Justin V Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) I'll have to do some research, but by the standards that arguably ought to prevail, I don't know how many prospective NEA Jazz Masters there are left. Roscoe and Threadgill to be sure. Would Kenny Barron be on the cusp? Billy Hart? De Johnette? Kenny Barron (2010) and Jack DeJohnette (2012) are already NEA Jazz Masters. Congratulations to the 2015 class! Edited June 26, 2014 by Justin V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 Thanks for the correction, Justin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Friedman Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 Charles McPherson and Mickey Roker would be good choices in my view. Charles Lloyd would definitely not be on my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnblitweiler Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 Was Wadada Leo Smith ever a Jazz Master? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7/4 Posted June 26, 2014 Report Share Posted June 26, 2014 Was Wadada Leo Smith ever a Jazz Master? He should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValerieB Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I would like to suggest Terry Gibbs as very deserving! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster_Ties Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I have a couple names I might also add to the list who ought to be considered -- but am wondering if there is a list of criteria that ought to be considered? Are there any particular metics that are (or ought to be) considered before someone is nominated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milestones Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 It would be interesting to see a list of all winners, since offhand I have little idea. I get the impression that you don't win until you are ancient. I mean, everyone in the new class was born in the 1930s. Have relative youngsters like Joe Lovano and Pat Metheny gotten it, or on the verge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul secor Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 There doesn't seem to be much to do with criteria on the NEA Jazz Masters site. This gives a list of past honorees and the intro pretty much covers the basic criteria for recognition: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEA_Jazz_Masters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 as always, I agree with Valerie; as long as Herbie Hancock has already won. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Ptah Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Looking at the entire list of those who have won in the past, I think Charles Lloyd's body of work with Chico Hamilton, Cannonball Adderley, and his small group recordings from the late 1980s to the present, place him within the general level of those who have been awarded. That is even assuming that you think that his group with Keith Jarrett and Jack DeJohnette was overhyped, and that you discount his 1970s and early 1980s work. That is just my opinion, of course. Lloyd's albums are not the first thing I think of reaching for on any particular day, but I think that he has a worthy body of work. I am not sure I understand the negativity about him. If he had never recorded after 1987, I could see it, but he has released a string of quite good albums in the past 25 years, I think. Has everyone who is negative about his selection heard the albums from the past 25 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milestones Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I agree about Lloyd. Twenty or so years go he started releasing some fine albums with the likes of John Abercrombie, Brad Mehdlau, and Billy Higgins. He plays fine tenor sax (owing something to Trane, but so what?), and a ton of somewhat exotic instruments. He's got some memorable compositions. Rabo de Nube, the live record with Jason Moran, is a killer. I also saw Lloyd live in 2005 or 2006 (with Geri Allen in the band), and it was a great show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milestones Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 (edited) Yeah, it looks like you need to be pretty old, which is perhaps not a problem since we don't have too many jazz guys dying young anymore. Am I missing something? Have Dave Holland and/or John McLaughlin never won? Edited June 27, 2014 by Milestones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milestones Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 (edited) So one has to be fully American? Hasn't Holland lived in America pretty much since he joined Miles? McLaughlin...I don't know, but certainly he's played with a lot of American musicians and his work has usually been issued on American labels. Edited June 27, 2014 by Milestones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Weiss Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 American citizenship or residence didn't seem a factor when selecting Toots Thielemans in 2009. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin V Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 American citizenship or residence didn't seem a factor when selecting Toots Thielemans in 2009. Toots became a US citizen in the '50s, according to several interviews and articles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Holland has been resident in the US since the '70s, but I'm not sure if he's a citizen or a resident alien. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster_Ties Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 The name I was thinking of suggesting was Charles Tolliver, though I'd understand if the volume of recorded evidence of his career (or if for other reasons), he might not warrant inclusion. Opinions of considering Tolliver, pro or otherwise, welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Friedman Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 The name I was thinking of suggesting was Charles Tolliver, though I'd understand if the volume of recorded evidence of his career (or if for other reasons), he might not warrant inclusion. Opinions of considering Tolliver, pro or otherwise, welcome. I would personally select Tom Harrell before To Charles Tolliver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 The name I was thinking of suggesting was Charles Tolliver, though I'd understand if the volume of recorded evidence of his career (or if for other reasons), he might not warrant inclusion. Opinions of considering Tolliver, pro or otherwise, welcome. I remember someone once referring to Tolliver's "nanny goat" tone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Haven't heard any of his recent music, to be honest. I like a lot of his 60s/70s output. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Tolliver as player, make your own mind up, but as composer, pretty damn influential over the long haul, I think. By the same token, is Stanley Cowell not a "jazz master", which I take to mean a different thing than a "jazz genius" or a "jazz innovator". What kind of a gig could you not call Stanley Cowell for and get an excellent performance of the highest integrity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster_Ties Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 (edited) The name I was thinking of suggesting was Charles Tolliver, though I'd understand if the volume of recorded evidence of his career (or if for other reasons), he might not warrant inclusion. Opinions of considering Tolliver, pro or otherwise, welcome. I remember someone once referring to Tolliver's "nanny goat" tone.Yeah, I've heard a variety of opinions about Tolliver too (non-musically related), thus the way I introduced the notion of considering him. Whatever I heard (years ago, all on-line here, all third hand, and I don't really even remember any details), was a bit of a mixed bag. But I love nearly everything he's done on his own leader-dates, and most of his sideman work. FWIW. Edited June 27, 2014 by Rooster_Ties Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 By the same token, is Stanley Cowell not a "jazz master", which I take to mean a different thing than a "jazz genius" or a "jazz innovator". What kind of a gig could you not call Stanley Cowell for and get an excellent performance of the highest integrity? Good call. Need to catch up on Cowell. I see that there's a good deal on Steeplechase since the last one I got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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