JSngry

BFT 204 - C'mon Vince, Play Your Vibes!

51 posts in this topic

A mid-point(ish) review shows mostly favorable responses, for which I am certainly grateful! A look at the individual tracks:

TRACK ONE - not identified, but a lot of listeners are hearing elements/components of what went into the piece. The group's repertoire is anything but monolithic though!

TRACK TWO - Band, tune, tenor soloist and venue(?) all identified. I think Mike Weil summed it up best - "wild"!

TRACK THREE - Still not identified. Legendary group and lead singer...perhaps a crypto-clue is in order - Riverdale's Archie sitting behind Mockingbird's Foxx, both travelling together n Tizol's tour group.

TRACK FOUR - The record itself got bumped into by Dub Modal, but its actual content/context has not yet really been identified. It's interesting in a few ways, further sleuthing will coax it out.

TRACK FIVE - Almost immediately identified (Felser would know!), so let everyday be one where it can be said, c'mon Vince, play your vibes!

TRACK SIX - Tune identified, band not. A lot of speculations pointing in the right way, though!

TRACK SEVEN - BillF cracked the composer code right away, which was really all that was expected, although if anybody can go deeper on the ID, bonus points!

TRACK EIGHT - A lot of positive response to this one (whew!), not yet identified though. A hint - the composer has won both a Pulitzer and a Grammy, has not yet turned 40, and is in no way slowing down.

Still got half the month left, so anybody who still wants to participate, please do. Be it further responses or initial impressions, it's all good. Y'all come!

 

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I saw this clip recently, which has the Zaza Kanto kids from Madagascar singing and that first track reminded me of this. It's not these kids (I don't think, at least I'm pretty sure) but figured I'd post it here anyway. Both heart warming and heart breaking at the same time on various levels:

 

22 hours ago, JSngry said:

TRACK EIGHT - A lot of positive response to this one (whew!), not yet identified though. A hint - the composer has won both a Pulitzer and a Grammy, has not yet turned 40, and is in no way slowing down.

Kendrick Lamar? 

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Very interesting choices, but afraid not correct as IDs of the tracks.

I can tell you, though, that the composer of #8 is a member of the group on #1.

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Posted (edited)

Still listening. Intriguing! Have to say the guitar on track 4 sounds so much like Grant Green it almost can't be Grant Green. But I know he did a version of "Down Here on the Ground. But something in the recording doesn't sound "vintage." Something from one of the 90s BN remix compilations. (Ah; a little searching reveals the vocalist. Not who I expected.)

Track 5: The Salsoul Orchestra! Was not expecting to hear that on a BFT! But, then again, I've never thought about who Vince (Montana) was or how important he was to the Philly soul/MFSB sound. 

I am getting a Gil Evans vibe from the colors and arrangement of 6. But what is up with the time signatures here!

Track 8: Quilting! This doesn't sound like the Gee's Bend ladies, however. Very curious to learn more about this. Soundtrack work or something more in the vein of Steve Reich's tape pieces? Wonder who the leader here is. Guitar? There is a kind of Scott Fields feel to this. But I'm thinking the bassist is driving this. [Pulling some threads.] Caroline Shaw? If so, this makes me wonder if there's a more explicit connection between tracks 1 and 8 (Roomful of Teeth?).

Edited by Joe

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1 hour ago, Joe said:

Still listening. Intriguing! Have to say the guitar on track 4 sounds so much like Grant Green it almost can't be Grant Green. But I know he did a version of "Down Here on the Ground. But something in the recording doesn't sound "vintage." Something from one of the 90s BN remix compilations. (Ah; a little searching reveals the vocalist. Not who I expected.)

Grant, yes. And about the singer, I know, did not EVEN expect that, right?!?!?!?

Track 5: The Salsoul Orchestra! Was not expecting to hear that on a BFT! But, then again, I've never thought about who Vince (Montana) was or how important he was to the Philly soul/MFSB sound.

This is just a gem of a cut, in so many ways. Long wanted to get it into a BFT, just because. That rhythm section is just perfect, "slink" exemplified!

