J.A.W. Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 (edited) I have just played the 2 Bill Evans Village Vanguard K2s again-sublime! and to my ears much improved over the german 20 bit digi pack versions which generally I had very little time for. The hybrid Analogue Productions SACDs of Waltz for Debby and Sunday at the Village Vanguard are my favorite versions. Edited November 4, 2004 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with the Golden Arm Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 While I've never been a member of the BMG club I do see that they offer the K2s as "free" and have quite a few titles. Granted when all is said and done you are probably out $8.00 each but I am curious if these deals are worth it?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 (edited) Thoughts on the K-2's, or your favorite version of, these? • Thelonious In Action • Misterioso • Thelonious Monk with John Coltrane • Monk's Music (Japanese K-2) * * Well, this one's been discussed already. I'm guessing if you want mono, go for the K-2; if you want stereo, then the SACD hybrid? Also, just a thought: are the U.S. K-2's identical with the Japanese K-2's? They "should" be, but perhaps pressing plant issues ... ? Edited November 4, 2004 by Late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 (edited) The Thelonious Monk with John Coltrane K2 sounds very good. I was disappointed with the new SACD and kept the K2 as my "definitive" version. Edited November 4, 2004 by Claude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesnik Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Also, just a thought: are the U.S. K-2's identical with the Japanese K-2's? They "should" be, but perhaps pressing plant issues ... ? That's exactly the same quesion that's been going around my head for some time now. Are they actually the same remasters as the VICJs? And what about those budget editions? They should just be repressings, I think, but ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swinger Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Claude: I just placed my next K2 cd: Workin' With Miles Davis Quintet. I liked its first cd pressing but since I don't have it,I thought to buy it. Can you recommend me any other OJC cds that sound *much* better as K2 editions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Hello Swinger, The K2s I have compared to the regular OJCs or german ZYX OJC20s are: - Eric Dolphy - Outward bound: much better than the Dolphy prestige box, where this sessions sounds thin and steely - Eric Dolphy - Far Cry & Five Spot Vol.1: more dynamic, fuller and tighter than the box set remastering, but not a spectacular improvement - Kenny Burrell & John Coltrane: just a minor difference between the OJC20 and the K2, not worth upgrading. - Art Pepper & Eleven - Modern Jazz Classics: the K2 sound is more natural and coherent than the ZYX. But the SACD is again an improvement (warmer and better instrument separation) - Red Garland - Groovy: The ZYX sounds atrocious, no treble, as if the tapes (multi-generation copies?) were completely worn out. The K2 is 1000% better ... to be continued later ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Eric Dolphy - Far Cry & Five Spot Vol.1: more dynamic, fuller and tighter than the box set remastering, but not a spectacular improvement. I guess I'd have to disagree with this assessment, in part. To my ears, the VICJ of Live at the Five Spot, Volume One is an enormous improvement over the regular OJC. I would agree, however, that the K-2 of Far Cry is less of an "improvement," though still worth upgrading for, in my opinion. What really needs to happen (but won't) is this: Fantasy gets Kirk Felton to remaster two Dolphy box sets in hybrid SACD: The Complete 1961 Five Spot Recordings of Eric Dolpy and Booker Little and The Complete 1961 Copenhagen Recordings of Eric Dolphy ... in recording order, complete with stage announcements and any possible extra tracks. I started buying up the VICJ series in 1999 like a wild jackass. For the most part, they are all uniformly excellent, and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend any of them, except for the prohibitive price. Here are some of the VICJ's that stand out in my mind as vast sonic improvements: • Sonny Rollins: Way Out West • Chet Baker: Chet • Miles Davis Quintet: Workin' • Miles Davis Quintet: Cookin' • Eric Dolphy: Live at the Five Spot, Volume