Rabshakeh

This might be a key distinction. If it is phrasing, then Frank Sinatra should certainly be a jazz singer through most of his career. If it is improvisation, then maybe no. But query where that leaves someone like Joe Turner. I think if you take it too far, then only the Sarah Vaughans, Betty Carters and Carmen McRaes would be jazz singers. Neither improvisation nor phrasing is going to squeak Rod Stewart through the door though, sadly. Yes. That's a fair point. Despite how core he is to the genre, Charlie Parker is quite esoteric!

Interesting. I agree, but I do like shops that have a single "Jazz, Soul and Funk" section. That feels quite natural.

There are also very varied approaches. Jazz vocals are sometimes regarded as an acquired taste, but I am pretty sure I could play that Nancy Wilson / Cannonball record to anyone and they'd bond with it immediately, perhaps perceiving it to be a soul record (which it is too). I'm less confident I could win someone over with a Betty Carter or June Christy record.

Otherwise it will just become the Maggie Nichols thread.

I am interested in forum members' views on this question. What brings Sarah Vaughan, Jimmy Rushing, Karin Krog, Nancy Wilson and Blossom Dearie together? There's a wide range of vocal styles there, from what would conventionally be seen as jazz vocals, to blues shouter to hipster singer songwriter to pure soul. Why are Louis Armstrong, Nat King Cole, Nina Simone and Frank Sinatra sometimes in this category and sometimes not, even when singing standards? Not interested in drawing sharp genre lines here, and more in your gut level responses to these artists and their music, and the question of what a jazz vocalist *is*. For the present, it is probably sensible to leave the avant jazz vocalists out of this.

Miroslav Vitous Group – Miroslav Vitous Group

Jazz Group Arkhangelsk – Portrait. Very impressed by this one.

How’s this one? Never seen it.

Stanley Turrentine - ZT's Blues Hard to understand how this one could have sat in the vaults so long.

A good weekend's listening.

RIP. Those solo records are great, alongside his more famous sideman stuff.

Jessie Allen Cooper - Soft Wave This is fun. New age blissed out smooth stuff.

I mean, it is clearly because his vision for what he wanted involved him soloing less on those records, from Weather Report onwards. He's not the only one. Pharaoh Sanders for example sat out on his own records all the time, then came in at the points he needed to. But Shorter's music is completely different to Sanders', and, whereas I am generally happy to listen to whatever musicians were in Sanders' band at the time vamp away, I do find that I miss Shorter's solos. Not so much on the Weather Report records, where there's plenty happening, as on the VSOP and 'Footprints' records. Hopefully with time some of those live gigs you're all referring to above will start to surface as recordings. I'd love to hear that. Particularly for the later group (the so called Footprints group).

I don’t know what the anti Weather Report stuff is on here. Early Weather Report delivered on the promise of In A Silent Way more than any other group or artist I can think of. Late Weather Report (A Sporting Life?) is its own weird thing. Whatever it is, it’s great stuff. In between, some awesome jazz records. But, to my taste, the only down side is that Shorter quietened down from around 1972 onwards, no matter whose albums he was playing on. I don’t know the “old argument” referred to here. But surely anyone who followed Shorter’s career has come to the view that he did not play as much as we would have wanted on his own records. That’s true even of those great 90s/00s records.

The reissues are weirdly expensive too, considering how little Frank Wright reissues go for.

He seemed to sit out a lot of the time on Weather Report's records.

How is this? A friend of mine was in a teenage black metal band and took the "nom de guerre" Mystagogue. I've always liked the word.

Ramsey Lewis Trio – Bach To The Blues Listening to this one for the first time. Expecting some Loussier nonsense and instead it is a great record. Any other lesser known Ramsey Lewis trio records anyone wants to push on me?

Okay. I shall.

Oh man. Clearly one of the greatest of all time. That's terrible news.

It's a fusion record from the 1990s, with Cobham in his more stolid mid tempo later style. The leads are guitarist Larry Carlton (perhaps too shreddingly fusion for my taste) and smooth jazz great Najee, who is really really good here in a less smooth context. Some jazz tunes on this too as well as fusion.

Now on: Najee is a lot of fun on this one.

Humair / Jeanneau / Texier – Akagera (JMS, 1982) Really enjoyed my first listen to this.

That’s the one. I can’t say that I cared for it. It seemed very much treacle pop, with settings and arrangements that did not suit either singer.