Jazz albums reissued on CD by Atlantic Japan

[king ubu]

bump ...let me ask again: are we talking Warner Japan only? Or have those Euro-Wannabe-Makebelieve-Japanese reissues appeared recently as proper Japanases reissues and the remasterings used are identical?

[Clunky]

bump ...let me ask again: are we talking Warner Japan only? Or have those Euro-Wannabe-Makebelieve-Japanese reissues appeared recently as proper Japanases reissues and the remasterings used are identical?

I've assumed they use identical masterings. The only difference as far as I can tell is slightly cheaper printing stock is used in the Euro-wannabe.. CDs, and flimsier disc boxes.

[king ubu]

Okay, thanks!

[RiRiIII]

bump ...let me ask again: are we talking Warner Japan only? Or have those Euro-Wannabe-Makebelieve-Japanese reissues appeared recently as proper Japanases reissues and the remasterings used are identical?

I've assumed they use identical masterings. The only difference as far as I can tell is slightly cheaper printing stock is used in the Euro-wannabe.. CDs, and flimsier disc boxes.

I thought that these were actually the genuine japanese ones we get from cdjapan etc. Thanks. I am playin now "Rahsaan Rahsaan". Pretty good!

[Clunky]

bump ...let me ask again: are we talking Warner Japan only? Or have those Euro-Wannabe-Makebelieve-Japanese reissues appeared recently as proper Japanases reissues and the remasterings used are identical?

I've assumed they use identical masterings. The only difference as far as I can tell is slightly cheaper printing stock is used in the Euro-wannabe.. CDs, and flimsier disc boxes.

I thought that these were actually the genuine japanese ones we get from cdjapan etc. Thanks. I am playin now "Rahsaan Rahsaan". Pretty good!

i'm sure the ones from cdjapan are indeed Japanese manufactured discs. The "Euro-wannabe" discs are widely available in the UK and other parts of Europe at a low price ( £5). These look like Japanese discs in that they come with OBIs and full Japanese livery only written in very small font..... "Made in EU"

[king ubu]

often just 4.15€ at amazon.it, where I bought about two dozen ... and indeed "Made in EU" - but there's a lot more available in the Japanese batches (though I'm not sure all the wannabees are part of the Japanese reissue series, I lose overview of all these too quickly!)

[jazzbo]

The treble boost on the Warner Japan CDs is highly grating, but might compensate for thirty years of hearing loss.

On second hearing some BNLT999s have set me thinking after reading comments here. Unfortunately my equipment is all packed right now.

The two BNLA999s I've heard have not set me thinking (Bobby Hutcherson's Live at Montreux & McCoy Tyner's Extensions).

Interesting. Can't really say I hear treble boost in most of those i have.

The Blakey-Monk and Mingus clearly show a treble boost on my system, especially when compared to the Passions of a Man box set and the following release of the Blakey album.

I think you mentioned somewhere you can easily adjust the highs on your system so it is possible for you to enjoy most modern remasters?

I did not plan on ever discussing these Warner Japan Atlantic discs again, so this is likely the last time I will reply to this thread.

Sorry, I didn't see this post before. You're absolutely right, there could well be a treble boost on these that I don't notice as I have the treble dialed back considerably on my system as a default for CD, and if it's REALLY bad I'll notice it, so I guess that was an inaccurate statement on my part. I guess with the adjustments I've made these don't present an uncomfortable level of treble for me, and are an improvement over the earlier US versions I have in my opinion. I thank my lucky stars every day for the treble cut circuit on my amp placed right before the speakers, adjustibly shunting high frequency to ground outside the signal path. I avoid many of the problems that tone controls present and still can tailor the top end, which I am very sensitive to. I also can scal back the ribbon tweeters on my speakers and do. It makes cd buying easier for me.

I've picked up a few of the Coltranes in this series and am enjoying them, especially the two mono discs.

[king ubu]

I've picked up a few of the Coltranes in this series and am enjoying them, especially the two mono discs.

Ignorant question, apologies: which ones would those be? And was the Heavyweight box all in stereo?

[sidewinder]

I've just picked up 3 of them for £5 each from FOPP - Charles Lloyd 'Flowering of...', Duke Pearson 'Prairie Dog' and Gil Evans 'Svengali'. If I like the mastering of the Lloyd I'll go for some of the other titles of his.

Edited February 22, 2014 by sidewinder

[jazzbo]

I've picked up a few of the Coltranes in this series and am enjoying them, especially the two mono discs.

Ignorant question, apologies: which ones would those be? And was the Heavyweight box all in stereo?

Yes, I don't think there's any mono in the box set, unless some of the alternates are (haven't listened to those in ages).

