Big Beat Steve

What's keeping you from going BOTH ways, i.e. buying vinyl whenever you prefer THAT medium and keeping and/or digitizing your CDs at the same time? Dumping all your CDs in order to go the vinyl-only route is just as silly as dumping all your vinyl in order to go "all CD" (as many did in the 90s). I can't really consider those who are dead set on sticking to one single medium (and dumping their other media in the process) "real" collectors - they're just music consumers or maybe music bookkepers IMHO. Digitizing your music for convenience is another matter (and where's the problem with buying your vinyl (or CDs) AND digitizing your music whenever you want it on an iPod etc.?) but I'm still not convinced ALL digitized media are going to last as long as vinyl does. And having to do backups of increasing data volumes on additional drives ever so often also leaves me wondering where all this is going to end. As for making one's existence easier, carrying thousands of tunes on iPods is an advantage, of course ... but as for home listening ... honestly, I really cannot see how things get easier if I have to select tracks and artists from PC databases (especially if I do not fancy leading my entire home existence in front of my PC anyway ) instead of just having to pull a record or CD out and put it onto the turntable/CD player? To me it's a bit of an "emperor's clothes" thing, all this ...

John, this was the Paris Festival in 1949. Modernism or not, I guess a weedhead was a weedhead (no matter waht the musical inclinations were) and meant good company if you were in for some weed. So backstage friendships might make any sort of alliances possible. :D

We may not be talking about exactly the same period. Revolutionary Blues with Bechet was c. 1944-45 IIRC. I was referring to somewhat later dates, including some recorded in France. But be that as it may - it may be a matter of "agree to disagree", I guess, and besides, it's the book that alocis asked about.

Yes, the book is fun and great reading. I guess some details in it need to be taken with a grain of salt, though. But those biographical sources that stated that "Mezz was a major figure in classical jazz not so much for his playing but as a purveyor of almost unlimited quantities of marijuana to the musicians and for writing "Really the Blues"" are spot-on. Some of his mid-40s King Jazz recordings with Bechet may be quite OK (I only have part of them) but a lot of what he forced into record grooves after that period was just some laughable noodling and doodling of scales. Nice amateur attempts but if it hadn't been for his earlier behind-the-scenes presence and the continued (and just as laughable) patronage and hero worshipping by Hugues Panassié he would have been nowhere overall. But that's beside the point here. The book IS enjoyable.

That's the very thing I LOVE about the "teenager" tracks that appear in 50s and 60s films . They sound nothing like real rock and roll - thankfully. Yes, the contrast IS fascinating. That's why I go for that kind of 50s soundtracks too (though I love all facets of TRUE 50s r'n'r as well). Listened to the entire LP again last night, and actually a few of the tracks give a fairly passable imitation of danceable instrumental R&B (OK, the West and East coasters among the jazzmen did better with their Boots Brown and Dan Drew lineups ) but some of the score is really a bit weird if you picture it as the background to r'n'r-inspired 50s teen action.

Druid jazz musicians? How about MOONDOG? (of "Improvisation in 4/4"/"Improvisation in 7/4" etc. fame on Coral / c.1953) He certainly looked the part, and his music was waaay out there too.

Enzo Iannacci? I DUE CORSARI!! But hearing them sing in English is a VERY acquired taste!

Yeah, that should be fun. And to confuse those present, make a point of choosing those records marked "CANTA IN NAPOLITANO". :D (The Godfather in the house will be soooo pleased! ) Coming to think of it, how about MARINO MARINI? Though I imagine records by some of the artists you name might perhaps be a bit difficult to get in the States.

Not according to the FS website. But since they seem to be re-reissuing their LP catalog (often combining 2 LP's on one CD) not all hope is lost yet. I was indeed glad to get hold of that Fresh Sound LP. The cover art alone would have been worth the price of admission to me but the music is something else too, of course - though (as in the case of "The Wild One") it is a bit out of tune with the kind of music that you'd expect the protagonists of the movie would have been listening to.

There has been a thread dedicated to these recordings here some months ago, launched by the guy who did the remastering for a recent CD re-reissue of those concert recordings IIRC. The big point made was that fidelity had been improved considerably for that recent CD reissue (though this is not the CBS or Jazz Factory reissue show in Marcello's links). The search function ought to yield it. That said, I'm still quite happy with my CBS LP of those recordings.

Before Italy-based Italians (not umpteenth-generation expatriate Italians ) chime in, here's my 2c: Get yourself a load of ADRIANO CELENTANO discs! Perfect for every Italo occasion, starting with his "Azzurro" classic and - for a change - right up to his 50s r'n'r cover sung in Italian! And if you're more in a (retro-)swing mood, try RAY GELATO MEETS THE GOOD FELLAS.

