search window's magnifying glass, you can de-select "search entire library" (not sure why this was set as a default setting when I upgraded), and it seems to work pretty much the way it used to- even finding criteria from multiple fields as I described above, and bringing them up in a list that can be interacted with. I guess tutorials (and just about every damned review I've read) don't have time to get into these kinds of details.

I found that drop down and it still didn't work for me. The search function still doesn't access my iPod, it only searches my iTunes library. Maybe it's because my machine is back on Snow Leopard, and not the current OS. I had high hopes that changing that search setting would alleviate my problem, but it didn't. Still bitter over here.

Sorry to hear that, Noj. I'd sync mine and see if I could help find any solutions, but I don't want to sync my iPod yet (I still haven't synced it since the "upgrade", and in case I go back to 10.7, I don't want to subject it to anything weird).

So, anybody else using Time Machine to backup their Mac data?

[mjzee]

I have it running, but have never had to "use" it.

[Shawn]

So, anybody else using Time Machine to backup their Mac data?

The reason they are saying you need Time Machine (or any type of backup program) is because you need to restore the previous 10.7 version of your iTunes folder (which contains the library files, those were converted when you installed 11). If you installed 10.7 now it wouldn't be able to read the library files, that's why you need prior copies from your backup.

[Jim R]

So, anybody else using Time Machine to backup their Mac data?

The reason they are saying you need Time Machine (or any type of backup program) is because you need to restore the previous 10.7 version of your iTunes folder (which contains the library files, those were converted when you installed 11). If you installed 10.7 now it wouldn't be able to read the library files, that's why you need prior copies from your backup.

Understood, but I'm still in a state of limbo when it comes to feeling ready to try anything. The reason is that even the most detailed tutorials that I find in the various Mac discussion forums invariably leave out some details that a novice would need to understand. People always take shortcuts when listing steps, and make assumptions about how much everybody understands their directions. There are different methods for downgrading back to 10.7, but although the methods that employ Time Machine are a bit simpler, I still haven't found one that I can follow completely. For example, something like: "Step 1: delete iTunes 11 using Terminal. 1) In the terminal, run: sudo rm -rf /Applications/iTunes.app 2) Also in the terminal: open ~/Library/Music".

I do have an application called Terminal, which I've never used or even opened, and didn't even know I had. I opened it just to see if I could make sense of these directions, but I couldn't. And I have no idea what "sudo rm -rf" means. And this was one of the better tutorials I found. Anyway, that's just one example.

I feel like I'm much closer to grasping the overall process, but threads on those forums are generally inactive, and people often don't return to answer follow-up questions. Even when they do, they invariably continue to fail to explain things in sufficient detail.

[Shawn]

I would not recommend using Terminal unless you are a serious power user.

[.:.impossible]

I rip discs to my server. iTunes has always been terrible for anything but ripping directly to the drive that the software is installed on, and of course buying music from iTunes. Two things I rarely do.

I haven't intentional opened iTunes in a long while.

I've never had any problems ripping to external drives, my iTunes media folder has never been located on an internal drive.

One of these days, I will take the time to figure this out I suppose. I use a Vortexbox to rip and serve music throughout the house. I go through phases where I am ripping multiple discs daily. iTunes has just become such a hassle for me that I've forgotten about it.

[Jim R]

Well, I finally took the plunge on downgrading from version 11 back to 10.7, after researching the hell out of it. I found a tutorial that I could follow with no difficulty (and I'm not anywhere close to being a computer geek), and this inspired me to go ahead. It required me to do three (free) downloads (a program called "AppZapper" to uninstall version 11; a program called "Pacifist" to perform a thorough installation of the 10.7 dmg file; and the 10.7 dmg file itself). Everything worked to perfection, and with Time Machine, I was able to restore my media files and the entire iTunes folder contents with a few mouse clicks. The only thing that was "difficult" about this operation was the wait. With over 300 GB of files, it took Time Machine roughly 6 hours to transfer all of my files from our external backup drive. I held my breath when I finished and opened the application, but somehow I knew it was going to work (thanks to the person who created the tutorial), and it did.

For anyone who may be considering this (whether or not you have Time Machine, even though it would be more tedious without it), here's a link to the tutorial: http://www.macworld.co.uk/ipad-iphone/news/?newsid=3415032&pagtype=allchandate

[Harold_Z]

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but so far I really like ITunes 11.