There are mono "My Favorite Things" and "Giant Steps" from Japan in this series.

[king ubu]

Thanks!

[erwbol]

The treble boost on the Warner Japan CDs is highly grating, but might compensate for thirty years of hearing loss.

On second hearing some BNLT999s have set me thinking after reading comments here. Unfortunately my equipment is all packed right now.

The two BNLA999s I've heard have not set me thinking (Bobby Hutcherson's Live at Montreux & McCoy Tyner's Extensions).

Interesting. Can't really say I hear treble boost in most of those i have.

The Blakey-Monk and Mingus clearly show a treble boost on my system, especially when compared to the Passions of a Man box set and the following release of the Blakey album.

I think you mentioned somewhere you can easily adjust the highs on your system so it is possible for you to enjoy most modern remasters?

I did not plan on ever discussing these Warner Japan Atlantic discs again, so this is likely the last time I will reply to this thread.

Sorry, I didn't see this post before. You're absolutely right, there could well be a treble boost on these that I don't notice as I have the treble dialed back considerably on my system as a default for CD, and if it's REALLY bad I'll notice it, so I guess that was an inaccurate statement on my part. I guess with the adjustments I've made these don't present an uncomfortable level of treble for me, and are an improvement over the earlier US versions I have in my opinion. I thank my lucky stars every day for the treble cut circuit on my amp placed right before the speakers, adjustibly shunting high frequency to ground outside the signal path. I avoid many of the problems that tone controls present and still can tailor the top end, which I am very sensitive to. I also can scal back the ribbon tweeters on my speakers and do. It makes cd buying easier for me.

I've picked up a few of the Coltranes in this series and am enjoying them, especially the two mono discs.

Despite the 1999 US Blakey pictured above being better than the first US release (which reportedly had balance problems, everybody being on the left except Monk) there are other problems on the 1999 release which I hoped would be absent on the new mono disc. In my ignorance I concluded these problems were present on the stereo tapes. Unfortunately, the mono CD displays similar damage/limitations of the source material. This coupled with the to me noticeable treble boost made this Japanese disc a great disappointment.

It's a shame because a 2007 Japanese DSD remaster of Saxophone Colossus (presumably made from tapes the Japanese were sent in the distant past) showed less of the damage to the source material than the recent RVG.

Would these Japanese Warner titles have been remastered from true mono tapes? Were the Atlantic sessions recorded separately in both true mono and stereo, like Kind of Blue for instance?

Edited February 22, 2014 by erwbol

[David]

I've just picked up 3 of them for £5 each from FOPP - Charles Lloyd 'Flowering of...', Duke Pearson 'Prairie Dog' and Gil Evans 'Svengali'. If I like the mastering of the Lloyd I'll go for some of the other titles of his.

Sidewinder -- on my system, the Lloyd discs in particular are all noticeable improvements on the Collectables CDs. Some of these sessions (Soundtrack, for example), might not have been recorded well in the first place, so even with an "upgrade," they are okay at best.

The Collectables CDs are consistently poorly mastered, so I have welcomed these Japanese Warners as replacements, even if they aren't in the same league as the recent Japanese BNs and CTIs.

[jazzbo]

I've read in a number of places that these are dedicated mono mixes. Giant Steps is less "loud" than My Favorite Things, but the latter is not unlistenable. I really like the mono mix of both.

It sounds to me as if the master tapes are in pretty good shape. The multi-track masters of Atlantic may be gone in the fire, but the stere and mono masters apparently are still intact.

Edited February 22, 2014 by jazzbo

[erwbol]

I've read in a number of places that these are dedicated mono mixes. Giant Steps is less "loud" than My Favorite Things, but the latter is not unlistenable. I really like the mono mix of both.

It sounds to me as if the master tapes are in pretty good shape. The multi-track masters of Atlantic may be gone in the fire, but the stere and mono masters apparently are still intact.

I like the eighties Atlantic Jazz discs best for the Coltranes. Prophet Hoffman endorsed them on his board, and this was good advice. That board has its uses.

I've just picked up 3 of them for £5 each from FOPP - Charles Lloyd 'Flowering of...', Duke Pearson 'Prairie Dog' and Gil Evans 'Svengali'. If I like the mastering of the Lloyd I'll go for some of the other titles of his.

Sidewinder -- on my system, the Lloyd discs in particular are all noticeable improvements on the Collectables CDs. Some of these sessions (Soundtrack, for example), might not have been recorded well in the first place, so even with an "upgrade," they are okay at best.

The Collectables CDs are consistently poorly mastered, so I have welcomed these Japanese Warners as replacements, even if they aren't in the same league as the recent Japanese BNs and CTIs.

