Capitol Vaults Series

[David Ayers]

Noticed this 'Capitol Vaults Series' on iTunes. There may be more on US iTunes, but so far on UK we have the (six-CD) Mobley set plus three selects: Bob Brookmeyer, Dexter Gordon, Andrew Hill (group). Prices are £14.99 on the Mobley and £12.99 on the Selects.

Oh and on amazon.co.uk the Mobley is £7.49...

Edited September 2, 2010 by David Ayers

[jazzbo]

Interesting. . .

[sjarrell]

It's about time! I wonder if Mosaic gets a cut?

[A Lark Ascending]

Be intrigued to know how this works. I thought Mosaics were on a limited licence.

ITunes also has the Ellington Reprise set at a much more expensive £60!!!

[mjzee]

I did a search on iTunes for "capitol vault" and came up with the same 4 titles. Andrew Hill = $16.99, Hank Mobley = $39.99, Bob Brookmeyer = $19.99, and Dexter Gordon = $9.99. The Dexter seems an especially good deal.

[tranemonk]

This is very odd... but the album info makes NO reference to Mosaic :unsure:

[David Ayers]

Mosaic do not own any copyright in the music, even on in-print sets. The copyright information in a Mosaic booklet or on a Mosaic CD is the same information which is given on iTunes.

The material in the Capitol Vaults series is (obviously) owned by Capitol and I suppose what we can hope for is that other OOP Capitol sets might make it to iTunes. The Maynard Ferguson and the two Basie sets come to mind. EMI/Capitol half owns Mosaic so may be more alive to this marketing option than other companies. On the negative side, no company so far seems to have been very systematic about converting its jazz holdings to commercial downloads, so who knows how many more of these we will see. I think they are recently posted, though, so there may be more in train.

[A Lark Ascending]

Strange given all the fuss companies make when they issue their boutique boxes that they put things like these up as downloads without publicity.

[David Ayers]

Oh and these are all on Spotify, I now find.

[tranemonk]

That's right.. thanks I forgot...

It is frustrating though that there's no KIND of friggin' communication that these things are coming out on mp3.. :angry:

You would think (given how much they all want our $$$) that there would be somebody who'd ask (pay) Mosaic for a list of their customers so they could send us some promotional emails or something.... (Not that I want more email... :wacko: :wacko: )

My basic point is that there is CLEARLY a market (namely us) for this stuff... Seems like a half-assed effort to just throw them out there an have us go find them...

What am I?? A dog after a bone???? :beee:

Mosaic do not own any copyright in the music, even on in-print sets. The copyright information in a Mosaic booklet or on a Mosaic CD is the same information which is given on iTunes.

The material in the Capitol Vaults series is (obviously) owned by Capitol and I suppose what we can hope for is that other OOP Capitol sets might make it to iTunes. The Maynard Ferguson and the two Basie sets come to mind. EMI/Capitol half owns Mosaic so may be more alive to this marketing option than other companies. On the negative side, no company so far seems to have been very systematic about converting its jazz holdings to commercial downloads, so who knows how many more of these we will see. I think they are recently posted, though, so there may be more in train.

[David Ayers]

Well yeah I don't disagree. I guess it's true of a lot of back-catalog on iTunes and elsewhere that it just sits there until someone stumbles on it...

[JSngry]

My hunch is that they're doing it because they feel like they have to, not because they want to... a fitting conclusion to the whole digital music revolution, which began by us converting because we pretty much had to, not because we wanted to.

What goes around comes around...

[A Lark Ascending]

Back in the 60s/70s I remember the powers that be used to take every opportunity to get MOR singers like Ken Dodd on Top of the Pops, clearly under the impression that rock/pop was a passing phase and eventually misguided youth would find their way back to something more tasteful. They didn't really get what had happened.

I suspect the same thing is going on here - the powers that be are still locked into a concept of physical discs in fancy packaging. Eventually (as happened in the mid-70s in the record administration) a new generation will enter management who understand how the technology has changed.

Then they'll start thinking about how better to target audiences beyond the rock mainstream.

I'm always amazed about how poor the navigation is on these commercial sites. Yes, you can get where you want via 'search' if you know what you are looking for. And there is the rather random 'customers who bought X also bought Y'. But where you do get attempts to break down genres into sub-themes it can again get very random.

The plethora of cheapo downloads confuses things too (a real pain wading through e-music).

