JSngry Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Getting back to the original question, I think the sound on them is just fine. I own two of them, am pleased with both and would buy more of them if I lacked whatever was contained in them and was interested in the music/artist. In most cases with these sets, I already own most if not all the original releases for those artists I'd be interested in. For the two I own, much of what's in the sets are OOP, hard to find, or only available at a prohibitive cost. For me, it came down to not having the music because it was unobtainable/too expensive or having the music (albeit, no frills) at a very attractive price. Apparently, I'm part of their target audience. Well, at least your logic is not that The Music Business Is Mean To People, Jim, I didn't search around a lot, but a quick search found this here, confirming what you (and I) assumed: http://www.christian...tput.html?id=87 Note that it's from 2007... and that Silver retired several years before that, even (2004 I think). Well, this is one of those times where I'd love to be wrong... Here's wishing Gregory all the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDK Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 And here I was wondering when we can finally stop calling music that's 50+ years old "modern jazz." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarThrower Posted February 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I called it classic jazz, but I was corrected! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigP Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I got no kicks against modern jazz Unless they try to play it too darned fast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMP Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 No topic seems to get folks going more than this one! Well, maybe Ron McMaster... Anyway, what about all those albums and CD's we bought from the Columbia Record Club and BMG - were the artists paid royalties on those? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETman Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 No topic seems to get folks going more than this one! Well, maybe Ron McMaster... Anyway, what about all those albums and CD's we bought from the Columbia Record Club and BMG - were the artists paid royalties on those? That would be huge negatory. Yet nobody seemed to care then. Oh, and you forgot the moanings and rantings of Keith Jarrett, or the dumbing down of high fallutin music by ECM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kh1958 Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Shouldn't those covers say, "Not Digitally Remastered...", or "Digitally Remastered by someone we did not hire or pay..."? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikelz777 Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Speaking of Keith Jarrett, when is someone going to release Keith Jarrett: The Non-Grunting And Groaning Recordings? I'd buy that no matter who released it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Shouldn't those covers say, "Not Digitally Remastered...", or "Digitally Remastered by someone we did not hire or pay..."? At the very least they should say, "If this is all you want, you can get it for free on the internet, so thanks for throwing your little bit of money at us and not saving it to spend on other stuff." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) I called it classic jazz, but I was corrected! Yep, if you must classify jazz, "Classic Jazz" = pre-bop, mostly 1920s jazz Some call it "Early Jazz" and some hardline purists even call it just "jazz". It's certainly not the bop-based "modern" jazz you were talking about. On the Hoffman board bop-based jazz from the 1950s and 1960s is systematically called "Classic Jazz", often by members who never seem to listen to pre-bop jazz or even don't seem to realize that there was an older kind of jazz. Edited February 27, 2012 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMP Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 The audio claims on some of those CD's are pretty ridiculous - "Digitally remastered for the finest sound ever," or something like that. Ha! But this whole discussion of royalties and copyrights is almost quaint in an age when many people don't expect to pay ANYTHING for their music! (I've bought thousands of CD's from a local retailer who is closing up shop next month.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) Let the record (again) show that my argument was never based on the morality (or lack thereof) in the realm of copyrights & royalties, just on how this type product leads to a further cheapening of the "record business" as a whole and that it's really pretty dumb to spend money on what are essentially CD burns. You can get that anywhere. That the industry itself has been built on some or more greed, deception, exploitation, and criminality is beyond dispute. Also beyond dispute is that at the end of the day, it worked, and it kept working. Buying box sets of CD burns and expecting that to become a viable ongoing business proposition for anything other than an eventual disintegration of quality product, annotation, and packaging is just about like buying stock in companies that outsource jobs and then wondering where all the jobs went. DUH! At some point, the back-catalog industry will settle in to a digital business model that works. If anybody is willing to encourage CD copies of "borrowed" masterings (and in some cases, straight-up needle drops) in cheapass bullshit packaging to become that model, then be my guest. Edited February 27, 2012 by JSngry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnS Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Back to the question, I have the Herbie Mann and that sounds okay to my old ears and modest equipment. I've heard of a faulty disc in the Red Garland set but soundwise it was okay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDK Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I'm assuming that the "sources" for these collections mostly come from existing CDs, so the sound should generally be pretty good except for whatever tweaking ("mastering") they might do, right? In any case, I already have so many classic Blue Note and Prestige, etc. albums that so far none of these cheap collections have even been tempting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I'm assuming that the "sources" for these collections mostly come from existing CDs, so the sound should generally be pretty good except for whatever tweaking ("mastering") they might do, right? In any case, I already have so many classic Blue Note and Prestige, etc. albums that so far none of these cheap collections have even been tempting. Some of these labels also use needle drops or even MP3s (the owner of a public-domain label said so on a bulletin board). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Lark Ascending Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 mp3s??????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 That's my reaction about the MP3s. The Three Sounds looks tempting but I haven't done anything yet. If it's MP3 forget it for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) Mind you, I didn't say they used MP3s - see post #40. Edited February 27, 2012 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul secor Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) How many times will exchanges like the ones in this thread be repeated? Edited February 27, 2012 by paul secor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA Russell Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I understand both sides of the argument, but I don't understand why there is so much negativity toward the Real Gone issues yet none toward the Chronological Classics issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 How many times will exchanges like the ones in this thread be repeated? Probably as long as these labels are doing what they're doing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) <br>I understand both sides of the argument, but I don't understand why there is so much negativity toward the Real Gone issues yet none toward the Chronological Classics issues. Because Chronological (sp?) Classics works with and presents a clear concept - to present all the master takes of a given artist within a specified timeframe, in recording order. They'll dig up some arcane shit to make sure that they deliver the concept, too. They go to some effort to present something that is uniquely theirs, and I think they do with the Public Domain what was meant to be done. This other stuff, otoh, is just....tawdry. Imagine if I burnt you copies of 5 or 6 CDs by your favorite artist, cobbled together some cheap composite shot of the covers, and gave you some even-cheaper page with rudimentary discographical details. If I did this for you as a favor, it would be all, hey cool, thanks! But these guys are not doing this as a favor. They are doing exactly the same thing (except they're giving you "pressed" CDs rahter than CD-Rs, at least I think they are), exactly the same thing, and they're charging you good money for it Yes, it's legal in Europe, but...how do you feel about paying for dubbed CDs and cheapass packaging, especially for material a lot (granted, not all) of which is still available at reasonable prices on the second-hand market (or, if you prefer, for free through various means, and no, not everybody prefers)? If I offered you that deal, would you say "hey, screw you!" or "yes, please! Here's my money! Thanks! There's more where this comes from!" Even if I lived in Europe, where it was legal? If I offered me that deal, I'd tell myself to go fuck myself in big hurry! Sure, you get a lot for a little, but as with all things, you're getting what you pay for. And if enough people want a lot of cheapness for a little, then that is what the people will get. <br><br>And then when they want something better, they will trip out why nobody does it any more. Well, duh. Edited February 27, 2012 by JSngry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 I understand both sides of the argument, but I don't understand why there is so much negativity toward the Real Gone issues yet none toward the Chronological Classics issues. Good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 How many times will exchanges like the ones in this thread be repeated? You need an exact number, or are you betting the Over/Under? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul secor Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 How many times will exchanges like the ones in this thread be repeated? You need an exact number, or are you betting the Over/Under? In this case, I'm definitely going over. Way over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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