An honest apparaisal of Mosaic sets

[Brad]

Like TJazz, I'm part of the cult also and I have to say that most of us probably need to start MA -- Mosaic Anonymous because we are addicted. God help us all!

[clandy44]

The title of this thread suggests you think you need to tread lightly lest you disturb the inmates here. Nah, don't worry. I'm a devoted Mosaic acquirer and marvel at the quality, breadth and relatively cheap price for their products. My ear does not recoil in horror at the mention of Ron McMaster so that's not a problem. That said, I have some sets I won't be listening to much-the Pearson is just awful to me, and I don't like the Sarah for all the pop garbage with strings that she did for obvious commercial reasons. There are parts of others too that won't get much play...but how about such sets as the HRS, Capitol, Donaldson, Prima, etc.? Where in the world would I realistically find that stuff if not for Mosaic? Like most things, Mosaic ain't for everybody but it sure suits me.

[Shrdlu]

Sorry to hear of your disappointment, CS500. But don't turn away from all Mosaic sets just because you don't like the sound on that Pearson set. To say it again, once too often really, that is a McMaster problem. Ron has not done all the Mosaic remastering by any means. There are many Mosaic sets with excellent sound, the recent Mulligan for example. And some of the McMastered sets are good, too. I like the sound on the Byrd, Mitchell and Parlan sets.

But I would certainly not give up any TOCJs or JRVGs that I already had. In some cases, I have obtained the Japanese CDs after getting the Mosaic counterpart. For example, the Mobley 50s recordings.

I will not be getting any of the Select series after hearing what a mess Ron made of the first one, the Moncur set.

You mention the order of the tracks in that Pearson set. It should be pointed out that there never was an "I Don't Care Who Knows It" album as such. That title was arbitrarily used by Michael Cuscuna for a CD compilation, with items taken from many sessions. I used that CD (and others) to make custom burns of the various sessions in order. It made more sense to listen to them that way. There does seem to have been a plan to make an LP of Brasilian material. I'm referring to the two sessions at A & R, with Airto and Flora etc.

A little frustrating is the fact that there is one (not two, as they said) new track ("Dialogo") that is not available elsewhere. And there are still two items (from the A & R sessions) that have never been released.

[wesbed]

-the Pearson is just awful to me

I'm glad to learn I'm not the only one to think the Duke Pearson Select is not great. I thought I was alone in my negative view of the Pearson box.

[RDK]

I'm curious, CS500, why'd you chose the Pearson as your first Mosaic?

[Jazzmoose]

I have yet to pick up a Select myself. It just doesn't seem to be the approach that says "Mosaic" to me. I wish them luck with the idea, but for me, the whole point of Mosaic is the regular set. I came close to getting the Moncur, but then picked up Some Other Stuff and Evolution from fellow board members. Unless I'm whacking out a whole section of an artist's catalog, like with the O'Day set, I'd rather just get individual discs anyway.

[connoisseur series500]

I'm curious, CS500, why'd you chose the Pearson as your first Mosaic?

I got thumped on ebay in a bidding war for "Phantom" for the umpteenth time. Where's J.A.W? I quit cause he showed he'd bid the moon.

Then I discovered that "It Can Only Happen to You" was on it as well.

I happen to like Duke Pearson's later stuff. I think he tried to maintain some quality control at Blue Note during its declining years (and he was declining in health at the same time.)

Then there was the additional incentive that I could get some fair coin for my two Pearson JRVGs which could be applied to the purchase of the Select.

It all made sense really.

[undergroundagent]

Paul —

Just to reinterate..."The Phantom" is to be reissued on June. 29th on Blue Note/Water Records. THese are the same kats that put out the Eddie Gale discs.

[Chuck Nessa]

DAMN. I hate this stuff.

Don't do no good for nothin'.

Guess my drugs kicked in.

Pearson is a fine artist, but minor by any standard I understand. I find the stuff in this box the weakest of his career. I never considered the Mosaic set - just to get my attitude in perspective.

[Shrdlu]

It's "It Could Only Happen With You". The Portuguese title is "So' Tinha De Ser Com Você", by one A.C. Jobim. The original is on Jobim's album "The Wonderful World of Antonio Carlos Jobim", which was reissued on CD not so long ago. Interestingly, both Flora (on the Pearson session) and Jobim sing it in the same key - and not an octave apart either, if memory serves.

I admire Duke for getting into the Brasilian music on his sessions when it was still quite new. He also used Airto and Flora before Miles, Getz and Corea did. Rather than staying with the type of things he did with Byrd and Adams, great though that was, he took a chance and tried something new. It's sad that he saw little success, some of the music not even being released back then.

[mmilovan]

...

I'm not getting rid of my Japanese masterings for those crappy Mosaic masterings.  No way!

...

I've noticed the same with Django box. Attacs of tones have some sharp edges. It looks as it is not modern mastering, but grainy mastering of 1980's. Really don't know what they did with that one, if they had original metal parts and sophisticated equipment. I am pretty sure it is not how good transfers from 78s sound.

Edited April 16, 2004 by mmilovan

[Jazzdog]

I will not be getting any of the Select series after hearing what a mess Ron made of the first one, the Moncur set.

What is really the problem there? I've listened to the Moncur Select tons of times and I do not have any problems with the way it sounds. Is it really a poor remastering job, or is this merely a (very) subjective opinion?

[wesbed]

I will not be getting any of the Select series after hearing what a mess Ron made of the first one, the Moncur set.

