xybert

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwnVgOJE3dk

In all honesty the packaging is a factor for me on this one. Unless i pay a fortune to get it couriered to me it's going to get mangled in the post. I appreciate the creativity but for the cost something simple/solid/practical would have been cool... but maybe i just need to free my miiiiind maaaaan. Having said that, i'm still tempted. For those interested someone actually posted an 'unboxing' vid on youtube (prepare to possible cringe at his disc handling). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRzyaZPsFBE

Thanks to those that confirmed that the sound issues on the first four tracks of Disposability aren't on the original LP. With this sort of thing, if it's a replication of the original document, warts and all how it was originally presented to the public, then annoying as it is it's a bit easier to roll with. If it's something that can only be heard on the reissue (or in this case, most likely, a rip of someone else's reissue) then it becomes even more annoying.

I'll be making a donation sometime over the next few days. Edit: done, via paypal.

The music is awesome. Sound wise, overall it's okay, but there's a weird, constant popping/fluttering sound on tracks 7-10, which are the first for tracks of Disposability. It sounds like either Lacy is playing too close to the mic and overloading it, or it's a faulty mic, etc. I would love to know if this could be heard on the original release, or if it's just part of this reissue (i.e. whatever source they've used for this reissue has deteriorated or is just generally shitty). It's annoying, you're mileage will vary in terms of whether it's a dealbreaker or not.

For pete's sake, people, there's a WHOLE where you can go to town on Snakeoil. Same old yapping. It's a nice record, band is more interesting live in my opinion, but WHATEVER. There's almost been as many posts criticizing the spontaneous outbreak of discussion on Snakeoil as actul posts in the thread. I think we get it now. Fair enough. Mods, would it be possible to move the Snakeoil related posts from last week to the linked thread? Maybe then we can move on. A couple of people have posted links to the thread now. Today's the official release date. Awesome, eh? I keep checking my email for the shipping notice.

This is refreshing as in today's day and age regarding listeners to inside/outside jazz - for the most part listeners stick with what they like and rarely venture to new territories. Maybe especially true with many of the contributors on jazz bulletin boards after arround 2002 when the novelty must have worn off. There was a time when this medium was new when listeners/participants were giving new music (to them) a shot. My impression these days is that is long since over. The listeners these days for the most part are stuck with what they like or know - too damn bad, really - if a musician or group of musicians are seen or thought to be "out" or "avant-garde", many will simply never listen to those musicians never, ever, never or we can talk about the aversion to European musicians by those who one would think would or could be open-minded to them - but rarely does that happen - as those musicians are not from their group of proven masters... oh well Speaking for myself, i consider myself to have pretty broad taste in jazz however i very rarely take risks these days. The main reason being that there's more 'must have' stuff on my wishlist and more coming out everyday than i'll ever get the time or money to check out: i'm on a tight budget and as much as i'd like to take a chance the fact is i've got a million sure fire hits lined up. The other thing is, as someone who's only really been a dedicated listener for the last 7 years or so there's 70-80 odd years of gold to play catchup on also. Nutshell = lack of funds probably leads to people taking less chances on left field recommendations. In terms of relcuctance to check out new releases, i think that some fans like the idea that the jazz story, for the most part, is at an end. It's kind of easier that way. I think that some people almost take it as an affront to the past that anything vital could be going on at the moment. It kind of requires reassessment, and in doing that some beloved periods could seem to hold less importance when placed in the newly larger story, especially in a story where things keep getting interesting as time goes on. I think some people prefer it that the story is all nicely wrapped up.

Thanks for posting this. I really enjoyed The Long Waiting, it will be interesting to hear a few of those tracks being performed by a smaller group.

I can't think of anything off the top of my head but am totally on the same page with regards to Metheny being great ear food while not shredding the ears of innocent passers by. Around the home or in the car with my wife and baby son Metheny is often a good go to guy when i need something light but tasty. Rejoicing was a good rec for Metheny, however when it gets to The Call you'll be scrambling for the volume dial.

