Moral Mandate?

[Niko]

By the way, that Bolero is such an intimidating piece of music isn't it? It's a travesty they play this for children in schools. There should be a law to prevent children from being exposed to such mayhem. My panties get all knotted up just thinking about it.

some time ago i watched a tv documentary about neonazis in eastern germany... the image that stuck with me was some fat hairless 21 year old drinking canned beer in his bed while listening to ravel's bolero and telling the interviewer something like "i don't know what the future will be but it will sure be national" (don't know the exact statement but he did use "national" in that way...)

So what?

heh, you are trying to spot me making off topic posts... admittedly, this time you are closer than last time... listening to the bolero in school for like three hours was one of the dullest experiences of my school days, that tv documentary helped me quite a bit getting over this, (i might say "putting the bolero where it belongs", dull people)... besides that: so what!

Edited January 3, 2008 by Niko

[7/4]

[B. Clugston]

Hollander and his ilk want classical music to be embalmed music--dead, predictable and it ain't gonna bite no one.

[Peter Friedman]

i'm with --> T.D. there are plenty of complex modern works that aren't serial or not obviously so, likewise a decent body of verrrrrrrrrrry broadly "minimalist" work too. OF COURSE we can pick & choose among the shit, the canola oil but Peter--

what specific works were you digging, & which did you feel battered by? is the modern day composer really dead?! (classical division.) would you have celebrated if they included-- which i bet they did NOT-- an Ives, Reger, Elgar or Silvestrov works instead?

Also -->

Messiaen influenced... or vice-versa?!

Kind Regards,

Elder Don Clementine

EDC,

I did NOT "feel battered" by any of the music. Those are your words, not mine. The pieces that, by and large, I did not care much for were newly commissioned pieces by a number of living composers. I don't recall their names as their music was, with rare exception, not anything I cared to hear again.

I enjoy Elgar, Reger and Ives.

The major point for me is that there is a huge amount of music out there. There is only so much time available and each person has to decide what music he or she finds most satisfying. There are times in ones life when it is especially beneficial

to be exposed to a wide variety of music as part of the process of developing individual taste. Over time, I have personally decided what classical music I prefer, and would rather spend my limited classical music listening time in that arena.

Others are naturally free to go in a different direction.

The point (for me) of the quote that started this thread, is that I don't care for the sense that I should be pushed to listen to music that is not to my taste because it will be "educational", or "good for me". At the chamber music concerts that I attend,

the clear majority of the music is very much to my taste. I was just expressing some displeasure at the way the program is "rigged" to satisfy what I believe fits the "moral mandate" concept.

[T.D.]

Peter, I see your point, and certainly a lot of concert-goers share your POV (eg NY Philharmonic subscribers, who are famously "conservative"). But how do you know that the modern pieces are presented as part of some "moral mandate" (by which I assume you mean that "concert-goers should be exposed to modern music")? Maybe the featured ensemble(s) (shudder) actually like playing the pieces, and want to share their enjoyment?

As far as ordering the pieces on the program, you're correct in that the modern works are usually sandwiched so as to dissuade late arrivals/early departures. But I'm not sure we can conclude that they are regarded as some kind of musical equivalent of castor oil. Even in an all-warhorse program, the "big" attraction would be reserved for last, and the relatively obscure piece placed in the middle. Perhaps your "rigged" comment shows a certain preconception.

[Larry Kart]

This whole business is so charged-up, gummed-up, you name it, with familiar or unexamined personal experiences and predelictions (and I include my own here) and also from the rhetorical interventions of professional provokers like Bernard Holland and (probably more dangerous) shadow boxers like Alex Ross, that I'd like to ask Peter a specific question and then offer some testimony.

The question is, Can you give us a list of the works that were on some or all of those "Moral Mandate" programs chamber music concerts? I ask for two reasons, and feeling fairly sure that some "This is good for you," Moral Mandate-thinking was going on behind the scenes there: (1) I want to know the kind and range of music on those programs that you did like (and of course I'll be reacting to this part of your answer based on my own musical experiences and prejudices, but I won't do that covertly), and (2) I want to know what were the modern pieces on those programs that you didn't like. Then, putting (1 and (2) together, and provided I myself know any of those modern pieces you didn't like, I can begin to figure out where you and I stand here -- and by "you" I don't necessarily mean (or only mean) you as an individual but you as a representative genuine music lover of one sort, in relation to myself as one of those of probably another sort, and then both of us (as types and individuals) in relation to what all has been and is going in the worlds of music-making of our time.

