Hardbopjazz

Way Out West deluxe edition.

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February there will be a reissue of this great Sonny Rollins session. It will contain unissued music from this album. 

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On February 16, Craft Recordings will release a deluxe edition of one of the most iconic and enduring records in jazz. Celebrating the 60th anniversary of the recording session in 2017 and the 60th anniversary of the first stereo release of the album in 2018, Way Out West, alongside Saxophone Colossus, cements Sonny Rollins’ status as one of the top tenor saxophonists of all-time. This meticulously compiled package pays appropriate tribute to the importance of the landmark recording with an audiophile-quality pressing of the original album and a second LP of bonus material featuring rare and previously unreleased tracks from the legendary 3 A.M. session with bassist Ray Brown and drummer Shelly Manne. Both records are pressed at Quality Record Pressings (QRP) on 180-gram vinyl from lacquers cut by George Horn at Fantasy Studios. GRAMMY® Award-winning writer Neil Tesser contributes liner notes, which include excerpts from a recent interview he conducted with Rollins especially for this release. Rare photos by famed jazz photographer William Claxton round out the collection, which comes housed in a handsome, hinged box. More info below on the album and Rollins.

Way Out West (Deluxe Edition) will also be available at streaming outlets, mastered for iTunes, and in Hi-Res digital (96/24 and 192/24) on street date. Pre-order Way Out West (Deluxe Edition) on Amazon. 

Track Listing: 

Disc One - Original Way Out West Album
Side A
A1. I’m an Old Cowhand 
A2. Solitude 
A3. Come, Gone 

Side B
B1. Wagon Wheels 
B2. There Is No Greater Love 
B3. Way Out West 

Disc Two - Bonus Tracks from the Way Out West Recording Session
Side A
A1. Monologue: You Gotta Dig the Lyrics (previously unreleased) 
A2. I’m An Old Cowhand (alternate version) 
A3. Dialogue: Titling “Come, Gone” (previously unreleased) 
A4. Come, Gone (alternate version) 

Side B
B1. There Is No Greater Love (alternate version, previously unreleased) 
B2. Way Out West (take 1, previously unreleased) 
B3. Way Out West (alternate version)

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I'd prefer a release on SACD ....

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4 hours ago, mikeweil said:

I'd prefer a release on SACD ....

Why? This will all be be “pressed” from the same master, so there’d be no difference other than price.

Although I do find it curious they’re not releasing this on CD. 

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There are only two new alternate takes compared to the OJC 24bit remaster from a couple of years back.

Like Mike Weil, I's prefer a release on Hybrid SACD. Just the original album in pristine sound is often enough for me.

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Again, there would be no difference between CD and SACD unless they are two different masters. Their decision not to release a digital copy in physical form speaks volumes as to just how dead a medium it is, unfortunately. 

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On all hybrid SACDs I own the high resolution layer sounds better, simply because of the higher resolution compared to red book CD standards. Even when remastered from analogue tape. I have quite a few examples sitting on my shelves. And that resolution is higher than that of an analogue vinyl pressing. They all sound different, when played back on proper equipment. At least to my ears. It's all in the (re-)mastering.

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That last sentence was all you really needed to post. 

There is no higher resolution, just different sampling rates, and bit depth. Neither of which add anything that wouldn’t be audible on a redbook CD which offers a top frequency of 22.05kHz (well above the frequencies you or I can hear), and 96dB of dynamic range (and very few recordings will even use 30dB, with most being under 20dB). Interestingly, 24bit audio offers a dynamic range of 144dB. Just to give you an idea how absurd that is, the human eardrum ruptures right around 150dB. 

I remember years ago reading about different tests that were conducted by various audio engineers, and others, that found no difference between CD and SACD of identical material. I think those findings were published in some stereo journals and kind of led to the downfall of SACD. 

Edited by Scott Dolan

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I don't give a lip about bit-rates or whatever, I just want these unreleased things on something besides LP. The book looks fun, too.

