JSngry Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 How come you don't see young folk worrying that all the old folks hate their shit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 How come you don't see young folk worrying that all the old folks hate their shit? Because the old folks will be dead folks fairly soon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Ptah Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 Because they expect that the old folks will be dumb and lame all the time, so it does not surprise them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medjuck Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 I saw the 88 year old Johnny Mandel lead a 17 piece band lastSunday afternoon at a local music club that usually features rock groups. The was as packed with a l.t of old people but many young folks too. (Of course for me anyone less than 60 is young.) I can't explain what got them out. I never thought Johnny Mandel would be that popular. Someone told me the gig had been well publicized. That probably helped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 How come you don't see young folk worrying that all the old folks hate their shit? Because the old folks will be dead folks fairly soon? Post of the week so far! Look, of course the Jazz audience is aging. Good lord, people, Jazz hasn't been a popular form of music for nearly 60 years. Nor will it ever be again. No big deal. Reminds me of when Kelly and I went to a jam session that our local Jazz society had every Sunday at a local lounge. There would usually be about 50-75 folks there to soak in some pretty darned good music. Our first trip there it was blue hair city. We were the youngest ones in the audience by no less than two decades. So, the President of the society came over to us about a half hour in and politely said, "you do know this is a Jazz jam session for blah, blah, blah? The lounge won't re-open for another few hours." I told him that of course we knew, and that was EXACTLY why we were there. I still recall the look of surprise and wonder on his face. He quickly shook our hands and gushed over how glad he was to see some young(er) faces in the crowd (we were in our late-20's at the time). And every Sunday after that he always made a point to come over and strike up conversation with us. He was a super nice, and highly interesting cat. He had grown up in Harlem and was blessed to witness the formulation of Be-Bop, and I used to love sitting around and talking with him about that. He had some immensely interesting stories. I'll confess that I don't remember any of them, but I still enjoyed every conversation we had. Interestingly enough, the lady that got us into this was a patient of mine. I administered her Visual Fields tests, and in my "office" I had the famous Jeff Sedlik Miles/Coltrane/Dizzy pics on the wall. She looked at them with surprise and exclaimed, "OH! You like Jazz!" Her and her husband were also really sweet cats that had grown up in Harlem during that same time. Jazz will find its audience, folks. I wouldn't sweat the details too much. Niche, or not, it has a very persuasive power. And there will always be fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 More evidence: Jazz can be cool again because it's not mainstream. It can be the hip alternative. You just have to connect with them somehow. Make them dance. Make it a party. Exactly. Make it interactive, the days of the musicians playing while the audience sits there respectfully quiet are over (or should be over as far as I'm concerned). Get that crowd on its feet! Get them moving! I love jazz, but I will also admit that going to some stuffy jazz club to hear people play the same standards that they've been playing for 60+ years just isn't that exciting of an idea to me any longer. I want to hear original music, I want to hear music performed that hasn't closed its mind to sounds that have come out post 1966. Jazz is only dead when the musicians decide to only be influenced by shit that came out over 50 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 What about bands like Snarky Puppy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Shearn Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 Snarky Puppy is definitely bringing more people into the fold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 And with a smile on their face. This would have been incredibly cool to attend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 Am I the only one who feels that Snarky Puppy doing real-time re-enactments of what are essentially of Nu/Acid/Neo-SoulJazzHop/Whatever originals and/or remixes is kinda silly? I mean, yeah, they're "real people" playing "real instruments" but if that's all the point of their point, then, huh? This kind of stuff has been going on in some form or fashion for 10-15 years, maybe 20 if you want to stretch it, and what I'd like to hear is somebody doing something with it besides replicating it, not gonna get excited about that, sorry. If that's what passes for "ahead of the curve" or even "contemporary" in "jazz" today, fuck it. It's false hope based on a false reality based on and even more false premise. No - getting a room full of real people to play ersatz sophisticated bullshit is NOT better than any other type of bullshit. Not any better. Just not. Worse, maybe, because it's kinda like people staying on the Titanic because where else are you gonna see the ocean this good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Reynolds Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 I'm stoked as I'm going to see 65 year old Paul Flaherty roar on the saxophone for the first time. He sounds fresh as paint on record to me. It says on the liner notes that he made his first record in 1978. Maybe he's old school. I know he roars on the saxophone and I imagine the set is not gonna be cool or laid back or whatever the guy a few posts above was talking about. I might dance. I