Oh ye of short memory!! Forget about Star Trek muzak and check out his soundtrack to HOT ROD RUMBLE (1957). THATS' where the (cool) jazz connections are. :D

Of course there is. It's just that the essential has already been said. Being (a.o.) a 40s jazz nut, in fact Johnny Guarnieri has always been one of those where I figured if he's in the line-up it's bound to be good (and I've never been disappointed). As for records to check out, there was a JG LP on the IAJRC collector label that tied up a few loose ends as it brought together great performances (mostly from the 78 rpm era) that had been scattered here and there and therefore had been unjustly overlooked. Would have to look at my copy of the LP tonight for more details.

Could you bring yourself to thin out your own collection in a SUBSTANTIAL way in your lifetime to ease the plight on your nearest and dearest after you've left the building? Better appoint a knowledgeable and trustworthy caretaker in good time (and tell him so) to make sure your beloved ones won't dump your prized collections or be fooled into throwing it into the greedy hands of a cutthroat wheeler and dealer who'd give only a tiny fraction of even its wholesale worth.

Maybe so, and to each his own opinion and likes and dislikes, but does this force anybody else beyond that "inner circle" that you seem to be alluding to to automatically agree with this (or to put it another way, does this mean that it is wrong to ask questions about whether or why this dislike is well-founded?) Note that I am not taking sides in this "feud" between those concerned, but I certainly am rather unimpressed by personal dislikes of this sort, and reserve the right to come to my own conclusions and say so. Today it's Phil Schaap, tomorrow it's Scott Yanow (again), then it's Stanley Crouch's turn again, and then somebody else may be getting in the line of fire, and if you take a look at some of those engaging in this kind of feuds, how can you as an interested (and slightly bemused) observer AVOID the impression that sour grapes play a not too small part in such put-downs? Maybe the best way to avoid leaving such an impression would be to back up accusations and resentments with hard facts about what those coming into the line of fire have been found guilty of. Might be enlightening in more ways than one .... (But then again, the forum admins probably would disapprove ... )

Dave, I don't know about buying craziness in those "emerging collecting countries" in Asia at all (the way they sometimes calculate is unfathomable to the "old world" ), but as for Europe, have you ever figured out the cost of shipping such bulks? And then the customs duties come on top of that. This would break the viability of almost ANY deal of not so valuable/reissue items to European buyers. This kind of records IS around here and I'd bet most collectors who'd be in the market for collections of this size will already have a substantial part of it and/or find a substantial part of it are just duds or of no real interest to them. Even prime collections of nothing but originals suddenly become fairly expensive if you add shipping (even as by-loads in 20ft containers - and you'd have to find some trustworthy soul who'd take on your by-load anyhow) and customs duties. And make no mistake about it - Europeans are not gullible enough to NOT know about the weak dollar. So if you charge them a Euro total amount that would net you a nice profit they'd start wondering before buying. Good luck anyway.

Indeed! Dragon is a label justly renowned for doing a good job on its reissues. It's on DRCD 255. Here are the details (from the Dragon website). & The American Stars 1956 Forecast - You Go To My Head - Vacker flicka - A Night In Tunisia - Introduction - Dig - I'll Remember April - Oh, Lady Be Good - Looking For A Boy - Lover Man - A Foggy Day - I Got It Bad - Love For Sale - Half Nelson - These Foolish Things - Stella By Starlight - A Night In Tunisia - The Theme Rolf Ericson trumpet; Cecil Payne or Lars Gullin baritone sax; Freddie Redd or Duke Jordan piano; Tommy Potter or John Simmons bass; Art Taylor or Joe Harris drums; Ernestine Anderson vocal Now compare for yourselves.