I am getting a Gil Evans vibe from the colors and arrangement of 6. But what is up with the time signatures here!

It's all 4/4, just a different subdivisions being played at any one time. But not at all Gil Evans, although, yes, that vibe is there, especially at the beginning. A good tuba will do that for ya'...

Track 8: Quilting! This doesn't sound like the Gee's Bend ladies, however. Very curious to learn more about this. Soundtrack work or something more in the vein of Steve Reich's tape pieces? Wonder who the leader here is. Guitar? There is a kind of Scott Fields feel to this. But I'm thinking the bassist is driving this. [Pulling some threads.] Caroline Shaw? If so, this makes me wonder if there's a more explicit connection between tracks 1 and 8 (Roomful of Teeth?).

There is a very correct answer in there!

 

36 minutes ago, randyhersom said:

BINGO!

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Posted (edited)

Of course! Track 6 is Kenton. And this is a true Kenton arrangement, yes? The road from Gil Evans to Stan Kenton (the final minute or so) travels through some pretty avant territory.

Listening to track #1 again, I hear some influences that I place more in Africa (South Africa and Zimbabwe specifically) than Europe. Intonation aside. Following the thread I pulled above, however, reveals the identity of this composer — someone much more widely known as a pop star. Surprising, but also, "well, yeah, that makes sense." Then again, surprises revealing themselves to be inevitabilities seems to be the theme of this BFT. Bravo!

Edited by Joe

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2 hours ago, Joe said:

Of course! Track 6 is Kenton. And this is a true Kenton arrangement, yes? The road from Gil Evans to Stan Kenton (the final minute or so) travels through some pretty avant territory.

You got it, on all counts. And it being this arranger, of course there's a formula, there always is. But in this case, it's an interesting formula (chronology might have something to do with it, these were kinda his "dark days"). But no matter - some nifty shit, right?

Listening to track #1 again, I hear some influences that I place more in Africa (South Africa and Zimbabwe specifically) than Europe. Intonation aside. Following the thread I pulled above, however, reveals the identity of this composer — someone much more widely known as a pop star. Surprising, but also, "well, yeah, that makes sense."

There's a lot (ok, a "lot") of "pop/rock stars" venturing into full-bore composition these days...interesting trend, and, often enough, interesting results. And for this individual, it's all about the voice as voice, what can the voice DO, and what do you have to do to get it to do it. Inevitably, it's a matter of "place"...which means how are you going to vibrate internally to make the sound externally. No idea if anybody involved here is aware of Milford Grave or any other Musical Therapists Using Cosmic Tones, but...at some point, how do you not be, especially with something as literally organic to the self as the voice?

Then again, surprises revealing themselves to be inevitabilities seems to be the theme of this BFT. Bravo!

Sorta, and subconsciously if so. Set out to deliberately to NOT have any theme or narrative this time out (and to keep it short, about the length of a decent "free form" radio block. But another theme that emerged after the final culling of the selections almost ends up being, with a smile, "Girl Talk" LOL!

Thank you, glad you enjoyed the selections!

 

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About one week left. Most things have been sussed out to at least some degree, but still - any further input is welcomed, be it new or follow-up. Very little has been fully identified! Besides, when it comes to opinions, there are no guesses needed!

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I thought the first song started out very promising, until the male voices joined in. From there on it succumbed to an excess of clever turns and effects. The group is already identified as Roomful Of Teeth; the track is called "Quizassa". I read above that the composer is a "name" in pop music. I don't know her and, based on this track, I am not convinced. Marie Daulne/Zap Mama already did this translation of traditional vocal music into quasi-pop music 30 years ago (she was mainly inspired by the Pygmy music of her childhood) and, for this listener, with much more charm.

I liked the last track more than I would have expected, considering the ensemble playing here. Some added effects bothered me a bit: in general, I prefer either a piece built entirely on (the manipulation of) the vocal loops (like the early Steve Reich tape pieces mentioned above) or the preservation of the unedited/unadorned field recording. Still, an attractive piece, full of atmosphere (the guitar part was not necessary for me, but I can assume that it helps to warm up a wider audience for this music).