will move. I will be fired up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 Am I the only one who feels that Snarky Puppy doing real-time re-enactments of what are essentially of Nu/Acid/Neo-SoulJazzHop/Whatever originals and/or remixes is kinda silly? I mean, yeah, they're "real people" playing "real instruments" but if that's all the point of their point, then, huh? This kind of stuff has been going on in some form or fashion for 10-15 years, maybe 20 if you want to stretch it, and what I'd like to hear is somebody doing something with it besides replicating it, not gonna get excited about that, sorry. If that's what passes for "ahead of the curve" or even "contemporary" in "jazz" today, fuck it. It's false hope based on a false reality based on and even more false premise. No - getting a room full of real people to play ersatz sophisticated bullshit is NOT better than any other type of bullshit. Not any better. Just not. Worse, maybe, because it's kinda like people staying on the Titanic because where else are you gonna see the ocean this good? Who cares about being ahead of the curve? And ersatz, or not, what's the matter with making people smile? Isn't that what music is supposed to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.:.impossible Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Here in Richmond, jazz is performed in the same bars that rock and electronic/instrumental hip-hop/whateverthefuck is performed. The audience overlap is significant. I'd say the median age is 30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ayers Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Between this, the last shop standing thread, and the general necrophilia and nostalgia... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 No. Well, you're wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Not any better. Just not. Worse, maybe, because it's kinda like people staying on the Titanic because where else are you gonna see the ocean this good? Thnx - made my day ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ayers Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 The audience for Ragtime has begun to slip a little bit too, I've noticed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 The audience for Ragtime has begun to slip a little bit too, I've noticed. Actually, that points to our "salvation." Another movie like "The Sting" and all will be well. No. Well, you're wrong. Yes -- I always find that Ernie Henry puts a smile on my face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Because That's what Ernie Henry was supposed to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Snarky Puppy? tired music, I think; but at least they Chuck Mangione to sit in with them.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 The audience for Ragtime has begun to slip a little bit too, I've noticed. Actually, that points to our "salvation." Another movie like "The Sting" and all will be well. No. Well, you're wrong. Yes -- I always find that Ernie Henry puts a smile on my face. Just to be clear, because irony tends not to translate, Henry makes wants me to weep and/or put a bullet through my brain. He's a favorite of mine, to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Magnificent Goldberg Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 I see Kenny G is still getting albums on the pop charts this year. Must be that the 40-50 year olds are having a nostalgia attack.Jazz doesn't have to be creative to be jazz. It doesn't have to be good music, either. And it's allowed to be watered down, too. The Dorsey Brothers were watered down. Glenn Miller was VERY watered down. People liked it like that. And still do.The 'jazz community's' insistence on quality is the curse of jazz.MG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Shearn Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 (edited) I see Kenny G is still getting albums on the pop charts this year. Must be that the 40-50 year olds are having a nostalgia attack. Jazz doesn't have to be creative to be jazz. It doesn't have to be good music, either. And it's allowed to be watered down, too. The Dorsey Brothers were watered down. Glenn Miller was VERY watered down. People liked it like that. And still do. The 'jazz community's' insistence on quality is the curse of jazz. MG Right on. Hence all the GRP love in certain circles, Paul Whiteman makes me gag, but people love it. Brian Culbertson, same thing, (dude can play) it just doesn't touch me. There can be a certain level of sophistication, like Ben Williams and Derrick Hodge do, still accessible music, melodic, it's quite good and not watered down. Edited June 11, 2014 by CJ Shearn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 I see Kenny G is still getting albums on the pop charts this year. Must be that the 40-50 year olds are having a nostalgia attack. Jazz doesn't have to be creative to be jazz. It doesn't have to be good music, either. And it's allowed to be watered down, too. The Dorsey Brothers were watered down. Glenn Miller was VERY watered down. People liked it like that. And still do. The 'jazz community's' insistence on quality is the curse of jazz. MG A whole lot of vintage (and popular)Tommy Dorsey recordings weren't "watered down" anything. As for Glenn Miller, if there was a "watered down" aspect to his band, that wasn't the main reason it was widely popular. There were lots of semi-polite but non-"sweet" bands around at that time; the Miller band was hugely popular because of its distinctive sound, the quality of its execution, and its large number of catchy originals. A latter-day partial comparison might be to the Brubeck-Desmond recording of "Take Five." It wasn't/isn't popular because it's "watered down," it was and is popular because it's catchy/infectious and, for those who care/notice, has a very nice Desmond solo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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