Alexander

To me, the term "cover" really only began to have meaning when performers became songwriters as well and their recordings of their own songs became "definitive." Any Beatles recording of a Lennon/McCartney composition is "definitive." The same holds true for Dylan, Stevie Wonder, or Bruce Springsteen. I don't think that the concept of "covering" a song (except in the strictest economic sense) had much meaning before Dylan and the Beatles changed the ball-game (I'd add Brian Wilson to that crew, as well). This is not to say that Chuck Berry and Buddy Holly weren't important (they wrote their own songs too), but pretty much from Elvis on back, a performer was NOT expected to write his or her own material. Sinatra certainly didn't "cover" "Night and Day," even though he wasn't the first to record it. And no, Coleman Hawkins did not "cover" "Body and Soul" either, but this has more to do with our expectations of performers than any inherent value of the songs or the recordings themselves. Notice that this practice (associating singers with the songs they recorded) has been retroactively applied to Elvis and Sinatra. We now think of the standards that Sinatra recorded as "his" songs, as though nobody else ever recorded "I've Got You Under My Skin." We think of "Heartbreak Hotel" as Elvis's song, even though he didn't write it. If anyone else records it (as Cheap Trick recorded "Don't Be Cruel" in the 80s), it will be considered a "cover" of an Elvis Presley song, even though he has no more of a claim on that song as anyone (apart from recording the first version). Certainly most listeners consider "Hound Dog," "Blue Suede Shoes," and "That's All Right" to be Elvis Presley songs, even though they were written/first recorded by Big Mama Thorton, Carl Perkins, and Arthur "Big Boy" Crudup respectively. Basically, I think it really doesn't make a difference what we call them. Should Aretha's version of "Respect" be considered a cover? It's practically a different song from what Otis Redding recorded.

RIP.

Thanks for the tip! I've added it to my wishlist (low on funds at the moment, and that wishlist is getting LONG).

I've never heard it either, but his body was thrown into the Tallahatchie River in 1955, that's fact, and I have trouble believing that and the reference in the song from 1967 are mere coincidences. Anything else is conjecture (the lyrics don't really say). I have no doubt that Gentry was aware of the significance of the Tallahatchie river and its connection to Till's murder, but I'm just not sure that it was her intention to link Billie Joe to that crime.

So I got "Graduation" when I came out, and I have to admit that the first listening was a bit of a disappointment. I had very high hopes after his first two albums. However, I've listened to it several times since then and it has grown on me considerably. I've heard it said elsewhere on the board that Clem is full of shit, and that his whole persona is fictional (he apparently even fibs about his age). I would, therefore, take it as read that his claim to have heard both "Graduation" and "Curtis" in late August as a fabrication. This makes sense to me, since Kayne's albums has several DOPE tracks. "Stronger" is an awesome track, making excellent use of the Daft Punk sample. He also uses samples from Steely Dan, Elton John, and Laura Nyro to great effect. Is he a great MC? No, he's never claimed to be a great MC. In fact, I find his clumsy rhymes endearing. He makes great beats and has great taste in pop music. In fact, I'd go so far to say that Kanye is more of a great pop artist than a great hip hop artist. Call it "bubblegum" if you choose, but it works for him. And I cannot resist a good pop album. Clem knows that I like U2, btw. That's why he chose to compare Kanye to U2. "Window in the Sky" is a fucking AMAZING track. Great video too!

The British Invasion was certainly NOT engineered by record companies. Capitol Records (the American arm of EMI, which was the parent company of Parlaphone) was quite convinced that the Beatles would have absolutely NO appeal to American listeners, and flatly refused to release any of their records in the US (this despite the fact that Capitol technically WORKED for EMI). EMI had to release the Beatles in the US through Vee-Jay first, and it was only after they had gotten some airplay in the US that Capitol decided to jump on the bandwagon (and sued the hell out of Vee-Jay). Had Capitol planned this all along, I think they would have been more amenible to releasing the Beatles in the first place. In fact, as I recall seeing in one documentary about the Beatles, EMI was told by the suits at Capitol that "the British don't know how to make rock and roll records."