The gorgeous snippet of Bartok is the first of his 15 Hungarian Peasant Songs. I have the complete Bartok piano music by Zoltan Kocsis, but it's not him playing. Remembering your enthusiasm about György Sandor, that name seems a safe bet.

 

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1 hour ago, corto maltese said:

I thought the first song started out very promising, until the male voices joined in. From there on it succumbed to an excess of clever turns and effects. The group is already identified as Roomful Of Teeth; the track is called "Quizassa". I read above that the composer is a "name" in pop music. I don't know her and, based on this track, I am not convinced. Marie Daulne/Zap Mama already did this translation of traditional vocal music into quasi-pop music 30 years ago (she was mainly inspired by the Pygmy music of her childhood) and, for this listener, with much more charm.

My understanding of the composer's intent of her works such as this is not to co-opt/appropriate a specific "style", but to use techniques learned from these styles as vocal exercises, to expand whatever group you want to put a group of people who populate this performance idiom ("classical" hardly seems accurate, but I suppose it will do? Composed music?) to be aware of a fuller realization of the potentials of their instruments. Inspiration, not appropriation.

A fine line, perhaps, and one that has been confronted with the group directly by another proponent of another "indigenous" style through a lawsuit (which was peacefully settled with, among other things, more work by/for the claimant). Ultimately, contrary to current PC-ness, intent does matter, but it's not as easy as all that to get there. Can't start there, but hope to end there.

What I like about is just the fact that it exists, and how it suggests that "classical" music is not really going to continue to be "about" groups of "European" norms as we move along in the 21st Century. How that all shakes out over time remains to be seen, but...Pandora's box, etc.

It's funny, I sent another track by this group to a friend, and they had a similar response to the genders - loved the females, found the males stiff, needing to loosen up. Given all that's in the mix here, I gotta wonder i there's a broader message/implication there...I think there might be...no matter, I can tell you from experience, that hearing these people live is a visceral experience not unlike that of an old-school big band - a LOT of air gets moved. And the female quartet has as much color and flexibility as the Ellington reed section. Sections!

I liked the last track more than I would have expected, considering the ensemble playing here. Some added effects bothered me a bit: in general, I prefer either a piece built entirely on (the manipulation of) the vocal loops (like the early Steve Reich tape pieces mentioned above) or the preservation of the unedited/unadorned field recording. Still, an attractive piece, full of atmosphere (the guitar part was not necessary for me, but I can assume that it helps to warm up a wider audience for this music).

Steve Reich is literally old enough to be this composers' grandchild! You can bet that the influence was felt, almost taken as a given, I'm sure. So...evolution keeps happening. And again, yes, "accessibility" is a very real concern for this composer, this organization, this generation of composers in general, actually. The "academic" ways of yore are no longer sought after, much less admired. These people want to function as composers of their time, which means being of their time, which means...lots of things. When they get it right, as this composer often does, it's thrilling to experience, like, you know where all of it comes from, you've just never heard it put together like that. I am enjoying seeing where it's going. Composing is....necessary now, more than it has been for a while, imo.

The gorgeous snippet of Bartok is the first of his 15 Hungarian Peasant Songs. I have the complete Bartok piano music by Zoltan Kocsis, but it's not him playing. Remembering your enthusiasm about György Sandor, that name seems a safe bet.

Not just a safe bet, a sure thing!!!!

 

 

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Apologies, Jim.  I did this a couple of weeks back and never posted it (been that kinda spring!).  I had nothing on this one.  Some stuff resonated, some didn't, but I don't think I had one guess.

Track 01 - No idea what to say.  Certainly unique, but having trouble getting my head around it.  It’s interesting, but I can’t say I’m enjoying it.  

Track 02 - Early on has the feel of Dizzy, but seems to discover that playing like Dizzy is impossible.  My guess is European musicians playing the style. Don’t get me wrong, I could listen to this all day long.  LOVE that burly tenor.  Pretty clear these musicians are enjoying what they’re doing immensely.  They’re not focused on technique, just kind of riding the wave.  And it works — Boy Howdy it works!  I mean, clearly the skill is there, but this is about the music not the skills.  Huh… or IS it Dizzy?