One • Thelonious Monk: with Sonny Rollins • Stan Getz: Quartet • Clifford Jordan: Bearcat ... along with many more. I can only think of two that I was slightly disappointed with. They are: • John Coltrane: Traneing In There is some strange distortion, at least on the disc I have, on some of Coltrane's longer tones on the latter half of the disc that I don't remember on the OJC. • Sonny Rollins Plus Four Nothing wrong with this one really, it just seemed a lot like the OJC, with less of the presence one comes to expect with the VICJ's. I really wish the Japanese VICJ "Heritage of Jazz" series would continue. There's still so many musical gems from the collective Fantasy vault out there that could benefit from Tamaki Beck's or Shigeo Miyamoto's loving care. Say, the Mingus Bohemia sides, all the Lacy's, Ornette's first Contemporary side, more Johnny Griffin, etc., etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesnik Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 I'm considering replacing some of my ZYX and regular OJCs with K2 remasters in the near future and am trying to decide which route to go: Japanese or US domestic. Are the domestic Fantasy K2s sonically equivalent to the VICJs? And in which cases do you consider the improvement over the ZYX 20 bit remasters or even the older OJCs to be barely noticeable? I'm particularly considering the Miles, Bill Evans, Monk, Sonny Rollins, Coltrane and McLean material. I'd appreciate your opinion and help with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 All the Bill Evans material that they've put out in the last couple of years is fantastic sounding as is the Monk material. I try to pick up all these K-2s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Pusey Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Are these Japanese issues jewel cases or mini sleeve? and where can I get a list of available issues? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 (edited) Are these Japanese issues jewel cases or mini sleeve, and where can I get a list of available issues? Heritage of Jazz Series These CDs were issued in several batches throughout 1999-2000. Original issues were in cardboard sleeves with liner notes and original cover art. VICJ- 60261: Sonny Rollins, Saxophone Colossus 60262: Sonny Rollins/John Coltrane, Tenor Madness 60263: Miles Davis, Bags' Groove 60264: Miles Davis, Walkin' with the Miles Davis Quintet 60265: Miles Davis, Cookin' with the Miles Davis Quintet 60266: Miles Davis, Relaxin' with the Miles Davis Quintet 60267: Miles Davis, Workin' with the Miles Davis Quintet 60268: Miles Davis, Steamin' with the Miles Davis Quintet 60269: John Coltrane, Soultrane 60270: John Coltrane, Coltrane 60271: John Coltrane, Stardust 60272: Modern Jazz Quartet, Django 60273: Modern Jazz Quartet, Concorde 60274: Eric Dolphy Live at the Five Spot, Volume 1 +1 60275: Kenny Dorham, Quiet Kenny 60276: Jackie McLean, 4, 5, and 6 60277: Stan Getz Quartet +4 60278: Red Garland, Groovy 60279: Ray Bryant Trio 60280: Thelonious Monk Trio 60281: Miles Davis and The Modern Jazz Giants 60282: Sonny Rollins with the MJQ 60283: Sonny Rollins, Worktime 60284: Kenny Burrell and John Coltrane 60285: Eric Dolphy Live at the Five Spot, Volume 2 60286: Sonny Criss, Up, Up, and Away 60287: George Wallington, Live at The Cafe Bohemia 60288: Mal Waldron, Mal-1 60289: Roy Haynes, We Three 60290: The Tommy Flanagan Trio 60291: Bill Evans, Portrait In Jazz +1 60292: Bill Evans, Waltz For Debby +4 60293: Bill Evans, Sunday At The Village Vanguard +5 60294: Bill Evans, Explorations +2 60295: Thelonious Monk, Thelonious Himself +1 60296: Thelonious Monk, Brilliant Corners 60297: Wes Montgomery, Incredible Jazz Guitar 60298: Wes Montgomery, Full House +3 60299: Wynton Kelly, Kelly Blue +2 60300: Kenny Drew Trio 60301: Miles Davis, Dig +2 60302: Miles Davis, Miles: The New Miles Davis Quintet 60303: John Coltrane, Lush Life 60304: George Wallington, Jazz For The Carriage Trade 60305: Red Garland, Soul Junction 60306: Bill Evans/Jim Hall, Interplay +1 60307: Bill Evans, Moonbeams 60308: Bill Evans, How My Heart Sings +1 60309: Thelonious Monk, Monk's Music +1 60310: Don Friedman, Circle Waltz 60311: Art Pepper Meets the Rhythm Section +1 60312: Sonny Rollins, Way Out West +3 60313: Hampton Hawes, The Trio Vol 1 60314: Shelley Manne, My Fair Lady 60315: Phineas Newborn, Jr., Harlem Blues 60316: Joe Pass, Virtuoso 60317: Sarah Vaughan, Autumn