The hit tune was from 1967 and many (most?) of the covers were well before the movie. There is a major historical allusion in the song which I only realized in the past year from research on a different topic. Remember the key line "He and Billie Joe was throwin' somethin' off of Tallahatchie Bridge?". Well, not pretty, but here it is. Emmett Louis "Bobo" Till (July 25, 1941 – August 28, 1955) was a fourteen year old African-American boy from Chicago, Illinois brutally murdered [1] in Money, Mississippi, a small town in the state's Delta region. His murder has been cited as one of the key events that energized the nascent American Civil Rights Movement.[1] The main suspects were acquitted, but later admitted to committing the crime. Till's mother insisted on a public funeral service with an open casket to let everyone see how he had been brutally killed.[2] He had been shot, beaten and had his eye gouged out before he was then thrown into the Tallahatchie River with a 75-pound cotton gin fan tied to his neck as a weight with barbed wire. His body stayed in the river for three days until it was discovered and retrieved by two fishermen. Pretty gutsy stuff for a white southern woman to be writing and singing about in 1967, so I hand it to Gentry. The record certainly deserved it's success. Bob Dylan also wrote and recorded a song called 'The Death of Emmitt Til', which is an outtake from the Freewheelin' Bob Dylan album. This is the first time I've ever heard of the murder of Emmett Till linked to "Ode to Billie Joe." I've heard a lot of theories, however, about what was thrown off of the bridge (the theory I heard the most was that it was a stillborn/aborted baby). Dylan, who did record a ballad about Emmett Till (I have a demo recording on the "Great White Wonder" boot), also recorded an answer song to "Ode to Billie Joe." Nowadays, it's better known as "The Clothesline Saga" from the Basement Tapes, but it's original title was simply "Answer to Ode."

I don't have a problem with any of these selections. Madonna, Chic, and Donna Summers are all excellent examples of disco/dance pop. Madonna was predicted to be a one-trick pony when she first emerged in the early-80s, but the woman has managed to sustain a career for more than two decades. That takes more than a little talent (and more than a little good business sense), whatever I personally think of her music (doesn't do anything for me). I've previously mentioned my admiration for the Beasties on this board, so I don't think it's necessary to do so again. Mellencamp is another supposed one-trick pony (he was originally lambasted for being a weak Springsteen clone) who has managed to keep turning out solid albums over the years (I am a fan of his). The Ventures were pioneer surf-rockers. Afrika Bambataa is a hip-hop pioneer (he's only been covered by Jason Moran and collaborated with James Brown, in addition to other achievements). I'm not personally all that familiar with the Dave Clarke Five, but I know that they are pretty highly regarded by fans of the British Invasion. Leonard Cohen is a master and one of my all time favorite artists, so I actually think that his nomination is long overdue. Also, my uncle used to play in his band.

I took my daughter to see the Genesis show when it landed in Albany a couple of weeks back. It was actually a great show. Collins is quite the showman! He's also still got his drum chops (I actually think he's better now than he was back in the Gabriel/Hackett days). The show leaned heavily to pre-"Duke" Genesis (material from "The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway," "Foxtrot," "Selling England By The Pound," "Trick of the Tail," "Nursery Crime," etc.) with a few late 70s and 80s radio hits thrown in to add variety (and to please the Collins fans, no doubt, who were not familar with the other material). I was particularly surprised that they did NOT peform "That's All." The encores were "I Can't Dance" from an early 90s album (can't remember the title, as I've never owned it) and "The Carpet Crawlers" from "Broadway." The three-man line-up was augmented by an extra guitar/bass (which allowed Rutherford to alternate between his two main instruments. It seemed like he played bass on the earlier tunes, which makes sense as he played bass on those albums. There was also a second drummer, which allowed Collins to sing lead and retire to his drum kit as needed. He and the drummer played an intense drum battle that certainly cleared the air on whether Collins has kept up on his instrument! I was impressed, I have to say, as well as vastly entertained...

I've recently been going through my (very few) Clifford Jordan discs. I bought "Cliff Craft" when it came out as a Conn back in the mid-to-late 1990s and wasn't very into it at the time. I had also found a Japanese import of a disc simply titled "Cliff Jordan" (BN) which features Lee Morgan (I was heavily into Lee at the time, and it was his presence on the disc that caused me to get it). Then I have an OJC called "Bear Cat" and the album with John Gilmore. I bring all this up because listening to these discs now, I can't imagine why I was so unimpressed back then. Clifford Jordan was the shiznit! He had a big ol' tone that clearly came from Coleman Hawkins. His work is absolutely magnificent. What else is recommended after the ones I already have? Anyone else fond of Cliff?