Track 03 - Yes, please.  No idea, but I’ll take a whole lot of this with more on the side.

Track 04 - Absofreakinlutely.  No idea who or what, but I want more.

Track 05 - Be right back — gotta go grab my polyester pants.  The genre is a nostalgic thing, but not one I gravitate towards.  Did enjoy the tasteful vibes solo, but no idea what I’m listening to.

Track 06 - Girl Talk by Neil Hefti.  No idea who by.  Reminds me of the DNR stuff, but I don’t think that’s it.  One of my favorite Hefti tunes.

Track 07 - No idea.  Sound reminded of the Tapscott Session recordings.

Track 08 - Feel like I’m listening to This American Life (not a bad thing).  It’s interesting, but again, not sure how many times I’d go back to it.  I like the idea of using the voices behind the music, and it definitely creates a mood, but I kind of feel like it’s been done.

 

 

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Man I have just been the worst on this month's BFT. No listening time, and I'm the one who posted about how a shorter comp should mean fewer excuses for not participating. Need about a dozen of these: :blush:

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59 minutes ago, tkeith said:

 Apologies, Jim.  I did this a couple of weeks back and never posted it (been that kinda spring!).  I had nothing on this one.  Some stuff resonated, some didn't, but I don't think I had one guess.

No apologies needed. Thanks for making time!

Track 01 - No idea what to say.  Certainly unique, but having trouble getting my head around it.  It’s interesting, but I can’t say I’m enjoying it.

Knowing what it "is" may or may not add to the enjoyment potential...probably not, though. But a key thing that got me into it past its initial impact (I heard it live) was trying to figure out what the lyrics were, or what the words meant, only to find out that there aren't any words, they're just vocal sounds. But purposeful sounds, designed to get the voice into some "non-traditional" places, at least for people like this. The relationship between voice and mind, of physical vibration and mental space is...interesting. If you care for it to be, LOL!

Track 02 - Early on has the feel of Dizzy, but seems to discover that playing like Dizzy is impossible.  My guess is European musicians playing the style. Don’t get me wrong, I could listen to this all day long.  LOVE that burly tenor.  Pretty clear these musicians are enjoying what they’re doing immensely.  They’re not focused on technique, just kind of riding the wave.  And it works — Boy Howdy it works!  I mean, clearly the skill is there, but this is about the music not the skills.  Huh… or IS it Dizzy?

Well, yes, it is! I would really encourage people who have the inclination to listen to the piano comping too...it's somebody we all know, and proof that they always did it this way.

Track 03 - Yes, please.  No idea, but I’ll take a whole lot of this with more on the side.

There's more than enough to go around, and for as much as you like. But there could be even more if the "industry" took this genre seriously. It's foundational music and peoples for SO much of the music we love.

Track 04 - Absofreakinlutely.  No idea who or what, but I want more.

Not as much of this to go around, and for this singer...this might(?) be pretty much all there is. Which is a real drag...

Track 05 - Be right back — gotta go grab my polyester pants.  The genre is a nostalgic thing, but not one I gravitate towards.  Did enjoy the tasteful vibes solo, but no idea what I’m listening to.

It's Vince!

Track 06 - Girl Talk by Neil Hefti.  No idea who by.  Reminds me of the DNR stuff, but I don’t think that’s it.  One of my favorite Hefti tunes.

Don't know what DNR is/means? But not applicable to this cut? I think?

Track 07 - No idea.  Sound reminded of the Tapscott Session recordings.

Totally wrong, but that's the kind of response I was thinking more people might have, so thanks!

Track 08 - Feel like I’m listening to This American Life (not a bad thing).  It’s interesting, but again, not sure how many times I’d go back to it.  I like the idea of using the voices behind the music, and it definitely creates a mood, but I kind of feel like it’s been done.