My testimony is that I've been listening to a whole lot of so-called modern music (for me "modern" begins or began with the Second Viennese School and Stravinsky) with curiosity and pleasure since my early teens, and a big part of that pleasure is bound up with the curiosity factor. That is, once I picked up the scent of what seemed to be to be going here -- and "here" is much broader than the bit I've already mentioned, and by no means (I hope) am I an uncritical consumer of all that has happened here, or by now "there" -- I was fascinated both the the sheer musical quality of what seemed to me to be top notch, but also by the newness of what in all this actually was new, by the opportunities it seemed I was being given to encounter new forms of language in the process of their formation. I'm wired, or came to be wired, such that I found that very exciting almost in itself. I guess I'd either built the "Moral Mandate" into myself or turned it into a Pleasure Principle. And in an attempt to keep that particular sort of pleasure going for me, I'll often take a flier when I see one. For instance, a year or so ago, I noticed that Berkshire was selling almost all the CRI catalog (CRI being the subsidized modern American classical music label) for IIRC $3.99 a disc. I already had a lot of CRI things, but a lot I didn't know, so I sifted through as much as I could, listening to sound samples when possible, and ordered and then listened to a whole lot of stuff by my standards -- maybe 30 or 40 discs in all. And while maybe five of those were duds, the process of discovering what, say, Louis Karchin, or Allan Anderson, or Ruth Loman, or Ursula Marmalok etc., etc. were specifically up to (and just about every one of these composers was specifically up to something) was an enlightening and mostly delightful experience for me. Was it different from the experience I would have had if I had spent that much time relistening to marvelous works from the past that already were familiar to me? Sure. Does that mean I would have been better off either way? Can't be sure -- and of course, I listen to what I think are marvelous works from the past that already are familiar to me whenever I feel like it. But what I'm trying to put some flesh on here are the ways and the reasons that some people are pretty naturally drawn after the new in music, or at least the unfamiliar -- and this in name of what for them seems to be pleasure.

[Larry Kart]

BTW, the process of deciding on your own what is wheat and what is chaff in a big bundle of new music is kind of educational -- at the very least, you learn something about yourself. Also, a lot of those CRI recordings I got are still at Berkshire. If anyone wants, I'll post a list of the ones I l liked (with occasional remarks/warnings).

[Larry Kart]

Oops -- that's Ursula Mamlok (not Marmalok) and Allen (not Allan) Anderson.

[7/4]

I'm curious! I'll start a CRI thread, there was a lot of good material on that label.

Years ago, the Princeton Record Exchange had a ton of CRI vinyl for real cheap. E4th & Broadway Tower NYC used to go down and buy 'em to sell at their own store.

Someday, when I get a new turntable, I'll be able to check out my CRI vinyl again!

[T.D.]

I've explored a lot of modern music (some CRIs, but often Euro labels like Kairos) via Berkshire Record Outlet offerings. Used to check their inventory carefully, but have been more focused on jazz the past two or three years.

[Chuck Nessa]

Heartwarming to see all these folks picking over the remaindered music.

[Larry Kart]

Heartwarming to see all these folks picking over the remaindered music.

I said that "I already had a lot of CRI things..." -- bought over the years at regular prices. I should then buy none when they're remaindered at Berkshire?

[Peter Friedman]

This whole business is so charged-up, gummed-up, you name it, with familiar or unexamined personal experiences and predelictions (and I include my own here) and also from the rhetorical interventions of professional provokers like Bernard Holland and (probably more dangerous) shadow boxers like Alex Ross, that I'd like to ask Peter a specific question and then offer some testimony.

The question is, Can you give us a list of the works that were on some or all of those "Moral Mandate" programs chamber music concerts? I ask for two reasons, and feeling fairly sure that some "This is good for you," Moral Mandate-thinking was going on behind the scenes there: (1) I want to know the kind and range of music on those programs that you did like (and of course I'll be reacting to this part of your answer based on my own musical experiences and prejudices, but I won't do that covertly), and (2) I want to know what were the modern pieces on those programs that you didn't like. Then, putting (1 and (2) together, and provided I myself know any of those modern pieces you didn't like, I can begin to figure out where you and I stand here -- and by "you" I don't necessarily mean (or only mean) you as an individual but you as a representative genuine music lover of one sort, in relation to myself as one of those of probably another sort, and then both of us (as types and individuals) in relation to what all has been and is going in the worlds of music-making of our time.

My testimony is that I've been listening to a whole lot of so-called modern music (for me "modern" begins or began with the Second Viennese School and Stravinsky) with curiosity and pleasure since my early teens, and a big part of that pleasure is bound up with the curiosity factor. That is, once I picked up the scent of what seemed to be to be going here -- and "here" is much broader than the bit I've already mentioned, and by no means (I hope) am I an uncritical consumer of all that has happened here, or by now "there" -- I was fascinated both the the sheer musical quality of what seemed to me to be top notch, but also by the newness of what in all this actually was new, by the opportunities it seemed I was being given to encounter new forms of language in the process of their formation. I'm wired, or came to be wired, such that I found that very exciting almost in itself. I guess I'd either built the "Moral Mandate" into myself or turned it into a Pleasure Principle. And in an attempt to keep that particular sort of pleasure going for me, I'll often take a flier when I see one. For instance, a year or so ago, I noticed that Berkshire was selling almost all the CRI catalog (CRI being the subsidized modern American classical music label) for IIRC $3.99 a disc. I already had a lot of CRI things, but a lot I didn't know, so I sifted through as much as I could, listening to sound samples when possible, and ordered and then listened to a whole lot of stuff by my standards -- maybe 30 or 40 discs in all. And while maybe five of those were duds, the process of discovering what, say, Louis Karchin, or Allan Anderson, or Ruth Loman, or Ursula Marmalok etc., etc. were specifically up to (and just about every one of these composers was specifically up to something) was an enlightening and mostly delightful experience for me. Was it different from the experience I would have had if I had spent that much time relistening to marvelous works from the past that already were familiar to me? Sure. Does that mean I would have been better off either way? Can't be sure -- and of course, I listen to what I think are marvelous works from the past that already are familiar to me whenever I feel like it. But what I'm trying to put some flesh on here are the ways and the reasons that some people are pretty naturally drawn after the new in music, or at least the unfamiliar -- and this in name of what for them seems to be pleasure.

