Rooster_Ties

Glad to see you back AB, post when you can!!! If I lived in his community (anywhere within an hour's drive) - I'm sure I'd be one of the white people who would accept the Bishop's invitation, at least for a service or two, and there's no way I'd accept the $5. Sure it's a publicity stunt, but not all publicity stunts are bad. In fact, I think there's some chance that this could cause some more discussion - perhaps in other churches (both white and black), in other cities - about race. Sure, not LOTS of churches, but lets say just 20 churches in various cities across the country attempt to do something similar - or different - to specifically invite people of other races to their own 'monochromatic' church. Well, then that's 20 more churches doing something like that, than might have otherwise.

Any relation to Norah Jones?? Seems like I heard somewhere before that she was related to some other musician.....

The "planned rust" idea is all well and good, I suppose - conceptually speaking at least. But my biggest beef is that I end up getting red rust all over my hands, and often a little on my clothes, every time I open up the set. So, for this reason, it gets the prize for dumbest box-set packaging concept.

Well, I think I'm beginning to like this bishop's idea more and more -- the more I read about it. It seems like a genuine effort to reach across the racial divide, albeit through some rather unconventional means. I had my doubts at first, reading only the first article from ABC and also another one from AP. But then when I saw that it was an offer only good for the month of August -- so we're talking only four Sunday's here -- I thought this was kind of a cool idea to say to whites "Hey, you're really welcome here, and we're not kidding". At the very least, it certainly is a creative idea, and I gotta give some props for that!!

A preacher in Shreveport, La., says he's willing to pay whites to attend services at his predominantly black Baptist church. (ABCNEWS.COM) Paid Parishioners Preacher to Pay Whites to Attend His Predominantly Black Church S H R E V E P O R T, La., Aug. 1 -- Bishop Fred Caldwell says Jesus never intended for his Shreveport, La., church to be exclusively black, so he plans on paying whites to come to mass. "There's a need for diversity in the body of Christ and especially on Sunday morning, we need to look like the kingdom of God. I don't think at this point we're there." Caldwell says he will pay whites $5 per hour to attend Sunday services at Greenwood Acres Full Gospel Baptist Church and $10 an hour for the Thursday service. "People get paid to go a lot of places, we might as well at church," Caldwell said. Caldwell said the idea to encourage whites to attend his church in exchange for money came to him while he was looking out at his parishioners during his Sunday sermon. He says the predominantly black community at Greenwood Acres is largely supportive of his unconventional attempt to expand the diversity of the congregation. "We have a few that are not agreeing with it, don't necessarily see the vision. As they stick around they'll probably see the vision," Caldwell said. "We need to reach all people." Since news of his plan got out, the calls started coming in from people interested in finding out more. Caldwell says some of the calls were from people who didn't want the money, but were just happy to be invited. Caldwell says he expects those who come for the payoff to return for the word of God and not a five-spot in the future. "When they get here, they will hear the word of God, which brings faith because faith comes by hearing, and hearing the word of God," Caldwell said. "It will get the audience I believe that really needs to hear the gospel and they will go out and in turn, tell others," he said The white visitors who want to be paid will have to register when they attend Greenwood Acres. Caldwell says he will pay them from his pocket and enlist the help of the congregation if needed. The preacher says he plans to put out more chairs in his church this Sunday. ========== Another good quote, from another version of the story... And another quote, from yet another version of the story, from the same local professor... And leave it to all the national media outlets to leave out one important detail... Which I found on-line, in a version of the story from the Sydney Morning Herald, Australia. ========== Bishop Fred Caldwell is offering to pay white people to attend his church in Shreveport, Louisiana. Criss Williams is one of the few white members. Bishop: I'll pay white people to attend my church Friday, August 1, 2003 Posted: 12:04 PM EDT (1604 GMT) (CNN) -- Bishop Fred Caldwell of the Greenwood Acres Full Gospel Baptist Church in Shreveport, Louisiana, has a pretty radical idea to diversify the largely black congregation of his church. This month, Caldwell is going to pay white people to attend his sermons. It's five bucks for a Sunday service, 10 for a Thursday service. And the idea is already stirring up controversy. CNN anchor Soledad O'Brien spoke with Bishop Caldwell from Shreveport on Friday morning. Joining him was one of the few white members of the church, Criss Williams. O'BRIEN: Bishop Caldwell, let's begin with you. How is the attendance right now in the church, overall, black people and white people? CALDWELL: Well, attendance overall at Greenwood Acres Full Gospel is great. We have very few white members, but overall it's a super great church. O'BRIEN: How many white people are in your church? CALDWELL: In attendance on a regular basis maybe about five or six. O'BRIEN: Five or six people; and you have a couple thousand members, right? CALDWELL: Well, five or six white people. Basically, predominantly 99.9 percent are black or African-American congregation. Only about five or six white people on a continuing basis. O'BRIEN: So it sounds like you've got great numbers in the church as it is. It's obviously not a filling the seats kind of thing. Why would you want to pay white people to come into the church? CALDWELL: Because this area basically is polarized and we need to mix it up. And so $5 is good fishing bait. O'BRIEN: Criss, did you get paid $5 when you came to the church and do you think it's going to work? WILLIAMS: No, I didn't get paid, not monetarily. I've received spiritual blessings ... that benefit my life in much more valuable ways to me. I think that it will work. They will come. I think that a lot of secular organizations and businesses already use incentives and promotions to draw people in to hear what they have to offer. Once they're there, then it's up to them to determine whether or not they want to receive what's offered. And I think it's no different from that. In that light, God made everything. He made money. And for a bishop to utilize that resource to draw people to the kingdom of God is a wonderful thing. O'BRIEN: Bishop Caldwell, we don't have a ton of time, but I've got two quick questions for you. First, why is Thursday more valuable than Sunday? CALDWELL: Well, Thursday is more valuable than Sunday simply because people are working and it might take a little bit more extra effort. And then on top of that, they'll probably get paid, $10 an hour is not bad. It's probably better than maybe McDonald's or Burger Kings would pay. O'BRIEN: Finally, you've heard the criticisms, right? I mean at the top of the story here we played some tape. And there are some people who say truly there are a lot of people in your area who could use that money or you could take it and help out poor people who really need it, not paying off white people to come to church. How do you answer that? CALDWELL: I answer that, Judas Iscariot said the same thing to Jesus, that money should be taken and given to the poor. That argument is always out there. The people that are saying it I doubt very seriously if they're taking their weekly paycheck and giving it to the poor. So let's just cut to the chase. America needs to come together and the kingdom of God especially needs to look like the kingdom of God on Sunday morning and that's what we're striving to do.