Speaking of Knuffke, I was glad to see that Ideal Bread's next album reached it's Kickstarter goal: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/943079273/ideal-breads-beating-the-teens . From the website: "Ideal Bread is preparing to record their most ambitious project yet: a 2-CD album entitled Beating the Teens. This will be a document of their year-long efforts to recompose and reimagine Steve Lacy's 3-CD box set Scratching the Seventies." Looks like this will be coming out on Cuneiform early 2014.

IIRC Mr Berne posted here when Snake Oil was accused of much the same thing. He vehemently denied as far as I recall being under any pressure from ECM to smooth out his music to fit the label. He probably made more money and became more well known than all his own releases on his own label (which hasn't released anything for years now), but okay. He wasn't forced but when you go to ECM you already know what is expected. As in, Emo Jazz. I think that for a lot of listeners when an artist releases an album on ECM it's almost like they are getting a sort of stamp of approval. This might make them reassess an artists earlier work. Right or wrong i don't begrudge Berne any increased exposure or sales that might result from working with ECM. I really, really do see peoples point with regards to ECM taking the edges of artists (see my previous comment regarding Lloyd/Moran), but i am always slightly uncomfortable with the implication that they are selling out or playing in a style that they themselves don't want to play. Is it so hard to imagine that Berne wanted the Snakeoil album to sound exactly as it sounded? Don't get me wrong. I glad him and everyone that goes ECM is able to make money and it hopefully leads people to buying their really them recordings. Having said that. Would it have sounded exactly as it sounded without ECM being involved? He's been a recording artist for how long now? Like his playing or not.....Berne is one of those that his own "voice/sound" so to speak. If no one told anyone it was Tim Berne involved in anyway....would anyone believe it? It probably would have sounded different if ECM wasn't involved but that was the way Berne wanted it. Berne's sound has evolved over the years; would someone listening to a Hard Cell album who was only familiar with Fractured Fairytales or The Ancestors think that it sounds like Tim Berne? I know i'm playing devils advocate to a certain extent and i do honestly see where you are coming from.... I guess i just give Berne the benefit of the doubt. One hole in my argument (and i'm surprised Steve Reynolds hasn't chimed in with it yet) is that apparently Snakeoil sounds more traditionally Tim Berne like live. Again, i could still argue that for whatever reason he wanted the recorded document to sound the way it does...

IIRC Mr Berne posted here when Snake Oil was accused of much the same thing. He vehemently denied as far as I recall being under any pressure from ECM to smooth out his music to fit the label. He probably made more money and became more well known than all his own releases on his own label (which hasn't released anything for years now), but okay. He wasn't forced but when you go to ECM you already know what is expected. As in, Emo Jazz. I think that for a lot of listeners when an artist releases an album on ECM it's almost like they are getting a sort of stamp of approval. This might make them reassess an artists earlier work. Right or wrong i don't begrudge Berne any increased exposure or sales that might result from working with ECM. I really, really do see peoples point with regards to ECM taking the edges of artists (see my previous comment regarding Lloyd/Moran), but i am always slightly uncomfortable with the implication that they are selling out or playing in a style that they themselves don't want to play. Is it so hard to imagine that Berne wanted the Snakeoil album to sound exactly as it sounded?

Cool, looking forward to hearing your thoughts if you get a chance. I've ordered Matador & The Bull, really looking forward to hearing it.

I don't know man... i remember listening to an interview with Tim Berne aroud the time the first Snakeoil album came out where he talked about working with Eicher/ECM and how yes, he did tailor the sound to take advantage of the ECM aesthetic (or something along those lines). In other words no one held a gun to his head and he was really happy with the collaboration and resulting recording. He seems like a really straight up guy, didn't sound like he was talking shit although he might have been.

