John Zorn's TZADIK Label

[Д.Д.]

In the meantime, looks like Tzadik releases are (still) available for streaming at apple music. 

[Rabshakeh]

Thanks! That's interesting.

[Д.Д.]

1 hour ago, Rabshakeh said:

Thanks! That's interesting.

Apple payout to the rights holders is higher than Spotify's. Millicents instead of microcents!  

[Rabshakeh]

1 minute ago, Д.Д. said:

Apple payout to the rights holders is higher than Spotify's. Millicents instead of microcents!  

Maybe he is too busy composing 40 albums worth of material a day to realise he hasn't removed it yet 

[Jason Bivins]

The backlash against Daniel Ek's investments may be a factor, too.

[Д.Д.]

The link posted in this thread earlier does not work any longer, so here it is again: https://www.tzadik.com/recommend_frame.php - these are Tzadik artists recommending albums from the label. A lot of good (and not so obvious) stuff here. 

[Rabshakeh]

I missed this link. What a fantastic looking selection of music to get into. 

Very interesting that they mostly seem to have picked chamber music. 

[T.D.]

2 hours ago, Д.Д. said:

The link posted in this thread earlier does not work any longer, so here it is again: https://www.tzadik.com/recommend_frame.php - these are Tzadik artists recommending albums from the label. A lot of good (and not so obvious) stuff here. 

Thanks. I actually own a few of those. Thought I was the only one who dug the Patterns of Plants CDs (there are 2 volumes, but the first, included in the list, is better IMO). 🤪

[mjazzg]

Just been playing the Bailey/Tacuma/Weston, what a blast that is. Harmolodic funk!

[Rabshakeh]

That's a good one!

I feel the same way about Zorn that I do about Wynton Marsalis, to an extent. Both men managed to ascend right to the top of public awareness and commercial clout, and then have decided to wall themselves into a weird little niche where they pump out product to the converted. 

[Д.Д.]

12 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

I feel the same way about Zorn that I do about Wynton Marsalis, to an extent. Both men managed to ascend right to the top of public awareness and commercial clout, and then have decided to wall themselves into a weird little niche where they pump out product to the converted. 

Well, Zorn invested his funds in releasing music by other artists whose music, IMHO, is much more interesting than his own (and which does not sell shit - I would assume Zorn ever made money only on his own releases).      

[Rabshakeh]

3 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

Well, Zorn invested his funds in releasing music by other artists whose music, IMHO, is much more interesting than his own (and which does not sell shit - I would assume Zorn ever made money only on his own releases).      

Agreed. 

I'm on a Tzadik run at the moment, thanks to your pointing out that they're still on iTunes, and I'm consistently amazed at how beautifully packaged those records are. But also that they are only really sold as Tzadik records to Tzadik fans. I can't remember seeing any of them making yearly best of lists or getting acclaim outside of the Tzadik fanbase. 

Not so much here, but there are large stretches of the internet where if you ask for a good jazz record made since 1970 you will be automatically directed to Naked City and At The Mountains of Madness. Those records were huge. But I think that the dramatic oversupply has probably damaged his standing badly. Those later Masada songbook records really aren't that good. 

[Д.Д.]

But is there such thing as Tzadik fan? I assume there are Zorn fans who might check out what else is there on his label. These releases would probably be even less noticeable were they on another label.      

[Rabshakeh]

Just comparing to e.g. Editions Mego or Astral Spirits, which have a similarish footprint. I think they have a bit more cut through. As you say, there seems to be a closed off group of Zorn followers who buy this stuff. 

[T.D.]

Tzadik has a small but high-quality footprint in the "contemporary classical" and "microtonal" genres. I've always enjoyed the relatively few recordings I own (also including some jazz). But it's not a label I watch for recent releases.

[Pim]

With Tzadik I really feel that the enormous output kind of overshadows the great records that are among it. Zorn himself made some great records but also a lot of disappointing stuff. 

[Д.Д.]

Well, it's about two releases per month lately, not that many. But the back catalog is large. 

[mhatta]

A lot of what Tzadik puts out isn't to my taste, but I do think some of its more conservative jazz releases are genuinely good. It would be a shame if they were overlooked because of the label's "avant-garde" image.

Some of my old favorites.  Thankfully, Apple Music still has them:

• Camp Songs / Ben Perowsky
• The Storyteller / Uri Gurvich
• Midnight Minyan / Paul Shapiro
• Trouble: The Jamie Saft Trio Plays Bob Dylan
• Flutter / Otomo Yoshihide's New Jazz Quintet

[Rabshakeh]

1 hour ago, mhatta said:

A lot of what Tzadik puts out isn't to my taste, but I do think some of its more conservative jazz releases are genuinely good. It would be a shame if they were overlooked because of the label's "avant-garde" image.

Some of my old favorites.  Thankfully, Apple Music still has them:

• Camp Songs / Ben Perowsky
• The Storyteller / Uri Gurvich
• Midnight Minyan / Paul Shapiro
• Trouble: The Jamie Saft Trio Plays Bob Dylan
• Flutter / Otomo Yoshihide's New Jazz Quintet

I only know two of these, the Shapiro and the Saft, so interesting to see and I'll definitely listen. 

I enjoyed Paul Shapiro's Shofarot Verses record. I generally don't like the Radical Jewish Culture series much, mostly because it is anything but radical, but that's a good one that I recommend.

[Д.Д.]

1 hour ago, Rabshakeh said:

I enjoyed Paul Shapiro's Shofarot Verses record. I generally don't like the Radical Jewish Culture series much, mostly because it is anything but radical, but that's a good one that I recommend.

I think Shapiro's "It's In The Twilight" us better thanks to quite unhinged playing by the guest Peter Apfelbaum.

And yeah, a lot of schmalzy stuff in the radical Jewish culture series. 

[Stompin at the Savoy]

 

[Rabshakeh]

32 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

I think Shapiro's "It's In The Twilight" us better thanks to quite unhinged playing by the guest Peter Apfelbaum.

Apfelbaum's great on the record but I didn't quite like its overall brass band sound, even if I see historically why he chose that setting. 

[Д.Д.]

11 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said:

Apfelbaum's great on the record but I didn't quite like its overall brass band sound, even if I see historically why he chose that setting. 

You are probably right, have not listened to it for ages. In the meantime, I am listening to my "Shofarot Verses" CD, and unless something radical enough happens before the disc ends it is heading straight to "for sale" pile afterwards. It has a bit of that after-dinner restaurant dance feel...

I will go through all my Radical Jewish CDs, and quite likely most of them will be looking for a different home as a result. But I sure will keep that Borah Bergman Trio CD.     

Edited September 8 by Д.Д.

[Rabshakeh]

That's a good one. 

[Д.Д.]

Going through my Tzadik collection, and this one is a delight: Cyro Baptista "Love the Donkey"

https://www.discogs.com/release/1087487-Cyro-Baptista-Love-The-Donkey