We miss you, AB. I know you're busy, busy, busy - probably with work and such. Just wanted to post a pubic note here, to say that we hope all is well with you, and that we're thinkin' of you.

Hmmmmm...... Maybe I guess I'll hafta reconsider getting the Blackhawk box (or maybe borrow yours for a spell?? - 'Free For All'???). I never much cared for the early 90's CD issues of "Friday Night" and "Saturday Night", and frankly - I found them kinda boring - as compared with the "Miles in Stockholm" discs with Trane (in March of 1960), and with Sonny Stitt (in October of 1960). I thought that back in the early 90's, when I first hear then, and borrowed the single CD's from a friend about a year ago, and had the same reaction. It wasn't so much whether Hank fit in of didn't fit in, but there was something generally lackluster about the whole thing. Could the prior CD mastering have that much impact on the music itself??? I kinda doubt it, but I guess stranger thing have happened.

WAIT - BIG AL - I can get one here (brand new) for like $16 plus tax. Or, I can get one on-line for about $13 (including postage). What I need is someone who already has an extra one they'd like to trade.

Hey 'couw' - FYI, Big Al is gonna trade me an extra "Solid" he has, for an extra Hutch "Components" that I have. So, that takes care of "Solid" (which Al is gonna send to me, and I'll include in the package I'm sending to you in Germany), and also "The Kicker" (which 'rockefeller center' is gonna send you directly from Austria, and I'm going to send him an Organissimo CD, when I get the 'volume discount' on the batch being sent to Kansas City). To everyone else: STILL LOOKING TO TRADE FOR "Africaine". Can this get any more convoluted????

Just sent it to the new address you provided. To everyone else: STILL LOOKING TO TRADE FOR "Africaine".

That story (about the fake album cover) is simply priceless. Thanks for sharing the cover, and the story.

I might naturally be inclined to alpha everything "all together" as was suggested above, but then my wife would scream bloody murder cuz she'd have to wade through hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of discs she has no interest in at all (never!!), just to browse the 300 or 400 that she would be interested in. I've got everything split into the following categories... [*]Pop/Rock (everything) [*]Classical (that my wife will listen to, 19th Century and before, and select 20th Century composers) [*]Classical (that my wife won't listen to, basically all my weird and/or atonal (often serial) 'classical' music) [*]Jazz (the 90% that my wife won't listen to) [*]Jazz (the 10% , mostly piano trios and similar jazz with no horns, that she will listen to) Oh - as far as the question about where to file "donald fagan", definitely in "Pop/Rock", without any doubt.

That's totally wack!!!