Leaves 60318: Sarah Vaughan, How Long Has This Been Going On? 60319: Ella Fitzgerald/Joe Pass, Take Love Easy 60320: Art Tatum/Ben Webster Quartet +3 60321: Sonny Rollins +4 60322: Thelonious Monk and Sonny Rollins 60323: Stitt, Powell, and J.J. +3 60324: Art Farmer/Gigi Gryce, When Farmer Met Gryce 60325: Modern Jazz Quartet and Milt Jackson Quintet 60326: Lee Konitz, Subconscious-Lee 60327: Tommy Flanagan/John Coltrane, The Cats 60328: Booker Ervin, The Song Book 60329: Milt Jackson Quartet 60330: Cannonball Adderley/Bill Evans, Know What I Mean? +2 60331: Bill Evans, Everybody Digs Bill Evans +1 60332: Cannonball Adderley, Cannonball in San Francisco +1 60333: Nat Adderley, Work Song 60334: Thelonious Monk with John Coltrane 60335: Bobby Timmons, This Here 60336: Johnny Griffin, The Little Giant 60337: Wes Montgomery, Boss Guitar +2 60338: Wynton Kelly Piano +1 (Whisper Not) 60339: Red Garland, Nearness of You 60340: Chet Baker/Bill Evans, Chet +1 60341: Miles Davis, The Musings of Miles 60342: Miles Davis, Collectors' Items 60343: Miles Davis, and Milt Jackson 60344: Clifford Brown, Memorial Album 60345: Kenny Burrell, Bluesy Burrell 60346: Red Garland's Piano 60347: Red Garland, A Garland of Red 60348: Blue Mitchell, Blue's Moods 60349: Bill Evans, Green Dolphin Street 60350: Bill Evans, New Jazz Conceptions +1 60351: Thelonious Monk, The Unique Thelonious Monk 60352: Thelonious Monk, Alone in San Francisco +1 60353: Thelonious Monk, Misterioso +2 60354: Abbey Lincoln, That's Him +2 60355: Benny Carter, Swingin' the 20's +3 60356: The Poll Winners 60357: Barney Kessel, Easy Like +2 60358: Art Tatum Trio with Red Callender 60359: The Quintet, Jazz at Massey Hall 60360: Dave Brubeck with Paul Desmond +8 60421: Miles Davis, Miles Davis and Horns +1 60422: Sonny Rollins, Rollins Plays For Bird +1 60423: John Coltrane, Traneing In 60424: John Coltrane, Settin’ the Pace 60425: John Coltrane/Tadd Dameron, Mating Call 60426: Wardell Grey Memorial Vol. 1 60427: Wardell Grey Memorial Vol. 2 60428: Gene Ammons, Boss Tenor 60429: Eric Dolphy, Outward Bound +3 60430: Eric Dolphy, Far Cry +1 60431: Jackie McLean, A Long Drink of the Blues 60432: Phil Woods, Woodlore 60433: Sonny Criss, This is Criss 60434: George Wallington, The New York Scene 60435: Gill Evans Ten 60436: Prestige All-Stars, All Night Long +2 60437: Jimmy Raney 60438: Pat Martino, El Hombre 60439: Red Garland, All Kinds of Weather 60440: Barbara Lea 60441: Miles Davis, Blue Haze 60442: Sonny Rollins, Moving Out 60443: John Coltrane, Black Pearls 60444: John Coltrane, Standard Coltrane 60445: Dexter Gordon, The Tower of Power 60446: Benny Golson, Groovin' with Golson 60447: Gene Ammons, Bad! Bossa Nova 60448: Jimmy Forrest, Out of the Forrest 60449: Eric Dolphy, Out There 60450: Latin Jazz Quintet/Eric Dolphy, Caribe 60451: Jackie McLean, McLean's Scene 60452: Eric Kloss, In the Land of the Giants 60453: Jerome Richardson, Roamin’ 60454: Art Farmer, Early Art 60455: Lem Winchester/Benny Golson, Winchester Special 60456: The Return of Tal Farrow 60457: Pat Martino, East 60458: Red Garland, It's a Blue World 60459: Barry Harris, Magnificent 60460: The Jaki Byard Experience 60461: Lee Konitz/Miles Davis, Ezz-Thetic 60462: The John Eardley Seven 60463: Thelonious Monk Quintet 60464: Eric Dolphy Memorial Album 60465: Mal Waldron/Eric Dolphy, The Quest 60466: Phil Woods/Red Garland, Sugan 60467: Sonny Criss, Portrait of Criss 60468: Jaki Byard, Hi-Fly 60469: Ron Haynes Trio, Just Us 60470: Cedar Walton, Spectrum 60471: Bill Evans, At Shelley's Manne-Hole 60472: Thelonious Monk Plays Duke Ellington 60473: Mulligan Meets Monk +3 60474: Sonny Rollins, The Sound Of Sonny +1 60475: The Wes Montgomery Trio 60476: Milt Jackson/Wes Montgomery, Bags Meets Wes +3 60477: Cannonball Adderley/Milt Jackson, Things are Getting Better +2 60478: Milt Jackson, Invitation 60479: Art Blakey, Ugetsu +3 60480: Johnny Griffin, The Kerry Dancers 60481: Chet Baker, It Could Happen to You +2 60482: Nat Adderley, Much Brass 60483: Charie Byrd, The Guitar Artistry of Charie Byrd 60484: Barry Harris, At the Jazz Workshop +3 60485: Kenny Drew Trio, Pal Joey 60486: Don Friedman, Flashback 60487: Junior Mance, Happy Time 60488: Bobby Timmons, Born to Be Blue 60489: George Russell, Ezz-thetic 60490: Abbey Lincoln, Abbey is Blue 60491: Thelonious Monk, Thelonious in Action +3 60492: Sonny Rollins, Freedom Suite 60493: Cannonball Adderley, Portrait of Cannonball +3 60494: Chet Baker in New York +1 60495: Nat Adderley, Naturally 60496: Blue Mitchell, Blue Soul 60497: Harold Land/Wes Montgomery, West Coast Blues 60498: Jimmy Heath, Triple Threat 60499: James Cray, Double Dose of Soul 60500: Don Wilkerson, The Texas Twister 60501: Julian Priester, Spiritsville 60502: Matthew G, Jazz By G 60503: JFK Quintet, New Jazz Frontiers From Washington 60504: Charlie Byrd, Bossa Nova Pelo Pasalo 60505: Red Garland, Bright and Breezy 60506: Bobby Timmons, Trio in Person +2 60507: Barry Harris, Promenade 60508: Junior Mance, At the Village Vanguard 60509: Billy Taylor with Four Flutes 60510: Joe Albany with Warne Marsh, The Right Combination 60511: Thelonious Monk, At Town Hall 60512: Cannonball Adderley Quintet, in New York 60513: Chet Baker, with Fifty Italian Strings 60514: Ben Webster/Joe Zawinul, Soul Mates 60515: Johnny Little, Nice and Easy 60516: Red Garland, Solar 60517: Junior Mance, Big Chief 60518: Joyce Collins, Girl Here Plays Mean Piano 60519: Dick Morgan, See What I Mean 60520: Evans Bradshaw, Pieces of 88 60670: Art Farmer Quintet Featuring Gigi Gryce 60671: Freddie Redd Trio/Hampton Hawes Quartet, Piano East/West 60672: Gene Ammons, Jug 60673: Roland Kirk, Kirk's Works 60674: Arnett Cobb, Sizzlin' 60675: Ronnie Matthews with Freddie Hubbard, Doin' the Thing 60676: Bobby Timmons, Chun-King 60677: Carmell Jones, Jay Hawk Talk 60678: Booker Ervin, Heavy!!! 60679: Pat Martino, Strings! 60680: Jaki Byard, Sunshine of My Soul 60681: Oliver Nelson, Meet Oliver Nelson 60682: Gigi Gryce, Quintet The Hap'nins 60683: Walt Dickerson, To My Queen 60684: Coleman Hawkins with the Red Garland Trio 60685: Various Artists, Swing Journal Readers Request Prestige’s Best 60686: Cannonball Adderley and His Orchestra, African Waltz 60687: Lee Morgan Quintet, Take Twelve 60688: Milt Jackson Orchestra, Big Bags 60689: Kenny Drew, A Harry Warren Showcase 60690: The Soulful Piano of Junior Mance 60691: Barry Harris, Newer Than New 60692: Sonny Red with Blue Mitchell and Grant Green, Images 60693: Blue Mitchell, A Sure Thing 60694: Sam Jones Trio + 10, The Chant 60695: Charlie Byrd at the Village Vanguard 60696: The Mundell Lowe Quartet 60697: Johnny Griffin, Do Nothing 'Til You Hear from Me 60698: Jean Thielemans, Man Bites Harmonica! 60699: Clifford Jordan Quartet, Bearcat 60700: Tadd Dameron and His Orchestra, The Magic Touch 60701: Various Artists, Swing Journal Readers Request Riverside’s Best One thing to bear in mind is that part of this series is now being re-reissued in Japan, in jewel cases, with new catalog numbers (4000 etc.), and the price for a single disc is 1500¥, as opposed to the previous 2520¥. Somebody here can probably come up with that list. Edited November 5, 2004 by Late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeith Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 So Late, Does that mean that you can't get the mini-lp covers anymore on the VICJs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 (edited) So Late, Does that mean that you can't get the mini-lp covers anymore on the VICJs? VICJ's are actually still available in mini-LP format. It's just that they're now technically "out-of-print." I'd e-mail Hiroshi Tanno with a list of what you're most interested in — he might be able to help you out. In fact, he has some listed right now on his CD Stock list. A fair price for a new VICJ 6000 series, I'd say, is generally between $20-$25. Occasionally, you can find them for less, and I certainly wouldn't pay more than $25, unless you absolutely have to have it (which has happened to me before). When they initially came out in Japan, I'm pretty sure they were 2520¥. Edited January 27, 2005 by Late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeith Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 thanks, Late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Pusey Posted November 6, 2004 Report Share Posted November 6, 2004 Bloody hell Late , theregoes my budget for the next couple of years....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 6, 2004 Report Share Posted November 6, 2004 ... theregoes my budget for the next couple of years ... Heh heh heh. There should be an Organissimo credit card. Introductory 0% APR, with bonus points redeemable for music and "O" merchandise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swinger Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 I got my first K2 cds yesterday.Here are my quick opinions on them. The Incredible Jazz Guitar Of Wes Montgomery: No significant improvement compared to its 20-bit edition. Full House: Very balanced and clear sound.Much better than its normal cd edition (1987). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesnik Posted November 14, 2004 Report Share Posted November 14, 2004 (edited) I think my next VICJs will be some new titles I still don't have. I'm not much of an upgrader and am normally happy with what I have. Even some early 90s CDs. I only pick up reissues of records I already have in very special cases, or when I can get them cheap. But I never really warmed to the ZYX OJCs, soundwise and packagewise. How can somebody produce such an unappealing object with such great source material? So I will slowly replace them over time. With VICJs or US K2, wherever these are cheaper. From what I have I'd say the Bill Evans are the prime candidates. The other day I was listening to New Jazz Conceptions in its 20bit edition and thereafter to Kenny Drew Trio, a great, great piano trio session IMO, as an earlier '92 Fantasy remaster. And it sounded much better. The rest will or will not follow, but only at lower priority, compared to getting new material. Oh, and I forgot, there is a bunch of VICJs reissued in 09/04 which are supposed to be a budget edition at 1500¥. But I don't know the full list. Maybe it's on the Losin site. I know the most popular titles are in there. Edited November 14, 2004 by Bluesnik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzhound Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 the K2s I have just sound like overly compressed stuff that sound louder than regular cds. save your money and get a better stereo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmorin Posted January 12, 2005 Report Share Posted January 12, 2005 According to the indispensible Jazzmatazz site the following CDs will come out as K2's in April: NEW Art Pepper - Winter Moon (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Miles Davis - Dig (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Coleman Hawkins - Soul (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW John Coltrane - Standard Coltrane (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Yusef Lateef - Eastern Sounds (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Kenny Drew - Kenny Drew Trio (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Thelonious Monk - Thelonious Alone in San Francisco (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Cannonball Adderley Sextet - In New York (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Bill Evans Trio - At Shelly's Manne-Hole (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered NEW Abbey Lincoln - Abbey Is Blue (Fantasy) Apr — 20-bit K2 remastered Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son-of-a-Weizen Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 (edited) Tower online also still carries some, and Red Trumpet does as well. A fair price for a new VICJ 6000 series, I'd say, is generally between $20-$25. Occasionally, you can find them for less, and I certainly wouldn't pay more than $25, unless you absolutely have to have it (which has happened to me before). When they initially came out in Japan, I'm pretty sure they were 2520¥. .......In fact, here's Red Trumpet's VICJ list. http://www.redtrumpet.com/search/qsresults...sid=1035534217 Yeah, not a bad Red Trumpet price for some of those VICJs (the JFK sounds great) but have you perused the JRVGs lately, Late? $50 for Jutta, La Rocca, & Chambers!!! http://www.redtrumpet.com/search/qsresults...&sid=1035534217 Edited January 14, 2005 by Son-of-a-Weizen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etherbored Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 beware y'all! there's a nice series of japanese jewelcased K2 remastes being sold for 1500 yen ($14.00)... regards, -e- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 The new April list looks quite nice. On my list will be the Pepper, Adderley, Monk and Lateef. The rest I already own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzkrow Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Does anyone have a list of the K2 for sale by BMG or Yourmusic.com? Or should I just look for OJC listed as "Remastered?" THANKS!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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