I had no real beef with the sound of the Lloyds I got besides them being loud. The music just didn't do enough for me.

[jazzbo]

I'm not as fond of those 'eighties ones as you are, or was not as fond. I looked and I do have a few still, but gave most of them away. In general I like the Heavyweight Champion set on vinyl the most, that's what I'm listening to most often these days. I do have a few earlier vinyl releases I've had for some time but they aren't in such great shape.

[king ubu]

It's a shame because a 2007 Japanese DSD remaster of Saxophone Colossus (presumably made from tapes the Japanese were sent in the distant past) showed less of the damage to the source material than the recent RVG.

I know this is off topic here, but since you mention it ... I wonder why anyone really needs those RVGs of Prestige material (or the Keepnews Editions or OJC Remasters) when the old Fantasy discs in almost every case seem to sound good? (I know, some OJC Remasters and Keepnews Edition discs contained bonus material or were hard to come by or not on CD before, so I went for them ... but in general, I don't quite see the point all that much there. Care to offer your opinion on this? Lon, too?

[sidewinder]

I've just picked up 3 of them for £5 each from FOPP - Charles Lloyd 'Flowering of...', Duke Pearson 'Prairie Dog' and Gil Evans 'Svengali'. If I like the mastering of the Lloyd I'll go for some of the other titles of his.

Sidewinder -- on my system, the Lloyd discs in particular are all noticeable improvements on the Collectables CDs. Some of these sessions (Soundtrack, for example), might not have been recorded well in the first place, so even with an "upgrade," they are okay at best.

The Collectables CDs are consistently poorly mastered, so I have welcomed these Japanese Warners as replacements, even if they aren't in the same league as the recent Japanese BNs and CTIs.

Thanks. So far only sampled the 'Svengali' but it sounds fine. I think I'll be picking up quite a few of these ! - sort of reminds me of the German Atlantic 'That's Jazz' series on vinyl back in the 70s (the ones with the trendy silver foil covers) when so much of this stuff was previously scarce over here. This series is even better though - some real obscurities (Fred Kaz?)

My 'Flowering of...' CD is an upgrade from an Atlantic cutout cassette picked up for 50p in about 1976. One of those cassettes with the solid plastic cases and paper cover.

Edited February 22, 2014 by sidewinder

[jazzbo]

It's a shame because a 2007 Japanese DSD remaster of Saxophone Colossus (presumably made from tapes the Japanese were sent in the distant past) showed less of the damage to the source material than the recent RVG.

I know this is off topic here, but since you mention it ... I wonder why anyone really needs those RVGs of Prestige material (or the Keepnews Editions or OJC Remasters) when the old Fantasy discs in almost every case seem to sound good? (I know, some OJC Remasters and Keepnews Edition discs contained bonus material or were hard to come by or not on CD before, so I went for them ... but in general, I don't quite see the point all that much there. Care to offer your opinion on this? Lon, too?

Well, with my system I can hear clear differences between the RVG and the earlier OJC and these new Prestige releases. I really do like the Prestige RVGs, they sound really good to me, very beefy and though others seem to slight their dynamics my system is very dynamic and they have dynamics to me. These sound sort of the way live music sounds to me when you're right up there either in front of or in the band. That's their appeal for me. These new masterings have a lot more inner detail, more as if you were sitting back in the control booth drinking it in or out in the middle or back of a club and absorbing it, more so at least in comparison to the RVG's more concentrated sound envelope. I like both those experiences! If I have an RVG of a title I've given away the regular OJC, there's nothing wrong with those, but like the BN Works from TOCJ, they just are sort of bland and uninvolving in comparison for me.

Each of our rooms and systems, and whether we are listening to 'phones or speakers in a room, I think lead us to like one or another of these different approaches to the reissues more. . . . I like the RVGs and I also like what I have heard of these new Prestige 7000 releases.

Edited February 22, 2014 by jazzbo

[mjzee]

Could someone provide links to a store that has the two Coltrane mono titles?

[etherbored]

well put, sir!

[jazzbo]

Could someone provide links to a store that has the two Coltrane mono titles?

Here's where I ordered mine.

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=WPCR-27101

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=WPCR-27201

[mjzee]

Could someone provide links to a store that has the two Coltrane mono titles?

Here's where I ordered mine.

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=WPCR-27101

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=WPCR-27201

Thanks. I saw both of these, but couldn't tell that the MFT was mono. I also noticed there was a subsequently issued MFT that's now out of print: http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=WPCR-25104

[jazzbo]

That's the one I ordered (it was in stock when I did order it) and the cd that arrived was the mono version. That item was pointed out to me elsewhere, correctly, as the mono version.

[king ubu]

Thanks Lon!