Afraid I haven't heard (nor even heard of) a "Jim Mair". Not sure if he's still on the KC scene or not. I first moved here in the Fall of 1994, and our time in Kansas City may not have overlapped. I'll check around, and see if he's still playing. "Free For All" - You ever heard of "Jim Mair"??? Was he a tenor player, or alto???

Hey Rooster! Have ya received my PM yet? Loking forward to seeing that list! Hi Al!! I sent you a trade-list via e-mail. (Both via the "e-mail" button in your Organissimo profile, and also to the e-mail address in your PM.) If you didn't get 'em, I may just post my trade list here to this thread. Let me know if you didn't get it.

Vwie govoreetye poruskee??? Man, what language don't you know, couw???

Frankly, "non-piano"-keyboard instruments are a total of barely two solos on the whole disc, if I remember right. So I'd guess that 95% of the disc is piano. GREAT disc by the way. Simply amazing.

According to AMG, Ceora is on the following: Hill, Andrew - "Faces of Hope" [1980] It's one of Hill's solo-piano dates. I haven't listened to that particular cut in quite a while, but as I recall, you'd never guess in a million years that it was a Lee Morgan tune. I'll have to dig it out (and the original), and see if I even hear much similarity at all. Surely there must be some, but Hill does things with the tune that nearly make it his own.

Thanks a bunch!!! No rush necessary...

( Thanks for changing the topic title for me, b3-er!!! ) So, does anybody have an extra "Africaine" to spare???

Might well be my second choice (classically speaking) after the Henze. Amazing music!!!!

I have tapes of that Japanese "Complete Plugged Nickel" set (from a guy on the Internet, actually - it was BITNET back in those days - which will tell you how old those tapes are), and I nearly plunked down $250 for one back in the early 90's, before anyone had any idea it would be released in the U.S. -- and I'm DAMN glad I DIDN'T get it, when I had the chance. I used to have that same "Facets" album/cover on vinyl, and come to think of it - I might still have it. Hafta check...

Here's one I'd never seen before... (Sorry, couldn't link to it - had to upload it.)

By the way, I'm considering Andrew Hill's "Passing Ships" as my choice for when I have my jazz hat on.

What would it be??? I just started this very same topic on a 'classical music' bulletin-board, similar to this one (http://classicalmusicguide.com/phpBB2/) Now obviously, I answered my own question there, on a classical board, with a 'classical' CD (and my answer is reproduced below, along with a plug for the Organissimo board!!). I'll answer the question from a 'jazz' perspective after I give it some more thought, but I wanted to go ahead and start the thread here. What one disc/album means the most to you??? ========== A strong contender for me would be... Hans Werner Henze: Requiem (for trumpet, piano, and chamber orchestra) This was one of the first large-scale 20th Century works I ever purchased. I came at classical music from multiple odd directions, including Frank Zappa. When I heard Zappa's "The Yellow Shark" with the Ensemble Modern ('EM'), I became totally smitten with this chamber orchestra (about 26 members, plus or minus). I started to buy recordings by this group specifically, and about the 4th or 5th 'EM' disc I purchased was this huge work by Henze. Although I liked it quite a bit at first, it took me quite a long time to get my ears around it. Really, it might have been a couple years before I had heard it frequently enough to be able to anticipate some of the music, and to get a sense of where it was going. (I was pretty new to 'classical' music back then (early 90's), so even a Brahms symphony would have taken me 6 months to really get my ears around.) Then, over the last 5 or 6 years - the Henze "Trumpet Requem" (as I like to call it) has become a sort of 'home base' for me, when I'm looking for something to listen to, to "clean out the cobwebs in my ears" (as another friend of mine puts it). Now, it's both become familiar - and is nearly always fresh to my ears - all at the same time. I've since grown to like Henze and his music a great deal, although I always seem to return to his Requiem as being what I think is his best work, or at least the one that speaks to me the most. In general, I find Henze's music to have aspects of many of my other favorite 20th Century composers: Ives/Ruggles, Schoenberg, Roger Sessions, Stravinsky, Ernst Toch, Roberto Gerhard, Ernst Krenek, Hindemith, Varèse, and Zappa. What is your one desert-island disc, and why??? ========== PS: Some of you might know me (also as “Rooster_Ties”) from the old “Blue Note” jazz bulletin board, which closed about 6 months ago (long story). I am most active now on the “Organissimo” bulletin board (where most of the “Blue Note” refugees went, after it closed”), and I also post some on the “All About Jazz” board --- all under the same name: “Rooster_Ties”. If by any chance any of you are fans of Andrew Hill’s music (progressive jazz pianist from the mid-60’s and beyond), let me say that there are quite a number of Andrew Hill nuts (like myself!) on the Organissimo board ( http://organissimo.org/forum or just http://www.organissimo.org) - you ought to check it out!!!