I'm not having any problems with it.

[Chuck Nessa]

I really hate it when people make things I like better. Couldn't they do something else?

[Noj]

The only problem I have is with the damn search not searching my iPod. That, and Cover Flow was cool.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Noj

[mjzee]

Thus far, I'm not seeing any advantages to the changes.

[Eric]

One of these days, I will take the time to figure this out I suppose. I use a Vortexbox to rip and serve music throughout the house. I go through phases where I am ripping multiple discs daily. iTunes has just become such a hassle for me that I've forgotten about it.

Not to hijack the thread, but would you mind to share more details about your Vortexbox setup? I went the Olive music server route a couple years ago and while their concept is cool, their execution (on both the hw and sw side) has been disappointing ...

Edited December 7, 2012 by Eric

[.:.impossible]

I already had a squeezebox, so I went with the vortexbox to rip and serve FLAC. I have the option to mirror to mp3 as well, but i dont have any real Daily need. Pulls in XM radio for me, we do some Internet radio here and there. I've become very comfortable with the terminal, having learned a bit of coding along the way. Lots of things you can do with open-source software.

[ElginThompson]

After watching the tutorial and spending some time with the new version, it does have some redeeming qualities. Seems easier to add albums to playlists ... kind of drop down (sidebar) menu vs. dragging.

Change is never pleasant, but we'll all get used to this one just like the 50,000 previous updates from the Mothership in Cupertino.

[Shawn]

So far it's really not that different based on how I used the software before. On the positive side it seems to respond faster (except for Search which clogs trying to load the drop-down list) and I like how the Album view was redesigned, I like the drop down with the songs instead of double clicking the cover to open a different window. I also like the "Add To Up Next" feature for building playlists on the fly, that's cool.

The major items that people are complaining about is Cover Flow being removed (which I never used in the first place) and the re-designed search that dropped the ability to search for anything other than Artist, Album, Song & Composer. I agree, that was a not a good move and hopefully they listen to feedback and return that functionality in the future.

To be honest though I didn't use the search function very often. I prefer creating Smart Playlists, I probably have 50 of them that kind of mirror the musical tangents I generally go on.

I'm not going to roll back to 10.7, it's not worth the effort.

[John L]

I already had a squeezebox, so I went with the vortexbox to rip and serve FLAC. I have the option to mirror to mp3 as well, but i dont have any real Daily need. Pulls in XM radio for me, we do some Internet radio here and there. I've become very comfortable with the terminal, having learned a bit of coding along the way. Lots of things you can do with open-source software.

One iTunes upgrade that I would welcome would be the ability to handle FLAC files, i.e. the ability to store them in the library and create MP3s from them when they are selected for loading into the iPod.

[Neal Pomea]

Seems easier to add albums to playlists ... kind of drop down (sidebar) menu vs. dragging.

I can't see how to name my playlists when ripping a commercial CD that already has metadata. iTunes names the playlist for me. I prefer to do this myself.

Haven't yet transferred music from a CD-R, but I suppose iTunes asks you to name the playlist yourself in this case. Is that correct?

[jazzbo]

I rename my playlists by double=clicking on the title in Playlist view and it opens the box for alteration. iTunes is going to treat a CDR as if it were a CD, that is it will try to access information from the database and will populate the information fields if the information is there.

Edited December 8, 2012 by jazzbo

[Steve Gray]

Seems easier to add albums to playlists ... kind of drop down (sidebar) menu vs. dragging.

I can't see how to name my playlists when ripping a commercial CD that already has metadata. iTunes names the playlist for me. I prefer to do this myself.

Haven't yet transferred music from a CD-R, but I suppose iTunes asks you to name the playlist yourself in this case. Is that correct?

When you rip a CD you are not creating a playlist at all. You are creating an entry in the iTunes media directory based on the artist name and album name.

If you rip a CDR, iTunes is unlikely to recognise it and you will have to enter artist , album and title data yourself.

The only time iTunes is likely to recognise it is if it is a direct copy of a regular CD.

Playlists are created manually by yourself. You can create a playlist that corresponds to an album you have ripped but there isn't a lot of point. A playlist is usually formed from selections by multiple artists and multiple albums.