They always do that. She probably told him that she was 2.5 years old*, too. *Approx. 18 in dog years...

The swastika is an ancient symbol found in several cultures. The word comes from the Sanskrit svasti, meaning "well being." Archaeological evidence of swastika-shaped ornaments dates from the Neolithic period. It has long been widely-used in Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. Hindus often decorate the swastika with a dot in each quadrant. In India, it is common enough to be a part of several Devanagari fonts. It is also a symbol in the modern Unicode and is often imprinted on religious texts, marriage invitations, and decorations. It is used to mark religious flags in Jainism and Buddhist temples in Asia. The symbol occurs in other Asian, European, African and Native American cultures – sometimes as a geometrical motif and sometimes as a religious symbol. The "bent" swastika is the one associated with the Nazis. The right-facing swastika (such as the building under discussion) has nothing but benign and even highly positive associations. Take a look. Here's a picture of the building: Here's a right-facing swastika: (Technically, this image is a fylfot, one of the holiest symbols in the Jain religion.) Now here's the familiar nazi symbol: Now, which image does the building resemble? Basically, people are just ignorant...

Just to clarify, I don't think that these photos are unimportant, nor do I think that this thread is useless. I merely said that, given my very jaundiced view of humanity, they do not suprise me in the least. Human beings are very resiliant. Put them to work in a death camp, and they will soon become indifferent to the death they see every day. It will become routine, part of the background. I honestly do not see the difference between the perpetuation of ordinary life in the death camps among the SS, and the perpetuation of ordinary life among American soldiers in Iraq. How could it be otherwise? How could you go on amidst so much death without negating it, at least to some extent?

Certainly not a pro-Nazi perspective, but I fail to see why this is so shocking. What did people expect? That the SS officers were walking around in black armbands, full of the grim seriousness that the murder of millions deserves? These are human beings working in a death factory. If Abu Ghraib showed us nothing, it's that when you don't consider your charges to be human, you won't feel bad about the stuff you're doing to them. No, stacking naked guys isn't same as turning them into lampshades, but the reaction was the same, wasn't it? And look at the photos of southern whites at lynchings. They look like they're at a picnic! No, this doesn't shock me in the least. If anything, it merely confirms my rather dim view of human nature.

Yeah! Great one! Even more than Brubeck, I love Desmond on these albums. He had such a wonderful tone...

I second (third?) the recommendations for "Time Further Out," which I just listened to recently, as a matter of fact. Great album. "We're All Together Again (For the First Time)" is great, too. This is a live album featuring Desmond AND Mulligan. Great stuff! I also enjoy the Brubeck/Rushing album...

OJ breeds dogs?!

Strongbad deals with office jerks in this e-mail...

This is one of those cases where that whole "art vs. the marketplace" thing comes in and makes mincemeat out of our perceptions and even our language. Your point, with which I don't disagree (it bugs me that people have confused the meaning of the word "con" (as in "con man" and "con game") and now think of "conning" as something a "con man" does, when actually "con" is short for "confidence"), is that "cover" once meant a souless, money-grubbing rush-job of a recording that was intended to play on the confusion of the record buyer when confronted with ten versions of the song he just heard on the radio. Your argument (as I read it) is that a recording of a song that was intended respectfully shouldn't be called a "cover" because it wasn't made with the marketplace in mind. But we run into a couple of snags when we ask the question: How can we tell the difference? Yes, in the wake of the Beatles popularity, everybody was recording songs like "I Want To Hold Your Hand" and "Can't Buy Me Love." And, yes, most versions of those songs were horrible and made only to grab a fast buck. But what happens when a song is recorded for all the wrong reasons, but still works? Was Otis Redding REALLY honoring the Stones when he recorded his version of "Satisfaction"? Not likely. From what I've read, Otis had never even heard the song when it was suggested that he cut it. Similarly, was Aretha REALLY giving her props to Otis when she recorded "Respect"? Otis didn't think so. He out and out said, "That girl stole my song!" More later...