Larry,

I have been regularly attending the particular chamber music series I was referring to for the past 6 years or so. I don't keep the programs so can't tell you the titles or composers of the music not to my taste. As to the chamber music I do like, it probably won't surprise you to know that it includes string quartets and/or other chamber and orchestral works by Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Dvorak, Tchaikovsky, Schumann, Saint- Saens, Bruch, Faure, Smetana, Hummel,Chopin, Greig, Rachmaninoff, Franck, Sibelius, and MANY others.

The "branching out" I have done over a number of years is to "discover" chamber works (and orchestral works as well) by composers who are not generally well known, yet composed in styles that fit within the type of classical music I most enjoy.

Here are some of those composers - Berwald, Chadwick, Gade, David, D'Indy, Chausson, Field, Godard, Heise, Holter, Kiel,

Kuhlau, Lekeu, Onslow, Parry, Rheinberger, Rubinstein, Scharwenka, Spohr, Stanford,Stenhammar, Svendsen, Volkman,

Grechaninov. These are just examples, and I have CDs by each of them and many others I didn't include on the list.

[Chuck Nessa]

At best Peter seems to be growing sideways.

[Chuck Nessa]

Heartwarming to see all these folks picking over the remaindered music.

I said that "I already had a lot of CRI things..." -- bought over the years at regular prices. I should then buy none when they're remaindered at Berkshire?

I'm an experienced "bottom feeder" too.

[T.D.]

I used to buy bunches of weird "shot-in-the-dark" CDs by modern composers I'd never heard of. Some were hits (in which case I'd get more discs through "normal" channels), some were misses. Would never have taken that many chances with full-priced recordings.

[Larry Kart]

Here's my Berkshire modern American classical music CRI list, with some from New World too. Hard to believe that I found the time to listen to all this stuff, but I did:

Spies, Claudio {b.1925}: 3 Songs on Poems by May Swenson; Animula Vagula, Blandula; 5 Sonnet-Settings {Christine Whittlesey, soprano et al.}; Impromptu for Piano; 'Viopiacem' Duo for Viola & Keyboard Instruments {Samuel Rhodes & Robert Miller}; 4 Dadivas; Bagatelle {Alan Feinberg, piano}; Beisammen {Matthew Sullivan & Brian Greene, oboes & English horns}; Insieme {Elizabeth McNutt, flute & Andrew May, violin}; Dylan Thomas' Lament and a Complementary Envoi. (Nathaniel Watson, baritone & Margaret Kampmeier, piano. Total time: 76'08')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 718 | BRO Code: 116940 | Label: CRI

(An austere serialist but a real musician. Not unlike late Stravinsky in some respects -- Spies and Igor were friends.)

Lomon, Ruth: Songs of Remembrance. (Jayne West, soprano. Pamela Dellal, mezzo. Frank Kelley, tenor. Donald Boothman, baritone. Laura Ahlbeck, oboe & English horn. Donald Berman, piano. Total time: 61'31')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 887 | BRO Code: 116874 | Label: CRI

Cory, Eleanor {b.1943}: 'Visions' for 6 Players {St. Luke's Chamber Ensemble}; 'Of Mere Being' for Chorus & Brass Quintet {William Purvis [French horn] et al. w.NY Virtuoso Singers/ Rosenbaum}; 'Play Within a Play' for Piano; 'Interviews' for Viola & Piano {Louise Schulman & Margaret Kampmeier}; 'Bouquet' for 8 Players. (NY New Music Ensemble/ Milarsky. Total time: 65'54')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 885 | BRO Code: 116870 | Label: CRI

Cooper, Paul {1926-1996}- 'Complete Music for Solo Piano': Cycles; 4 Intermezzi; Sonata; Frescoes; Sinfonia. (John Hendrickson)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 776 | BRO Code: 116770 | Label: CRI

Cooper, Paul {b.1926}: Verses for Violin & Viola; Canons d'Amour; String Quartets 5 & 6. (Shepherd Quartet)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 687 | BRO Code: 116690 | Label: CRI

Jones, Samuel {b.1935}: Let Us Now Praise Famous Men; Elegy. Paul Cooper {b.1926}, Symphony #4 {all w.Houston Symph./ Samuel Jones}; Violin Concerto #2. (Ronald Patterson w.Monte Carlo Phil./ Lawrence Foster. Total time: 69'44')

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 579 | BRO Code: 116288 | Label: CRI

Genre: Symphonies

(Jones's symphony is crap; Cooper's Violin Concerto is an ecstatic gem.)

