Joe Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Early 60s, right. Point just being that bassists then were not traditionally leaders of dates. True 'dat. Even Carter's WHERE? is much less of a bassist's than a cellist's date. But it could have been the first in a string of Carter-led sessions, only it wasn't... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Some guys don't have the drive and/or need to hustle a leader date. I suspect that Carter in the 60s would have fit that bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILLYQ Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Ron Carter also became very involved with academia at the CCNY(City College NY)music program.Don't know exact dates, but I believe he was a professor there for quite awhile, and it's important to point out that a gig like that provides a pension and health benefits, both important considerations for musicians. Between that and playing a gazillion sideman gigs on other's recordings he just may have had not much time to do a lot else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 When I heard Wayne Shorter playing in a Village club back in September 1965, Herbie Hancock was with him. Richard Davis was on bass and Joe Chambers on drums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertrand Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 That's something I would have loved to hear live. They probably played some Shorter originals, based on the one private club recording which circulates from that era. Bertrand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeweil Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 Considering the influence producers had on chosing sidemen, maybe it was them who wanted to avoid anything too close to the quintet's personnel. Besides that, all the guys mentioned were part of a pool of players, and there may be several factors involved in determining who ended up on which live or studio date. I remember reading about Miles complaining when his rhythm section was hired by Orrin Keepnews for Wes Montgomery's Full House date - he shut up after Wynton Kelly asked him for monetary compensation in case he cancelled. Sometimes bandleaders were jealous, or even suspicious, Miles in particular, because it was only a small step to loosing sidemen. Consider how long it took him to get a satisfactory replacement for Coltrane or anybody else he appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasing the Korean Posted August 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 Considering the influence producers had on chosing sidemen, maybe it was them who wanted to avoid anything too close to the quintet's personnel. Besides that, all the guys mentioned were part of a pool of players, and there may be several factors involved in determining who ended up on which live or studio date. I remember reading about Miles complaining when his rhythm section was hired by Orrin Keepnews for Wes Montgomery's Full House date - he shut up after Wynton Kelly asked him for monetary compensation in case he cancelled. Sometimes bandleaders were jealous, or even suspicious, Miles in particular, because it was only a small step to loosing sidemen. Consider how long it took him to get a satisfactory replacement for Coltrane or anybody else he appreciated. This seems to make sense. A similar parallel is Brubeck asking Desmond to not use piano players on Desmond's sessions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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