This composer is definitely getting that NPR-esque career push lately, but I've heard enough to engage for now to see if that's all kind of stealth, or if it's face-value. Either way will be interesting enough, but the stealth route would me more interesting, it almost always is, right?

 

 

 

28 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

Man I have just been the worst on this month's BFT. No listening time, and I'm the one who posted about how a shorter comp should mean fewer excuses for not participating. Need about a dozen of these: :blush:

I was afraid this was because of a potential  full bucket of DNDC/NMCOT...and it may be yet!!!! :g

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10 minutes ago, JSngry said:

 

Don't know what DNR is/means? But not applicable to this cut? I think?

Had to go back and listen, because I had no idea what I meant, either.  :D 

Not sure what the hell I was typing, but I was aiming for Danish Radio Big Band.  #egad

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Ah, ok. Not them, then.

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Reveal coming either today or tomorrow.

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Had to follow thru on this ... I remember many, many years ago I took a disgusted, or at least, agitated reaction to shall we say Jim's "expanded" definition of what I thought was to be a jazz compilation.

I'm a lot more mellow about that stuff since then.

I still found little to enjoy here.

Highs: Obviously, the Dizzy track and the Inez Andrews, both are terrific. Makes me look forward to 45 minutes of Big Nick on the flip of a Percy France club date that the Smithsonian will be transferring sometime this summer out of the Gaskin archive.

I've disliked Kenton's groups because they lacked any Basie qualities. This one, I just found boring.

Excuse me while I return to tilling my small plot of land inside the jazz universe. :)

 

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Don't know that I've ever done a 100% "pure" jazz compilation, but yeah, thanks for mellowing on that.

At least this one was short! :g

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Well, I'm starting to cobble together my own BFT submission (for June, I think) and it won't be 100% "jazz" so I hope that's ok as well. 

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21 minutes ago, Dub Modal said:

Well, I'm starting to cobble together my own BFT submission (for June, I think) and it won't be 100% "jazz" so I hope that's ok as well. 

Dude, the deal with the BFT is that it's your thing. Put whatever you want to on it. Not everybody will like everything, don't worry about it, just put it out there.

As for the "pure jazz" thing...I think you're a "younger" guy, so you can either aim for the old folks, or you can be who you are. Me, I like surprises, old or new, something with a fresh jolt, from whatever dimension it emanates.

Bottom line - it's free tunes. Can't nobody ask for a refund, right? :g

BTW - when Dan talks about "tilling my small plot of land inside the jazz universe", he's understating what he's gotten himself into. He's going deep deep DEEP into some things that few others have bothered with. So...yeah, Dan is doing God's work right now.

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6 minutes ago, JSngry said:

As for the "pure jazz" thing...I think you're a "younger" guy, so you can either aim for the old folks, or you can be who you are. Me, I like surprises, old or new, something with a fresh jolt, from whatever dimension it emanates.

Ha, thanks for putting "younger" in quotations. My jazz listening is toddler age, so the collection isn't vast and since there's been over 200 BFTs, likely most of that ground has been covered. I do plan on doing a search to make sure no repeats but I have no choice in terms of going outside the lines so to speak.

Your last track on this one tipped me to another song I have in the collection that is similar in style, done decades ago, but damn if I can find it just yet. Glad I've got a few months...but it certainly ain't jazz, but definitely within the improvising and creating originality idiom which is the theme I'll stick to. :tup

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Just do it. Looking forward to what you got for us!

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2 hours ago, Dub Modal said:

Well, I'm starting to cobble together my own BFT submission (for June, I think) and it won't be 100% "jazz" so I hope that's ok as well. 

Looking forward to it

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Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, Dub Modal said:

Well, I'm starting to cobble together my own BFT submission (for June, I think) and it won't be 100% "jazz" so I hope that's ok as well. 

If memory serves me correctly, my first cut on my first BFT was Juju's "African Rhythms", hardly one for the purists..  But the neighborhood is still willing to listen and respond to what I lay out there.  We had a participation crisis for these BFT's a couple years ago, but new guys like you have pumped fresh blood into it, and all is good.

 

Edited by felser

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