Discovered this thread only yesterday after a week's absence and found both the article AND the entire thread highly entertaining (and only human, in a way ... ). I've no idea if in this case it really is a matter of one jazz writer being sore at another (and do not feel entitled or qualified to judge) but I must say that there have been quite a few posts on this board through recent years where I've had the impression they really boil down to "sour grapes" feelings among jazz writers/critics/producers (sort of "I could have done this job better than he did" or "I ought to be where this guy is now" feelings, you know ...). So IMO both sides of those rants really need to be taken with a grain of salt (hey, even Scott Yanow or Stanley Crouch can't be THAT bad .... :D, though MANY forum posts made them look even lower than low). Obviously I've never been able to listen to Phil Schaap's show (though I have read items of his here and there and have heard his statements in the occasional documentary) but reading the article I somehow felt strangely connected to this guy. He isn't the only radio character obsessed about his subject. Reading the article brought back memories of my studient days in the 80s when I regularly listened to a radio show called "Les Cinglés du Music Hall" (which might be translated as "The Music Hall fanatics") on French radio hosted by Jean-Christophe Averty and focusing on (mostly French) variety singers and orchestras of the 20s to 40s to an extent that can only strike you as extreme. Not to mention the fact that the host carried on in a state of permanent and extreme agitation throughout the show (only moderately toned down by the second speaker who served as a sort of cue guy) (If Brownie reads this, he certainly will be laughing ) I remember one show was made up of an entire hour of every conceivable late 20/early 30s version of "Just A Gigolo". Certainly something for diehards! But interesting even to early jazz fans as many of the orchestra accompaniments of the recordings provided quite a bit of hot jazz. In the same vein, carrying on forever about the meaning of "Okiedokie" is something where I can imagine it can get on some people's nerves ... but on the other hand, nobody is forced to listen if Schaap rambles on for too long, but as long as there are some who find this interesting (and there must be...) ... and aren't we collectors also prone to searching for unexplored territory and trying to discover minute trivia one way or another in our own collecting ways? Making up "facts" of course is impardonable and if he really is guilty of that (how about some irrefutable proof for things that have been made up, though?) his bluff ought to be called loudly and clearly but the bottom line is that if only half of the article is true this guy must strike a chord with quite a few collectors. And in today's world of streamlined, formatted radio and musical background information being extemely superficial and aimed at the utterly clueless (who need to be fed only tiny snippets of easy digestible info lest they be made aware of their cluelessness which of course is not to happen as they then might be lost as listeners ... ) this is quite an accomplishment. Every specialist radio show aimed at specialists is to be encouraged. There are too few of them anymore for our kind of music.

Just a note for those who have an eye on Hans van der Elsken's 1959 "JAZZ" book: A very nice facsimile reedition of the original 1959 Dutch edition of this book has recently been launched by Editions 7L in Paris: http://5b4.blogspot.com/2007/12/jazz-by-ed...der-elsken.html Shop price 20 euros. Recommended!! The facsimile is really very, very accurate and the rear cover barcode imprint is about the only thing to set it apart from the original. Hopefully this will also bring the sky-high prices of the originals down to a more reasonable level.

At roughly that time both U.S. AND European jazz magazines (and I've read a few of them from that era) complained persistently about the FLOOD of jazz records that hit the market. Sort of musical overdose ...

If starting prices of 102.81 EUROS with Amazon sellers is cheap to you, then NO - it is NOT that expensive ...

Yes, sad news. The list of those from the really classic era of jazz who are leaving the building is getting longer and longer really fast and I am afraid it won't be long before not a single link to that past will be left. (Many happy returns therefore to Johnny Griffin!) To make a change from other tribute record spinnings, I think I will put on this "Rock That Boogie" LP on Groove (RCA) tonight.

Agreed with MG. And as mentioned before in another thread, there were Sounds Inc., for example (though that was the early 60s prior to the Beat boom). And don't forget the more genuine Skiffle bands of the 50s, many of which really brought a genuineness and sincerity to the music that had been lacking elsewhere. Granted that a lot of British 50s Rock singers were copycats but many of them still managed to portray a sense of freshness and boyishness at a time (post-1958) when a lot of U.S. Rock'n'Roll (not to mention Rockabilly) had already been polished, streamlined and toned down by the industry bosses and A&R men. And after all, not all of the U.S. 50s Rock acts were that creative or genuine either. And was there anything more painful during that time than those pre-Rock era acts trying to get to grips with the R'n'R beat? Listening to crooning balladeers (who'd rather have modeled themselves after Sinatra, Haymes & Co.) fumbling with uptempo material with a beat (supplied by overproduced arrangements played by unsympathetic studio musicians to make matters worse) in most cases is laughable at best. @Bev Stapleton: Will do. But it's going to be along read. So far I've only made it into the first few chapters that dwell on the c.1949-50 start of grassroots jazzmen (Colyer, Barber, et al.) that were to become part of the Trad scene (the early amateur band attempts of one John R.T. Davies also get mentioned). So the book starts out early and so far it's been jazz all the way. And though I certainly am not the biggest trad or revival jazz fan in the world I found it hard to put the book aside.

Received my copy today. A whopping 500 pages (whew ... looks like it's going to be a LONG read, and from what I've picked up at random while thumbing through it, a highly interesting one), and not a single picture in the entire book so this does not look like another "nostalgia" item (as feared by MG) but rather something much more meaty.

Agree with John L and Paul Secor re- his early 50s recordings (Modern, Gold Star, etc.). The must be a huge number of compilations of his work so I'll leave recommendations to those more familiar with what is and has ben available but Ace should always be a safe bet. If you want vinyl, some nice ones (compiled with the lover sof more energetic blues in mind) are these (rec. 1954, mostly Herald material): Bad Boogie - Diving Duck DD 4308 Flash Lightnin' - Diving Duck DD 4307