What is really the problem there? I've listened to the Moncur Select tons of times and I do not have any problems with the way it sounds. Is it really a poor remastering job, or is this merely a (very) subjective opinion?

I agree with Jazzdog regarding the Moncur. I've listened to it numerous times. I have never heard anything wrong with any of the three disks. What did McMaster make a mess of, exactly?

Edited April 16, 2004 by wesbed

[connoisseur series500]

It's "It Could Only Happen With You". The Portuguese title is "So' Tinha De Ser Com Você", by one A.C. Jobim. The original is on Jobim's album "The Wonderful World of Antonio Carlos Jobim", which was reissued on CD not so long ago. Interestingly, both Flora (on the Pearson session) and Jobim sing it in the same key - and not an octave apart either, if memory serves.

I admire Duke for getting into the Brasilian music on his sessions when it was still quite new. He also used Airto and Flora before Miles, Getz and Corea did. Rather than staying with the type of things he did with Byrd and Adams, great though that was, he took a chance and tried something new. It's sad that he saw little success, some of the music not even being released back then.

Sorry for the mistitle, Shrdlu.

I agree with you on the Brazilian pieces.

For the record, I think Chuck is too harsh regarding the music on this set. "Merry Ole Soul" is pretty bad, I'll admit; but I find the Brazilian-dominated sessions on "Phantom" "How Insensitive," "It Can Only Happen With You," and "I Don't Care Who Knows It," to be charming and often beautiful.

Again, the music is pretty good, but that awful mastering...

[connoisseur series500]

Paul —

Just to reinterate..."The Phantom" is to be reissued on June. 29th on Blue Note/Water Records. THese are the same kats that put out the Eddie Gale discs.

Some good that would do me now that I've already purchased the Mosaic Select and sold off my two JRVGs.

[LAL]

May be a moot point for some. One thing Mosaic booklets lack is a page or 2 dedicated to original album or record cover art. The Selects rectify this, to an extent.

[Clunky]

I will not be getting any of the Select series after hearing what a mess Ron made of the first one, the Moncur set.

What is really the problem there? I've listened to the Moncur Select tons of times and I do not have any problems with the way it sounds. Is it really a poor remastering job, or is this merely a (very) subjective opinion?

another voice here in favour of the Moncur select.

Sound is fine, clear and strong . I hear the rolled "S" on the vocals but that's no big deal for me.

The sound on the "Destination Out" session is pretty much the same as on the Conn. version IMO.

[Stefan Wood]

It's all subjective. We listen to music on different kinds of stereo equipment, have different "ears," even listen differently. There are people who find nothing wrong with the Mosaics, there will be people who think that the Japan reissues are the best. This kind of discussion always goes around in circles.

[DrJ]

Nicely put Stefan, although sometimes I must admit it's still fun to spin.

One thing I want to say is that I disagree with the view that MERRY OLE SOUL is weak music - to me it's one of the stronger sessions in this box, and one of the most creative takes on holiday music I've heard by a jazz artist.

It's Pearson's take on the Brazilian music that is definitely not going to be to all tastes.

[Shrdlu]

Clearly, a dislike for McMaster's work is subjective, but I have heard several people complaining about the Moncur set. If you like it, then that's fine. I'm glad that you do. Anyway, I have nearly all of the Moncur set in TOCJ form, and all but one of the Pearson tracks that I want, in one form or another. (I don't want the Merry Old Soul tracks - too many Nov-Dec shopping mall experiences for that.) Someone sent me a superb burn of the LP of "It Could Only Happen With You" a few years back, from an LP that was so mint that HM Queen Elizabeth II could put it on her new potatoes. The mix on that LP is great.

Has anyone else found that a good home-made LP-to-digital transfer sounds better than an official CD reissue?

Hey, CS500, you got the name wrong again, ha, ha! You'll have to stay after school and write it on the chalkboard 50 times.

[jazzbo]

Merry Ole Soul is one of the only holiday albums I'll play! I really like it.

Sh, yes, I don't find this ALWAYS to be the case, but some, perhaps many or most lp to cdr transfers of a mint lp are going to outshine most of the "official" cds. . . . To my ears and taste in my system, as I should always say.

[connoisseur series500]

Hey, CS500, you got the name wrong again, ha, ha! You'll have to stay after school and write it on the chalkboard 50 times.

Oh screw the title!

I just like the music.

[Shrdlu]

Can you translate that into Portuguese?

[wolff]

Has anyone else found that a good home-made LP-to-digital transfer sounds better than an official CD reissue?

This sounds interesting. PM me with some Blue Note titles you have CD's of and I'll send you some nice burns form my vinyl.

Since when did half you guys become audiophiles. Talking about sound, mastering, higher resolution formats. Comparing formats. LMAO

It seems like every thread about a re-issue talks about the sound quality.

I used to wonder when/if CD collecting would become like vinyl collecting. My question has been answered.

CS500 might like burns from Mosaic vinyl sets. I have a dozen and only the Tina Brooks is below average.

I own a few BN titles on vinyl. I've never really been impressed with RVG's work, except in one area. Soundwise I much prefer jazz titles from RCA, Contemporary and other labels.

[BruceH]

I just bought my first Mosaic set: the Duke Pearson Select.

It seems that this forum is dominated by those who view Mosaic box sets with the devotion of cult members. I am new to Mosaics so perhaps my opinion might reflect some objectivity.

I've just made my first and last Mosaic purchase.

You are SO right, man. Mosaic sets suck. Don't ever buy another one! And the sets on the Running Low list-----they are the WORST! Avoid them at all costs.