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It’s indeed a headscratching decision. I’d like those books as well. I’m assuming the iTunes version will come with the digital booklets, but that’s hardly the same thing. 

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I am not buying this on LP just to get an enclosure, a booklet, 2 pieces of chatter, and two previously unavailable alternates...unless it's at a price point that sounds right for that little bit of extra, and that doesn't seem likely. They should at least include a download cod with this. No mention of that, right?

I love Sonny Rollins, and this is one of my most favorite albums, period, but I know when I'm getting played by the fetishist industry.

Oh hell no, $70+?

https://www.amazon.com/Way-Out-West-LP-Deluxe/dp/B0742VSHG9/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1513723811&sr=8-1&keywords=Way+Out+West+%28Deluxe+Edition%29

Fuck these assholes. I'll find some other way.

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1 hour ago, Scott Dolan said:

What do you mean by “download cod”? 

48995091-Face-A-Senior-Man-Finding-Seafo

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:D 

Well, he’s right. They definitely DO NOT mention that! 

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Deal-breaker, no code for cod, no way out, suckers who bite this overweighed fest.

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Again Scott's tired old tirade against high def. releases. The reason to buy these audiophile Hybrid SACD reissues, whether one listens to the CD or SACD layer, is the superior mastering by people like Kevin Gray. Something he wouldn't have any knowledge of because he never invested in such releases. Kevin Gray's 1998 mastering of Thelonious Monk's Monk's Music (mono) on CD for Analogue Productions, for example, is so much better than the later 20bit K2 release of the mono recording it is impossible not to notice. It all comes down to whether you are willing to pay premium for a reissue that makes classic albums sound as good as they possibly can.

Craft Recordings is of course not an audiophile reissue label like MFSL, ORG, etc. so at $70+ this Way Out West is indeed a major rip off. And there are only two new alternate takes here.

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2 hours ago, erwbol said:

Craft Recordings is of course not an audiophile reissue label like MFSL, ORG, etc. so at $70+ this Way Out West is indeed a major rip off. And there are only two new alternate takes here.

Same here .... and there ist still a "chance" that at the 65th anniversary another two alternates will show up .... having gone through the same rebuying process like many other board members here I`m getting tired with offers like this one (even if the art work looks very interesting) ....

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7 hours ago, erwbol said:

Again Scott's tired old tirade against high def. releases. The reason to buy these audiophile Hybrid SACD reissues, whether one listens to the CD or SACD layer, is the superior mastering by people like Kevin Gray. Something he wouldn't have any knowledge of because he never invested in such releases. Kevin Gray's 1998 mastering of Thelonious Monk's Monk's Music (mono) on CD for Analogue Productions, for example, is so much better than the later 20bit K2 release of the mono recording it is impossible not to notice. It all comes down to whether you are willing to pay premium for a reissue that makes classic albums sound as good as they possibly can.

Craft Recordings is of course not an audiophile reissue label like MFSL, ORG, etc. so at $70+ this Way Out West is indeed a major rip off. And there are only two new alternate takes here.

 

I clearly stated that IF it is a separately mastered recording, then the SACD would be worth the investment. But anyone that has even lightly studied digital music understands that ANYTHING created for SACD can be replicated on regular CD. Only those who don't understand how sampling rates and bit depths work are dazzled by huckster numbers. 

And for the record, I have several Mo-Fi releases, a couple of 20bit remasters, and some Blu-ray audio releases. All of them are wonderful. All but the Blu-ray are on CD, and the only reason the Blu-ray isn't is because of the surround channels added. 

If it's a sound below 22.05kHz (higher than we can hear), or a change in amplitude under 96dB), it can be put on a CD. Period. It's simple science, not magic. 

As Mike perfectly stated above (as did you in one of your examples), it's all in the (re-)mastering. 

Edited by Scott Dolan

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BTW, I checked my Way Out West (Remastered) iTunes copy and it does contain the digital booklet. So it’s a safe bet this version will as well. Just a fyi for anyone that may be interested in the digital version. 