Macbride, David: 3 Dances for String Quartet {Aurora Quartet}; 'Chartres' for Solo Piano. (Kathleen Supove. Total time: 60'57')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 640 | BRO Code: 116451 | Label: CRI

Ogdon, Will {b.1921}: 3 Piano Pieces; 3 Baritone Songs; 2 Kechwa Songs; 3 Trifles for Cello & Piano; By the Isar; 6 Small Trios; 5 Preludes; Serenade #1 for Wind Quintet; 2 Capriccios for Piano; Variation Suite for Violin & Viola; 6 Small Trios. (Members of SONOR Ensemble with guest artists. Total time: 71'30')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 763 | BRO Code: 116769 | Label: CRI

(Ogdon is a good bit like Spies.)

Boykan, Martin: String Quartet #2 {Pro Arte Quartet}; City of Gold {Fenwick Smith, flute}; Piano Trio #2 {Cyrus Stevens [violin], Michael Curry [cello] & Donald Berman [piano]}; Echoes of Petrarch. (Auros Group for New Music)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 841 | BRO Code: 116592 | Label: CRI

Boykan, Martin: String Quartet #4 {Lydian Quartet}; Elegy {Jane Bryden, soprano w.The Brandeis Contemporary Chamber Players/ Hoose}; Epithalamion. (James Maddalena, baritone. Nancy Cirillo, violin. Virginia Crumb, harp. Total time: 62'22')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 786 | BRO Code: 116512 | Label: CRI

Boykan, Martin {b.1931}: Sonata for Violin & Piano {w.Cyrus Stevens, violin}; 'A Packet for Susan' for Voice & Piano {w.Pamela Dellal, mezzo}; 'Flume' for Clarinet & Piano {w.Ian Greitser, clarinet} {all w.Donald Berman, piano}; String Quartet #1. (The Contemporary Quartet. Total time: 68'06')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 897 | BRO Code: 116456 | Label: CRI

(Boykan is not unlike Andew Imbrie, if that helps. Muscular/gestural, often soulful -- sounds like he might have been a Sessions student, as Imbrie was, but I don't think so. Boykan's Echoes of Petrach is close to the level of Pierrot Lunaire.)

Babbitt, Allegro Penseroso. Michael Finnissy, North American Spirituals. Jason Eckardt, Echoes' White Veil. Jeff Nichols, Chelsea Square. (Marilyn Nonken, piano)

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 877 | BRO Code: 116573 | Label: CRI

(Nonken can play her ass off! I know enough of Babbitt and Finnissy to be sure of that -- the Finnissy was written for her. Would like to hear more from the other two composers.)

Anderson, Allen {b.1951}: String Quartet {Lydian Quartet}; Solfeggietti; Drawn from Life. (Aleck Karis, piano)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 727 | BRO Code: 116540 | Label: CRI

Del Tredici {b.1937}: I Hear an Army {Phyllis Bryn-Julson, soprano w.Composers Quartet}; Night Conjure-Verse {Benita Valente, soprano & Mary Burgess, mezzo w.Marlboro Festival Players/ composer}; Syzygy {Bryn-Julson w.Festival Chamber Orch./ Dufallo}; Scherzo for Piano 4-Hands. (Robert Helps & composer. Total time: 61'04')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 689 | BRO Code: 116438 | Label: CRI

Del Tredici, Song Cycles: Miz Inez Sez {w.Hila Plitmann, soprano}; 3 Baritone Songs {w.Chris Pedro Trakas, baritone}; Brother {w.John Kelly, vocalist}. (All w.composer, piano. Total time: 74'40')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 878 | BRO Code: 116189 | Label: CRI

(Early Del Tredici, first disc, late on the second. He's supposed to be the Return To Romanticism guy (e.g. "Final Alice"), but he's just amazingly nuts -- and covered all over with musicality.)

Wyner, Yehudi {b.1929}: Memorial Music I & II for Soprano & 3 Flutes; 'Intermedio'- Lyric Ballet for Soprano & Strings {all w.Susan Davenny Wyner, soprano}; Serenade for 7 Instruments {Boston Symphony Chamber Players/ composer}; Concert Duo for Violin & Piano {Matthew Raimondi & composer}; 3 Short Fantasies {Robert Miller, piano}; Passage I. (Musical Elements Ensemble/ Daniel Asia. Total time: 74'24')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: BULGARIA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 701 | BRO Code: 116399 | Label: CRI

Fine, Vivian {b.1913}: Concertante for Piano & Orch. {Reiko Honsho w.Japan Phil./ Watanabe}; Missa Brevis for 4 Celli and Taped Voice {w.Jan DeGaetani, mezzo}; Momenti for Piano Solo {Lionel Nowak}; Quartet for Brass {David Jolley, horn et al.}; Sinfonia & Fugato for Solo Piano {Robert Helps}; Alcestis. (Imperial Philharmonic of Tokyo/ Strickland. Total time: 75'15')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 692 | BRO Code: 116398 | Label: CRI

(A strong Session student.)

