Controversial Ellington CD

[Big Beat Steve]

1 hour ago, John L said:

While I generally agree with the sentiments raised here, I still have mixed feelings about it.   It is true that some 30s Ellington tracks have less than desirable vocals.  I suspect that Ellington himself may have had limited control over who was singing on some of those records.   It is also true that some of those tracks have sensational arrangements and / or instrumental passages.  

...

 Maybe some of the tracks with removed vocals would be listened to more often?

If I understood correctly what Miles65 said above the vocals were not filtered out but simply cut out. Not that much different to what some budget labels did with certain "biggest hits" recordings as early as the 70s. I remember one label (K-TEL, I think) that was given big flak not even by the specialist press (they did not care for and about such a budget label anyway) but the general press because it was found that in order to squeeze 20 tracks on one 12" Big Band LP they had edited out certain solos, thus shortening (and of course botching) certain tracks.

But I'd find it intriguing really FILTERING out the vocals (if anyone finds this mandatory) and thus making up an "alternate take" where you can listen more closely to the obbligatos behind the (no longer present) vocalist. In the same manner that I'd like to see the compere's introductory babble filtered out of the recordings I mentioned above. That should be feasible with today's technology, I'd guess ...

Edited June 20, 2023 by Big Beat Steve

[rostasi]

The radio segue was king (still should be these days),
and radio air checks transferred to discs are, for me,
actually a delightful slice of the history of radio.

I think the software for removing/adjusting sound
should be as readily available as the bass and treble
controls on your “hi-fi” have always been.

For me, removing something like, for instance,
Garcia’s vocals from “Dark Star” or just about any
vocal that Zappa decides to yap is a godsend.

Edited June 20, 2023 by rostasi

[Dan Gould]

Gene Harris recorded a CD with his daughter, Niki Harris (the larger of the two women flanking Madonna on several concert videos/music videos) which it took a very long time for me to track down. (In fact I think it was a still-born release, like the BNs that were tracked and appeared in ads or on the insert sleeve but not actually issued.)  She wasn't the best part of the CD, let's put it that way, so I edited her in Goldwave using the "reduce vocals" pre-set ... It didn't get rid of her though.

[Big Beat Steve]

24 minutes ago, rostasi said:

The radio segue was king (still should be these days),
and radio air checks transferred to discs are, for me,
actually a delightful slice of the history of radio.

 

Agreed - like I said in an earlier post, the announcements by Symphony Sid or Hunter Hancock (or whoever) in 50s radio shows that have since been released on LP or CD are part of the mix and make history become tangible.
But there are some lesser MCs whose talk does intrude in some cases.

And the examples I mentioned above (including the Youtube links) are STUDIO recordings. And there I find the anouncers really unessential - at least on a cleaned-up "alternate take".

And if the (AI?) filtering technology evolves to the point of being being able to filtering out interference from neighboring stations on less-than-perfectly recorded radio airshots then I for one wouldn't complain either.

[JSngry]

Why are we more interested in changing old records than in making new ones?

It seems king of a Rambo-esque "do we get to win this time?" pursuit. 

[JSngry]

Here's about 20 seconds for a DJ to sound like either a total idiot or king of the world.

Them that's got shall get, etc 

[rostasi]

Changing old records can actually be about making new ones.

[JSngry]

If approached as such yes. Otherwise there's a real possibility of it simply being a petulant vanity. 

[John L]

6 hours ago, miles65 said:

No vocal track was left of either Mosaic Ellington 30's set. The Goodman and Shaw boxes on the other hand.... 

Yes.  You are right.  I was confused because it appears that the weaker vocalists had been almost eliminated from Ellington's recordings by the time of the Mosaics.  That is in contrast to the early 30s when they were abundant.  

[Stompin at the Savoy]

My solution for vocals or solos I don't like is fast forward or skip forward. But I want to make that decision myself, not have some idiot who happens to hate trombones or whatever make it.

[Ken Dryden]

I never understood the addition of Tony Watkins as a vocalist, he was so detested that a European audience booed him so much that Ellington abruptly ended the concert.

I consider “One More Time” featuring Watkins to be one of the weakest Ellington compositions, Cootie Williams hated it so much he would storm off stage when it was called.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Ken Dryden

[JSngry]