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19 hours ago, JSngry said:

I am not buying this on LP just to get an enclosure, a booklet, 2 pieces of chatter, and two previously unavailable alternates...unless it's at a price point that sounds right for that little bit of extra, and that doesn't seem likely. They should at least include a download cod with this. No mention of that, right?

I love Sonny Rollins, and this is one of my most favorite albums, period, but I know when I'm getting played by the fetishist industry.

Oh hell no, $70+?

https://www.amazon.com/Way-Out-West-LP-Deluxe/dp/B0742VSHG9/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1513723811&sr=8-1&keywords=Way+Out+West+%28Deluxe+Edition%29

Fuck these assholes. I'll find some other way.

Completely agree.  I bit on the recent Sonny Clark reissue because it contained an entire LP worth of alternate takes and cost $25 at my local record store--seemed reasonable for a well-done two-LP set.  But in general I have developed a real hostility for the inflated vinyl-fetishist market, where many releases cost 3-4 times what the CD version costs, or, as is increasingly the case, no CD version is made available at all.  (This applies to some recent new releases too.)  I can live with the Rollins Contemporary box set on this one, or the 2010 OJC reissue, and spend my $70 elsewhere.  Pass.... others, enjoy!  

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The lack of a download cod(e) is what sticks in my craw. I mean, ok, you've constructed a nice (I guess) "object". but its musical contents are mostly already available, and if you expect me, at my age, to pay that kind of money to play the records once to get the bits that have not been onto a CD or some other digital storage medium, then hahaha, Give me a download coed, drop the price down to 45 or so, and reel me in. But the conditions as currently laid out - no deal.

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2 hours ago, JSngry said:

The lack of a download cod(e) is what sticks in my craw. I mean, ok, you've constructed a nice (I guess) "object". but its musical contents are mostly already available, and if you expect me, at my age, to pay that kind of money to play the records once to get the bits that have not been onto a CD or some other digital storage medium, then hahaha, Give me a download coed, drop the price down to 45 or so, and reel me in. But the conditions as currently laid out - no deal.

Not sure how your wife would feel about you downloading a coed, but that’s for y’all to work out. 

My guess is that the company figures if you want a digital download, then that’s likely all you’d want. So they made it available. I doubt most, if not all, vinyl fetishists would care about being offered such tripe. Based on the current market, I can see why they made that decision. 

And here’s the thing: if they offered a download with the $80 vinyl set, would that be the tipping point for you to buy it? 

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$80 is not going to get me to bite at any of this. For the "deluxe" packaging (which I may very well find ephemeral, who knows?) plus the downloads ecod, I'm paying at most 50. AT MOST.

I mean, I am not the target market for this package, but I could be reeled in at the right price point. But 80 bucks, that's definitely "fuck you, chumps" territory.

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10 hours ago, soulpope said:

Same here .... and there ist still a "chance" that at the 65th anniversary another two alternates will show up .... having gone through the same rebuying process like many other board members here I`m getting tired with offers like this one (even if the art work looks very interesting) ....

Missed this earlier. 

This brings up an interesting point that may need its own thread, but have we (the royal we) finally reached our breaking point? Years ago it seemed as though most here, myself included, were always chomping at the bit for the latest “discovery” of material that’s at least as old as most of us, if not older. We fed that aftermarket, and kinda created a monster inadvertantly. 

But now it seems as though they’ve run out of viable material, and we’ve run out of the will to shell out even more of our hard earned cash for yet another 80/20 split (if we’re lucky) of material we already have multiple copies of, and a little extra material that may or may not even be worth hearing. 

Just weird to see this becoming the dominant mindset here. Death of Jazz, and all that...

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I’ll stick with the Contemporary vinyl !

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I'd gladly but a set like this, but not w/o digital, and definitely not at that price. And I am one of the more affectional Rollins-ites around. But I am not a sucker.

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