Fine, Vivian {b.1913}: Concertante for Piano & Orch. {Reiko Honsho w.Japan Phil./ Watanabe}; Missa Brevis for 4 Celli and Taped Voice {w.Jan DeGaetani, mezzo}; Momenti for Piano Solo {Lionel Nowak}; Quartet for Brass {David Jolley, horn et al.}; Sinfonia & Fugato for Solo Piano {Robert Helps}; Alcestis. (Imperial Philharmonic of Tokyo/ Strickland. Total time: 75'15')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 692 | BRO Code: 116398 | Label: CRI

Genre: Piano Concerti

Mamlok, Ursula {b.1928}: 'Panta Rhei' for Violin, Cello & Piano {B.Hudson, C.Finkel & A.Karis}; Variations for Solo Flute {S.Baron}; When Summer Sang {Da Capo Chamber Players}; Stray Birds {P.Bryn-Julson, soprano w.H.Sollberger, flute & F.Sherry, cello}; Sextet. (Parnassus Ensemble/ Korf)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 891 | BRO Code: 116364 | Label: CRI

Mamlok, Ursula: String Quartet #2 {Cassatt Quartet}; 'Girasol' for Flute, Clarinet, Violin, Viola, Cello & Piano; 'Polarities' for Flute, Violin, Cello & Piano {Parnassus Ensemble/ Korf}; 'Der Andreas Garten' for Soprano, Flute & Harp {Jubal Trio}; 'Constellations' for Orchestra. (Seattle Symph./ Schwarz)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 806 | BRO Code: 116334 | Label: CRI

Mamlok, Ursula: String Quartet #2 {Cassatt Quartet}; 'Girasol' for Flute, Clarinet, Violin, Viola, Cello & Piano; 'Polarities' for Flute, Violin, Cello & Piano {Parnassus Ensemble/ Korf}; 'Der Andreas Garten' for Soprano, Flute & Harp {Jubal Trio}; 'Constellations' for Orchestra. (Seattle Symph./ Schwarz)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 806 | BRO Code: 116334 | Label: CRI

(Another strong Sessions student -- he seemed to work well with woman. See also Miriam Gideon below.)

Gideon, Miriam: Suite for Clarinet & Piano {S.Berkowitz & E.Rodgers}; Eclogue for Flute & Piano {P.Spencer & D.Oei} + Asstd. Songs (Cassolas, Sharp et al.)

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: 80393-2 | BRO Code: 99452 | Label: NEW WORLD

Gideon, Miriam {1906-1996}- 'Music for Voice & Ensemble': Sonnets from Shakespeare {W.Sharp, baritone w.Prism Orch./ Black}; Rhymes from the Hill {J.De Gaetani, mezzo w.D.Gilbert cond.}; The Hound of Heaven {W.Metcalf, baritone w.Jahoda cond.}; Nocturnes {J.Raskin, soprano w.DeMain cond.}; Resounding Lyre; Wing'd Hour {w.C.Cassolas, tenor}; Spirit Above the Dust. (E.Bonazzi, mezzo w.Contemporary Chamber Ensemble/ Weisberg. Total time: 73'29')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 782 | BRO Code: 116251 | Label: CRI

Gideon, Miriam {1906-1996}- 'Music for Voice & Ensemble': Sonnets from Shakespeare {W.Sharp, baritone w.Prism Orch./ Black}; Rhymes from the Hill {J.De Gaetani, mezzo w.D.Gilbert cond.}; The Hound of Heaven {W.Metcalf, baritone w.Jahoda cond.}; Nocturnes {J.Raskin, soprano w.DeMain cond.}; Resounding Lyre; Wing'd Hour {w.C.Cassolas, tenor}; Spirit Above the Dust. (E.Bonazzi, mezzo w.Contemporary Chamber Ensemble/ Weisberg. Total time: 73'29')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 782 | BRO Code: 116251 | Label: CRI

Cone, Edward T. {b.1917}: Duo for Violin & Cello; 'New Weather'- 4 Songs for Soprano & Piano to Poems by Paul Muldoon; Serenade for Flute, Violin, Viola & Cello; 'Philomela'- 3 Nightingale Songs for Soprano, Flute, Viola & Piano. (Mimmi Fulmer {soprano}, Jayn Rosenfeld {flute}, Cyrus Stevens {violin}, Scott Rawls {viola} et al. Total time: 60'21')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 737 | BRO Code: 116389 | Label: CRI

(The great critic-musicologist was a tough-delicate, somewhat Stravinsky-ian composer, if Stravinsky had grown up on the coast of New England.)

Aitken, H. {b.1924}: Piano Fantasy {Gary Kirkpatrick, piano}; Cantatas #'s 1 {on Elizabethan themes}, 3 {'From this White Island' on poems by Willis Barnstone} {both w. Charles Bressler, tenor}, 4 {on poems by Antonio Machado. With Jean Hakes, soprano} & 6 {'Remembering' on poems by Rilke. With Jan Opalach, bass-baritone}. (w.chamber ensemble or piano accompanying. Total time: 74'22')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 774 | BRO Code: 116377 | Label: CRI

Boatwright, Howard {b.1918}: Sonata for Clarinet & Piano {Michael Webster & Barry Snyder}; 12 Pieces for Solo Violin {composer performing}; String Quartet #2. (Manhattan String Quartet. Total time: 63'27')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 775 | BRO Code: 116367 | Label: CRI

(Helen Boatwright's husband -- she of the great Ives songs recording. Not unlike Ed Cone in style, but somehow you can tell Boatwright is from the mid-South. Modern though it is, his violin writing has a mountain fiddle tune feel at times.)