I can understand someone having mixed feelings about "Blue Train." It's a very high-end hard bop date, and if that doesn't really set you on fire, you might well wonder what all the fuss is about. But "A Love Supreme" is another matter entirely. It's probably the most ECSTATIC piece of music I've ever heard. Not for nothing is it my number one pick of music I'd like to be listening to when I die (just not on the car stereo, please).

I picked this up a while back. It's teriffic disc. Very worth picking up. Another fun disc of Petra's is her all vocal version of "The Who Sell Out." It's not jazz, but it's cool!

Yes, I am. I remind myself of that as I sit here in the Intensive Care Unit staring at my wife behind the oxygen mask! (She's finally getting better, after three days here suffering from acute graft vs. host disease outbreak #1, "engraftment syndrome.") JS, great advice. My wife has had health problems too. She was diagnosed with M.S. about ten years ago. For a while it looked like she was going to end up in a wheelchair, but we found a great neurologist who peformed wonders with steroid therapy and appropriate medication. She still has problems, but at least she can walk and use her hands! She has had some related problems that have required surgery. In fact, she's going under the knife for the third time this year on Wednesday. When she was first diagnosed, her doctor told us that a great many marriages fail under the strain of having a spouse with illness. I literally cannot understand that. I love my wife more than life itself, and I'll be damned if I ever leave her because she's sick!

The first one I bought (in fact, I think it was the only one I bought when they first came out) was the Watkins, primarily because Mobley was on it. At the time, I was more into sixties jazz and found a lot of fifties stuff I'd heard to be too stiff. Several years later, I started getting into jazz recorded during the fifties and before and I picked up the Melle. Then I got a note from True Blue that this batch of Conns was being deleted, so I ordered the McGhee discs. By this point, the discs had largely become OOP, and I was frustrated because I was finally getting into the ones I owned. I obsessively searched for the others in the series (this was before I was buying things online). Finally, I came upon a used record store that had the entire series...new! It seemed that they had gotten them in when the came out, and nobody had bought them! I was able to get the rest, and I'm very fond of all of them. I listened to them all recently. Hard to pick a favorite! Have to say that I really like that Frank Foster date...

This is one of those albums that I was aware of for several years before I ever heard it. The cover was one of the very popular posters being sold at my college in the late '80s and early '90s. I don't know if the people who bought it actually OWNED the record, but I used the see the poster in dorm rooms all the time. When I started getting into jazz, I actually avoided this album because of association with collegiate knuckle-heads (I also had picked up some sort of anti-Blue Note bias from one of the jazz books I was reading at the time (don't remember the title) which disliked the "rehearsed" sound of the Blue Note albums). Fortunately, I got over this and decided to check it out (I've owned four different copies of "Blue Train" over the years: My first was a casette tape (!) purchased at Planet Records when it was located in Kenmore Square in Boston, the second was the standard late-80s CD, then the so-called "Ultimate Blue Train" (which I still own) and a wonderful vinyl copy purchased at Last Vestage Vinyl in Albany, NY). Ever since I first heard it, it's been a favorite of mine. A classic through and through. I believe this was the first place I ever heard Lee Morgan!

My wife and I met in high school when I was in the eleventh grade and she was in twelfth. We were friends all through my junior year, and while I was attracted to her, we were never romantically involved. In fact, she was dating one of my best friends during most of that time. The following fall, I was visiting potential colleges and I wanted to visit the school she attended (Boston University). Her boyfriend (and my friend) went to the same school, so we all got together when I visited and hung out. Her boyfriend ditched us to go play D&D with some guys from MIT, so we went back to her dorm to hang out and wait for my dad to show up. At first, we went to a party on her floor, but we quickly got bored with that scene. We went back to her room (it's not like you think!) and just sat around talking until my dad came to get me. After I left (she reports), she called her boyfriend (with whom she had been having problems. Even though they attended the same school, they saw each other rarely) and broke up with him. Two weeks later, she came home for Thanksgiving and we "hooked up" as the kids say today. That was nineteen years ago, and we've been together ever since. Not bad for a rebound fling!