Spiritual jazz

[Teasing the Korean]

5 hours ago, JSngry said:

Yeah, all I do know is that if you would have asked any of the more "spiritual" African,-American musicians of the 70s that I knew if they had been checking out Les Baxter...that would have been a hard no. Absolutely a hard no.

And I'm still not sure exactly how much Ra loved that stuff. I'm certain that he heard it and took some ideas from some elements from it, but that's as far as I'd go.

Based on many musician interviews I've read over the decades, I assume that musicians listen to, or are at least exposed to, a wide range of ideas and influences, rather than pigeonholing them based on genre or demographics.

[Teasing the Korean]

6 hours ago, JSngry said:

And I'm still not sure exactly how much Ra loved that stuff. I'm certain that he heard it and took some ideas from some elements from it, but that's as far as I'd go.

You know that he covered "Possession" on one of his early albums, right?

[JSngry]

It was a good song!

[clifford_thornton]

9 hours ago, JSngry said:

Yeah, all I do know is that if you would have asked any of the more "spiritual" African,-American musicians of the 70s that I knew if they had been checking out Les Baxter...that would have been a hard no. Absolutely a hard no.

And I'm still not sure exactly how much Ra loved that stuff. I'm certain that he heard it and took some ideas from some elements from it, but that's as far as I'd go.

Now, I think he loved Fletcher Henderson. And who could blame him?

Agree with this assessment -- Ra was musically omnivorous (as he was philosophically and in the literary sense), applying motifs from all over the place. I would be quite surprised if someone like Albert Mangelsdorff or Michael Garrick was seriously into Les Baxter or Martin Denny, though I'm sure they were aware of the landscape. Garrick was also composing masses and liturgical music as well as writing around poets, so he knew how to programmatically assemble things and create moods. He was quite an interesting character.

[Teasing the Korean]

1 hour ago, clifford_thornton said:

I would be quite surprised if someone like Albert Mangelsdorff or Michael Garrick was seriously into Les Baxter or Martin Denny, though I'm sure they were aware of the landscape. 

Awareness is key.  And it is very possible that musicians gravitate toward certain tracks or certain albums without being fans per se.

[clifford_thornton]

Right. Cooper-Moore related a story of how David S. Ware didn't listen to "jazz" though he apparently listened to a lot of Beyoncé. Whether anything specific from Beyoncé's music factored into his own sound I am a bit doubtful, though of course she does have the gospel projection thing. A fair amount of composers and improvisers also don't listen to much or any music outside of what's in their heads or made up the foundation of their practice -- Andrew Hill apparently stopped consciously listening to any music for years, I've read.

For me as a listener it goes the other way, in that learning how to pay close attention to music has allowed me to hear things in an artist that I might not otherwise hear, though that can also be a negative -- the hype on brat is crazy right now, but I tried listening and feel like it's utterly empty compared to Charli XCX's earlier work.

[jazzbo]

The artist/composer that I am closest to has told me he deliberately does not listen to certain work and persons because he feels his admiration and wonder for them would unduly influence his own work--and at this time he does not wish to be influenced as he had been in the past but to find his own music on his own.

[Rabshakeh]

I'm always interested in the question of what musicians listen to. 

We all know about Charlie Parker's alleged listening tastes. Caruso and all kinds of distinctly non-bebop music.

Genesis P Orridge would supposedly only listen to 60s folk music.

[Ken Dryden]

Gene Harris told me that he never listened to jazz, I am pretty sure he said he listened to classical music. I would have to check my tape, recorded a few years before his death.

[soulpope]

19 hours ago, clifford_thornton said:

Right. Cooper-Moore related a story of how David S. Ware didn't listen to "jazz" though he apparently listened to a lot of Beyoncé. Whether anything specific from Beyoncé's music factored into his own sound I am a bit doubtful, though of course she does have the gospel projection thing ....

Left me wondering how he would sound like if listening to jazz performed by others 😎 ....

[JSngry]