Kohs, Ellis B. {b.1916}- Music for Keyboards and Strings: Passacaglia for Organ & Strings K.11 {Maija Lehtonen w.Grasbeck cond.}; Chamber Concerto for Viola & String Nonet K.28 {Ferenc Molnar w.Robert Mann, Robert Hillyer et al.}; Toccata K.25 {Lionel Salter, harpsichord}; String Quartet #2 {Gabor Rejto et al.}; Sonatina for Violin & Piano K.26. (Eudice Shapiro & Albert Dominguez. Total time: 71'40')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Mono | Code: CD 795 | BRO Code: 116254 | Label: CRI

Wyner, Yehudi {b.1929}: Memorial Music I & II for Soprano & 3 Flutes; 'Intermedio'- Lyric Ballet for Soprano & Strings {all w.Susan Davenny Wyner, soprano}; Serenade for 7 Instruments {Boston Symphony Chamber Players/ composer}; Concert Duo for Violin & Piano {Matthew Raimondi & composer}; 3 Short Fantasies {Robert Miller, piano}; Passage I. (Musical Elements Ensemble/ Daniel Asia. Total time: 74'24')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: BULGARIA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 701 | BRO Code: 116399 | Label: CRI

Martino, Donald {b.1931}: A Set for Marimba; 'Parisonatina Al'Dodecafonia' for Solo Cello; 12 Preludes for Piano Solo; 'Canzone e Tarantella sul nome Petrassi' for Clarinet & Cello; A Jazz Set. (The Core Ensemble)

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Martino {b.1931}, A Set for Clarinet {M.Webster}; Quodlibets for Flute {S.Baron}; Trio for Violin, Clarinet & Piano {P.Zukofsky, A.Bloom & G.Kalish}; Fantasy-Variations for Violin {P.Zukofsky}; Concerto for Wind Quintet {Contemporary Chamber Ensemble of Rutgers University/ Weisberg}; Strata for Bass Clarinet. (Dennis Smylie. Total time: 65'36')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 693 | BRO Code: 116284 | Label: CRI

Genre: Contemporary

Shapero, Piano Sonatas 1-3. Fine, Music for Piano. Ruggles, Evocations: 4 Chants for Piano. Menotti, Ricercare and Toccata on a Theme from 'The Old Maid and the Thief' (Michael Boriskin, piano)

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: 80402-2 | BRO Code: 26166 | Label: NEW WORLD

Imbrie, Chamber Music: Three Piece Suite for Harp & Piano; Five Roethke Songs {S.Narucki, soprano w.M.Goldray, piano}; Campion Songs {w.J.Peterson, soprano}; To a Traveler; Dream Sequence for Chamber Ensemble. (Parnassus Ensemble/ Korf)

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: 80441-2 | BRO Code: 20336 | Label: NEW WORLD

Kahn, Erich Itor: 3 Piano Bagatelles; Piano Inventions #'s 4,7 & 8; Rhapsodie for Violin & Piano {J.Prelle & T.Gunther}; 3 Chansons Populaires; 4 Pcs.on Medieval German Poems {C.Gayer, sop. w.F.Maus, piano}; 'Nenia Judaeis Qui Hac Aetate Perierunt' ('In Memory of the Jews Who Perished in the Holocaust' w.J.Sessions, cello & Gunther, piano)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 563 | BRO Code: 11334 | Label: CRI

Genre: Contemporary

Barati {1913-1996}, Cello Concerto {Bernard Michelin w.London Phil./ composer}; Harpsichord Quartet {Baroque Chamber Players of Indiana}; Chamber Concerto. (Philadelphia Orch./ Ormandy)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 794 | BRO Code: 116176 | Label: CRI.

Finney, Ross Lee- Piano Music: Fantasy {1939}; Sonata #3 {1942}; Sonata Quasi una Fantasia {1961}; Narrative in Retrospect {1984}. (Martha Braden, piano)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 560 | BRO Code: 116287 | Label: CRI

Genre: Solo Piano{s}

Kohs, Ellis B. {b.1916}- Music for Keyboards and Strings: Passacaglia for Organ & Strings K.11 {Maija Lehtonen w.Grasbeck cond.}; Chamber Concerto for Viola & String Nonet K.28 {Ferenc Molnar w.Robert Mann, Robert Hillyer et al.}; Toccata K.25 {Lionel Salter, harpsichord}; String Quartet #2 {Gabor Rejto et al.}; Sonatina for Violin & Piano K.26. (Eudice Shapiro & Albert Dominguez. Total time: 71'40')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Mono | Code: CD 795 | BRO Code: 116254 | Label: CRI

Genre: Chamber Music

Karchin, Louis: Galactic Folds {The New York New Music Ensemble/ Milarsky}; Songs of Distance & Light {Andrea Cawelti, soprano w.Players of the Washington Square Contemporary Music Society/ Lubman}; Ricercare {Curtis Macomber, violin}; Sonata for Cello & Piano. (Fred Sherry & James Winn)

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: CD 739 | BRO Code: 116244 | Label: CRI