Very interesting read. The part where Ware thought that the 'last concert' was just a gimmick only to be told that it was indeed the last concert for that group was funny on a few levels. Has there ever been a 'This is Spinal Tap' style mockumentary made about This Music? Seems ripe for it. Also interesting what they had to say about physical media versus downloads. Helped to crystalise my own thoughts on it a bit... intellectually i want to say that it's all about the music but i've never been able to explain that weird disconnect i've felt when downloading an album from bandcamp etc. If it's an album i really dig i always end up needed to get it on CD to feel complete. I always enjoy reading Shipp interviews; he talks a good game and i always get excited to revisit the handful of his albums that i have in my collection... I do enjoy Shipp's music but i feel like the penny is yet to fully drop for me. Like, don't love yet, but i think it's going to happen at some point.

The sound cloud songs sound like The Bad Plus crossed with Hiromi. Edit to add a word.

JD Allen - Grace I'm really late to the party with regards to JD Allen, have only just gotten in to his music in the last couple of months. Even as a JD Allen newbie I thought that Eldar Djangirov was an odd choice of pianist for Allen, let alone for his first non trio album in a while. I don't think i'll be rushing out to buy Eldar Djangirov's leader albums just yet but i must say he really shines here. I'm sure if there was blindfold test many people would have their interest piqued as to who the pianist was. Dezron Douglas on bass and Jonathan Barber on drums are relative unknowns, but man do they shine here, bringing in some swing at just the right times. This is definitely free bop of the slightly meandering, not of all that memorable theme type but i've found it really engaging in an unexplainable way. A surprise hit, for me; i've been spinning this a lot.

Trio 3 + Jason Moran: Refraction - Breakin' Glass This album was discussed earlier in this thread. I've had it for a couple of days now and have given it a few spins. I really like it, think it's excellent. I like Jason Moran's playing as a sideman on the Charles Lloyd albums but all ECM bashing aside he definitely sounds... you just get less of that full bodied Jason Moran flavour. On Refraction - Breakin' Glass he is in full effect, it sounds like Jason Moran. For fans that are thinking of picking this up but are on the fence, on this occasion the amazon samples will give you a pretty good idea of what you're in for. They don't tell the full story but they are a pretty good trailer. It's a very well rounded album, too. Highly satisfying. I don't want to talk it up too much and i am still on early listens but this could be a bit of a classic. At least, i think it's a must have for Moran fans.

I forgot about the Konitz set... it's excellent IMO. I actually wondered at the time, how well regarded are the Konitz albums that make up the set among Konitz fans? I had low expectations and found them to be really nice slices of jazz from their respective periods.

Yeah that was lazy typing on my part... I have got auto updates off, but every now and again when i open iTunes it still comes up with a pop up asking if i want to download 11. I would still need to confirm it but i still find it annoying... from memory there's no 'do not ask me again' option. The other thing is when you do the 'check for updates' thing for the overall mac and it comes up with the various updates for Safari, OS X etc the iTunes 11 one is always there and i always have to manually deselect it so it doesn't update when i update everything else. Anyway, no majors just griping about something relatively insignificant about a product that i actually like... first world problems etc... EDIT: Actually, the pop up came up this morning when i opened iTunes and it actually did have a 'do not ask me again' option... nevermind...

The Charlie Haden set is fairly mainstream. If memory serves it's way more inside than the George Russell, anyway.

No worries; i don't doubt that a lot of people will be getting back on board with Coleman via Functional Arrhythmias. It's an excellent album.

Have the original CDs ever sounded that good? In the grand scheme of things i've only heard a small slice but i've always thought of them as being on the 'okay to not that great' side and i'm not an audiophile by any means. Not that two wrongs make a right if they are indeed butchering the remasters on the boxsets... myself i've only done a few really quick A/B comparisons on an admittedly low end sound system and heard no obvious difference.

I like iTunes but it's what i've always used and have never felt a need to try anything else. Running on a macbook, haven't upgraded to 11. Apple Lossless is an excellent audio codec IMO. I don't bother with the iTunes store or any of the extraneous stuff. Actually it is kind of annoying that it keeps prompting 11 as an auto update even though i don't have the recommended minimum requirements (Mac OS X version blah blah or later). It should just recognise that i don't have the minimum requirements and let it go... if i was half asleep one day and accidentally updated to 11 and it ran crappily due to my version of OS X i'd be pissed.