mjzee Posted May 23, 2009 Report Posted May 23, 2009 I've been puzzling over the cover to the Columbia album "The Jazz Messengers." This album was recorded in 1956. It appears to have been released in that year, judging by the Columbia logos in the upper-right corner. On the cover is a photo of Hank Mobley. Is that the original photo used on the cover? Because I note that it's the same photo used on the Blue Note album Hank Mobley - Far Away Lands. Far Away Lands was recorded in 1967. I understand that it wasn't released until around 1980. The photos on the Blakey album are credited to Don Hunstein. Does anyone have the Mobley album to see if Hunstein is credited there? I'd think that BN would use a Frank Wolff photo. Can anyone confirm that The Jazz Messengers cover is as was originally released? If so, anyone know the provenance of the Mobley photo? I am intrigued. Quote
JSngry Posted May 23, 2009 Report Posted May 23, 2009 Just had a look at my Mobley LP & there's no photographer credited, just "Design: Richard Mantel/Mantel Koppel & Scher". Also looked at my "six-eye" mono copy of the Blakey (nobody get excited, it's plowed all to hell, bought it at a thrift shop just to have as an "object") and it is identical to the one you posted. Hunstein is credited on the front cover there as well. The thing to remember is that at the time of the Far Away Lands issue, BN was not going so much for an "authentic retro" look. Hardly any, if any, of the vault material issues used Wolff photos or Miles-esque graphics. That came much later. So Richard Mantel probably had access & rights to the Hunstein photos and used them. Actually, when did the Wolff photo archives get sold? I'm thinking it was well after the 80s Blue Note relaunch. So blue Note (actually EMI) might not have had free access to that library like they do now. If I'm wrong about this, somebody bring the true facts, please. Quote
Michael Weiss Posted May 23, 2009 Report Posted May 23, 2009 My LP copy of Far Away Lands does not have a photo credit. Quote
mjzee Posted May 24, 2009 Author Report Posted May 24, 2009 The flannel pants Hank is wearing could be '50's, but the shirt seems very '60's. Quote
JSngry Posted May 24, 2009 Report Posted May 24, 2009 They wore shirts like that in the 50s. Check some of the old Blue Note session photos on the back of the albums. Ther ewas even a thread a loooooong time ago about the "Blue Note Striped Shirt". That might have even been on Board Krypton. Bottom line, though, is that the Columbia cover pictured is AFAIK the original for that album. I've never seen another , earlier one. Quote
jazzbo Posted May 24, 2009 Report Posted May 24, 2009 That's a fifties shirt, that's a fifties photo of Mobe. Quote
mjzee Posted May 24, 2009 Author Report Posted May 24, 2009 That shirt on the cover of the Savoy album exactly matches the Columbia photo. Great! Now let's discuss his having trouble keeping his head up... Quote
Bluerein Posted May 25, 2009 Report Posted May 25, 2009 The cd of FAL has no foto credits either. Mosaic (Michael Cuscuna) got all the Francis Wolff foto's from ALfred Lion in the beginning of the 80's just after Mosaic had started. Quote
Dan Gould Posted May 25, 2009 Report Posted May 25, 2009 The cd of FAL has no foto credits either. Mosaic (Michael Cuscuna) got all the Francis Wolff foto's from ALfred Lion in the beginning of the 80's just after Mosaic had started. This does not jibe with my memory. I thought they got the more or less complete set in the mid-90s, when the photography book came out and also when they started selling high quality prints/posters. If they had everything in the beginning of the 80s, why did they wait so long to take financial advantage of that treasure trove? Quote
JSngry Posted May 25, 2009 Report Posted May 25, 2009 The cd of FAL has no foto credits either. Mosaic (Michael Cuscuna) got all the Francis Wolff foto's from ALfred Lion in the beginning of the 80's just after Mosaic had started. This does not jibe with my memory. I thought they got the more or less complete set in the mid-90s, when the photography book came out and also when they started selling high quality prints/posters. If they had everything in the beginning of the 80s, why did they wait so long to take financial advantage of that treasure trove? Same here. But I'm not certain... Quote
mjzee Posted May 25, 2009 Author Report Posted May 25, 2009 IIRC, the answer can be found in the Cuscuna forward to the book "The Jazz Photography of Alfred Wolff." I never owned the book, but read the forward many times in book stores. Cuscuna talks about how the Mosaic Monk box was released, and got good press, and one day he received a letter from Mexico, in a handwriting he recognized, asking "Who are you and how did you get the rights to my BN material?" A correspondence ensued, and sometime later, Alfred entrusted Michael with a big trunk containing all of Francis's negatives. If anyone owns the book, it would be great if you could corroborate this. Quote
Dan Gould Posted May 25, 2009 Report Posted May 25, 2009 (edited) Lourie wrote the Forward, not Michael. As it turns out, neither Reinier nor I had it exactly right. Starting in 1986, Alfred selected photos and sent them for inclusion in the releases they were working on. After Alfred died in 1987, Ruth had the entire set sent to CT. I think what threw my recollection was that there was that it took quite a few years between the time they received the collection and when the book was actually published. Edited May 25, 2009 by Dan Gould Quote
mjzee Posted May 26, 2009 Author Report Posted May 26, 2009 I think it was also in this trunk that Michael found the song titles to the unissued Herbie Nichols material. Quote
bertrand Posted May 26, 2009 Report Posted May 26, 2009 No, the list of Nichols titles was in a trunk at his father's place which was later destroyed by a flood. I think the trunk contained some music as well. I believe the list was salvaged, and Roswell Rudd must have a copy. I would love to see this list to see how it differs from what was sent in for copyright. There are some tunes that are known which were not copyrighted. You can find the list of what was copyrighted at www.loc.gov; click on 'library catalogs', then do a 'basic search' by call number with the call number M1356.2 Bertrand. Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted May 26, 2009 Report Posted May 26, 2009 is that story true about how Lion sent cucscana a letter from Mexico? ?!??! have any of you ever heard that beforE? Quote
sidewinder Posted May 26, 2009 Report Posted May 26, 2009 They wore shirts like that in the 50s. Check some of the old Blue Note session photos on the back of the albums. Ther ewas even a thread a loooooong time ago about the "Blue Note Striped Shirt". That might have even been on Board Krypton. Bottom line, though, is that the Columbia cover pictured is AFAIK the original for that album. I've never seen another , earlier one. I've got a 50s Dutch original Phillips pressing of the album and the cover is as per the Columbia with the same Mobley picture as in 'Far Away Lands'. is that story true about how Lion sent cucscana a letter from Mexico? ?!??! have any of you ever heard that beforE? Well, he lived in Rancho Bernado near San Diego I believe, not too far from the Mexical Border. Quote
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