Karchin, Louis {b.1951}: 'American Visions'- 2 Songs on Yevtushenko Poems {Da Capo Chamber Players/ composer}; Rustic Dances; 'Cascades' for Solo Piano; Sonata da Camera for Violin & Piano; 'A Way Separate…'; String Quartet #2. (Washington Square Contemporary Music Society Players)

Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Digital | Code: 80583-2 | BRO Code: 110551 | Label: NEW WORLD

Genre: Chamber Music

(Karchin's instrumental music I mostly like -- Wourinen-influenced but more inherently musical (he has a good ear), and with some interesting, organic nudges toward minimalism and overt tonality at times. His writing for voice, though, I can't take -- not a single "natural" word accent and with no compensating abstract "whoosh." And those Yevtushenko texts! For some reason, I see EDC looking for Yevtushenko with a BB gun.)

Shifrin, Seymour {1926-1979}: Three Pieces for Orchestra {London Sinfonietta/ Monod}; String Quartet #4 {Fine Arts Quartet}; Serenade for Five Instruments. (Melvin Kaplan {oboe}, Charles Russo {clarinet}, Robert Cecil {horn}, Ynez Lynch {viola} & Harriet Wingreen {piano}. Total time: 66'28')

Add to cart | Price: $ 3.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: CD 793 | BRO Code: 116236 | Label: CRI

[Larry Kart]

Larry,

I have been regularly attending the particular chamber music series I was referring to for the past 6 years or so. I don't keep the programs so can't tell you the titles or composers of the music not to my taste. As to the chamber music I do like, it probably won't surprise you to know that it includes string quartets and/or other chamber and orchestral works by Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Dvorak, Tchaikovsky, Schumann, Saint- Saens, Bruch, Faure, Smetana, Hummel,Chopin, Greig, Rachmaninoff, Franck, Sibelius, and MANY others.

The "branching out" I have done over a number of years is to "discover" chamber works (and orchestral works as well) by composers who are not generally well known, yet composed in styles that fit within the type of classical music I most enjoy.

Here are some of those composers - Berwald, Chadwick, Gade, David, D'Indy, Chausson, Field, Godard, Heise, Holter, Kiel,

Kuhlau, Lekeu, Onslow, Parry, Rheinberger, Rubinstein, Scharwenka, Spohr, Stanford,Stenhammar, Svendsen, Volkman,

Grechaninov. These are just examples, and I have CDs by each of them and many others I didn't include on the list.

Peter,

I definitely like some of the composers on your "branching out" list -- Berwald, Chausson, Lekeu, Stenhammar, have what I feel is a bit of a weak spot for Stanford (I think because I like Brahms so much), have a delightful disc of flute and piano music by Kuhlau, and the flavor of Field is unique, though I can't take much of it at a sitting. Heard some nice Svendson too. The others I don't care for or are just names to me -- and Holter and Kiel I've never heard of before. So it would seem we can talk. Another question, though, if I may: What's the most modern (not chronologically but by your own standard of what that term means stylistically) piece of music that you've viscerally liked or come to enjoy?

[Larry Kart]

Correction: It's Martin Boykan's "Elegy," not his "Echoes of Petrarch," that seems to me to be close to the level of "Pierrot Lunaire." Just listened to Boykan's String Quartet No. 2. Something is askew when a composer as good as this is so little known.

Excerpts from "Elegy" can be heard here:

http://www.cduniverse.com/productinfo.asp?...style=classical

[Joe G]

I don't have RealPlayer installed, so I'll have to look elsewhere. But thanks Larry - if you say something is close to the level of "Pierrot Lunaire", it's something I need to check out.

[Peter Friedman]

Larry,

I have been regularly attending the particular chamber music series I was referring to for the past 6 years or so. I don't keep the programs so can't tell you the titles or composers of the music not to my taste. As to the chamber music I do like, it probably won't surprise you to know that it includes string quartets and/or other chamber and orchestral works by Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Dvorak, Tchaikovsky, Schumann, Saint- Saens, Bruch, Faure, Smetana, Hummel,Chopin, Greig, Rachmaninoff, Franck, Sibelius, and MANY others.

The "branching out" I have done over a number of years is to "discover" chamber works (and orchestral works as well) by composers who are not generally well known, yet composed in styles that fit within the type of classical music I most enjoy.

Here are some of those composers - Berwald, Chadwick, Gade, David, D'Indy, Chausson, Field, Godard, Heise, Holter, Kiel,

Kuhlau, Lekeu, Onslow, Parry, Rheinberger, Rubinstein, Scharwenka, Spohr, Stanford,Stenhammar, Svendsen, Volkman,

Grechaninov. These are just examples, and I have CDs by each of them and many others I didn't include on the list.

Peter,

I definitely like some of the composers on your "branching out" list -- Berwald, Chausson, Lekeu, Stenhammar, have what I feel is a bit of a weak spot for Stanford (I think because I like Brahms so much), have a delightful disc of flute and piano music by Kuhlau, and the flavor of Field is unique, though I can't take much of it at a sitting. Heard some nice Svendson too. The others I don't care for or are just names to me -- and Holter and Kiel I've never heard of before. So it would seem we can talk. Another question, though, if I may: What's the most modern (not chronologically but by your own standard of what that term means stylistically) piece of music that you've viscerally liked or come to enjoy?