[bertrand]

So far it's all material that was available on Mosaic, it seems. One positive aspect is that as long as they are always available, the Andrew Hill set will never be completly OOP.

Of course, they could expand the concept and start putting out vault stuff that has never seen the light of day (unissued Wayne and Jackie sessions)...

Bertrand.

[jazzbo]

I don't think we're going to see those Wayne and Jackie sessions. I wouldn't be surprised if the masters don't exist any longer.

It's a good thing if these Mosaic sets have a digital file counterpart and stay sort of in print. Not my first choice (to download, I don't do that often) but there's always a point were "beggars can't be choosers."

[crisp]

Back in the 60s/70s I remember the powers that be used to take every opportunity to get MOR singers like Ken Dodd on Top of the Pops, clearly under the impression that rock/pop was a passing phase and eventually misguided youth would find their way back to something more tasteful. They didn't really get what had happened.

I suspect the same thing is going on here - the powers that be are still locked into a concept of physical discs in fancy packaging. Eventually (as happened in the mid-70s in the record administration) a new generation will enter management who understand how the technology has changed.

Ah, but even in the Swinging Sixties there were plenty of over-forties more inclined towards buying Ken Dodd records than the Beatles, otherwise why was Ken the third-biggest selling artist in Britain during that decade?

And today there are over-forties who "are still locked into a concept of physical discs in fancy packaging" -- me for one! I think the record companies are working to a tighter budget than before, but as ever, they know what they are doing -- middle-aged people always have more money than teenagers.

I'd prefer it if EMI would put out the OOP Mosaics (Ferguson, Basie, Shearing etc) as budget boxed sets, a bit like the Sony Billie Holiday set that recently came out. Would legal issues prevent that, I wonder (ie does Mosaic own the remastering rights)?

Edited September 3, 2010 by crisp

[A Lark Ascending]

Ah, but even in the Swinging Sixties there were plenty of over-forties more inclined towards buying Ken Dodd records than the Beatles, otherwise why was Ken the third-biggest selling artist in Britain during that decade?

Perhaps because the powers that be alllowed him on TotPs every time, as well as giving him is own TV series! Whereas you had to look long and hard for any representation of what is now considered the soundtrack to that time on the TV.

And today there are over-forties who "are still locked into a concept of physical discs in fancy packaging" -- me for one! I think the record companies are working to a tighter budget than before, but as ever, they know what they are doing -- middle-aged people always have more money than teenagers.

Yes, you are right. Figures seem to still show physical sales well exceeding downloads.

But every year the number of the middle aged will be joined by younger people who are used to acquiring things digitally.

I'd imagine economics would make these big concept CD sets of very well known jazz profitable; but as for the lesser known stuff? I'd have thought the digital route would be a far more cost-effective way of distributing things that tend to sell over a long period.

I'd be much happier getting Mosaics via download. No sudden customs bills, no variable shipping times, no driving to bizarre warehouses in Sheffield and Rotherham because I was out when they tried to deliver.

But I know that amongst fellow-obsessives I'm different in my download preference.

[JSngry]

But every year the number of the middle aged will be joined by younger people who are used to acquiring things digitally.

And not just that - every year the number of these middle aged decreases as they become old, and every year the number of those old decrease as they become dead.

[mellowT]

Gee, I wonder if the iTunes version of Touch and Go has that stray trumpet note too.

[A Lark Ascending]

But every year the number of the middle aged will be joined by younger people who are used to acquiring things digitally.

And not just that - every year the number of these middle aged decreases as they become old, and every year the number of those old decrease as they become dead.

Well, I know for sure that Fed-EX doesn't deliver to heaven (or the other place).

But they might just have an internet connection...

[JSngry]

Gives a whole new twist to upload vs. download....

[sidewinder]

I'd be much happier getting Mosaics via download.

What happens when your drive gets wiped? (as happened to me). Can't beat non-erasable hard copy, IMO.

No sudden customs bills

I hear you on that one. And immune to £/$ fluctuations too !

[JSngry]

I'd be much happier getting Mosaics via download.

What happens when your drive gets wiped? (as happened to me). Can't beat non-erasable hard copy, IMO.

That's why you download and then burn.

[A Lark Ascending]

I'd be much happier getting Mosaics via download.

What happens when your drive gets wiped? (as happened to me). Can't beat non-erasable hard copy, IMO.

That's why you download and then burn.

And backup!

Gives a whole new twist to upload vs. download....

Grinning smiley thing.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Grinning smiley thing.

Translation - colon g

MG