Larry,

That's a tough question that would take a fair amount of time to research. What is the reason for the question?

Taste is a personal thing. I recall that not too long ago a prominent poster indicated that he did not have any real affection for opera. He had given it a try, but it was not something that grabbed him.

Different strokes ...

[7/4]

with all due respect, Peter-- then stay the fuck home or start your own series. if yr so hogtied by melody, or whatever... i'm not sure the wild parts of Ives are really yr "bag" either but if so then chill, dude, chill-- unless Death is banging loudly on yr door right NOW, you can spare the 15, 20 minues if even to bitch about it to us, your Internet Gangsta friends later, right? edc don't really like John Adams or Steve Reich very much but what can you do? Move to Finland? i wish!!

Friedman Information Center

[Larry Kart]

Larry,

I have been regularly attending the particular chamber music series I was referring to for the past 6 years or so. I don't keep the programs so can't tell you the titles or composers of the music not to my taste. As to the chamber music I do like, it probably won't surprise you to know that it includes string quartets and/or other chamber and orchestral works by Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Dvorak, Tchaikovsky, Schumann, Saint- Saens, Bruch, Faure, Smetana, Hummel,Chopin, Greig, Rachmaninoff, Franck, Sibelius, and MANY others.

The "branching out" I have done over a number of years is to "discover" chamber works (and orchestral works as well) by composers who are not generally well known, yet composed in styles that fit within the type of classical music I most enjoy.

Here are some of those composers - Berwald, Chadwick, Gade, David, D'Indy, Chausson, Field, Godard, Heise, Holter, Kiel,

Kuhlau, Lekeu, Onslow, Parry, Rheinberger, Rubinstein, Scharwenka, Spohr, Stanford,Stenhammar, Svendsen, Volkman,

Grechaninov. These are just examples, and I have CDs by each of them and many others I didn't include on the list.

Peter,

I definitely like some of the composers on your "branching out" list -- Berwald, Chausson, Lekeu, Stenhammar, have what I feel is a bit of a weak spot for Stanford (I think because I like Brahms so much), have a delightful disc of flute and piano music by Kuhlau, and the flavor of Field is unique, though I can't take much of it at a sitting. Heard some nice Svendson too. The others I don't care for or are just names to me -- and Holter and Kiel I've never heard of before. So it would seem we can talk. Another question, though, if I may: What's the most modern (not chronologically but by your own standard of what that term means stylistically) piece of music that you've viscerally liked or come to enjoy?

Larry,

That's a tough question that would take a fair amount of time to research. What is the reason for the question?

Taste is a personal thing. I recall that not too long ago a prominent poster indicated that he did not have any real affection for opera. He had given it a try, but it was not something that grabbed him.

Different strokes ...

I'm just curious, certain that you're a genuine music lover with a good-sized sense of curiosity, about where your stylistic cut-off point is. What I'm trying to do is get as specific a picture as possible of what a particular genuine, curious music lover doesn't like about (painting with a broad brush now) modern music. So if you've heard, say, some Stravinsky that pleased you but have no taste for any Berg, that info, plus your previously mentioned likes, would suggest or hint at one direction, while if you liked some Berg but no Stravinsky (or neither of those but only, say, some Nielsen or whomever), that would suggest or hint at something else. Again, I'm not trying to nag at you in particular or at anyone else. What I'm hoping to do is be a little more precise, think more precisely and specifically myself, about a subject -- the relationship between listeners/concert-goers and modern music -- that's often dealt with in terms of injury, conspiracy, utopian thinking, propaganda, dislike of being propagandized, etc. Certainly no need to answer, though, if you don't want to.

[Peter Friedman]

with all due respect, Peter-- then stay the fuck home or start your own series. if yr so hogtied by melody, or whatever... i'm not sure the wild parts of Ives are really yr "bag" either but if so then chill, dude, chill-- unless Death is banging loudly on yr door right NOW, you can spare the 15, 20 minues if even to bitch about it to us, your Internet Gangsta friends later, right? edc don't really like John Adams or Steve Reich very much but what can you do? Move to Finland? i wish!!

Friedman Information Center

edc,

As you like to say, "with all due respect", your arrogant agressive hostile comments are bullshit. You seem to believe that you are the source of all musical knowledge. Those who have different musical likes and dislikes are not respected, but rather are berated with nasty sarcasm.

It is fine to share opinions, and I find the areas in which people both agree and disagree to be a positive part of Organissimo. But you like to tell us all that some musicians are terrible and insult them rather than just indicate that you don't happen to like that person's playing, and give reasons if you so choose. It seems impossible for you to recognize that your musical taste is not the only valid one that exists.

You have a lot of interesting things to say regarding music, but it is disappointing that you have to do so by verbally attacking the musicians you don't like, and the people who hold opinions that are not in agreement with those you hold.

[7/4]

Yeah....but...he does have a point about starting your own series. It isn't easy to raise the cash to program a concert series. Around here it can be problem just finding a venue. And they expect to get a chunk of the action too.

I make my vote by not attending.