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Milestones

McCoy Tyner

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10 hours ago, JSngry said:

Not Ran Blake, correct?

Correct.  Philly-guy John Blake.

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Also saw the Joe Ford/John Blake, in Philly, Cafe Bijou - maybe mid-‘70’s?  Terrific! But the first time I heard Tyner was with Coltrane - Birdland, late summer ‘63. (Not the date that was recorded.) Opened with Afro-Blue.  A double bill with Terry Gibbs, and his pianist: Alice McLeod. 

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34 minutes ago, DMP said:

Also saw the Joe Ford/John Blake, in Philly, Cafe Bijou - maybe mid-‘70’s?  Terrific! But the first time I heard Tyner was with Coltrane - Birdland, late summer ‘63. (Not the date that was recorded.) Opened with Afro-Blue.  A double bill with Terry Gibbs, and his pianist: Alice McLeod. 

I also saw Tyner with Ford at the Bijou ca. 1976-77, but Blake was not with him, it was a second saxophone player, I want to say George Adams but don't really remember.  Both sax players got swallowed up by the enormity of Tyner's playing.

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Posted (edited)

Blake was in the touring lineup circa 1980-83, so later than the mid 70s. 

I thought he was really excellent live with McCoy. His solo albums of that era (Grammavision?) I found disappointing and don’t do him justice.

Edited by sidewinder

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8 hours ago, sidewinder said:

Blake was in the touring lineup circa 1980-83, so later than the mid 70s. 

I thought he was really excellent live with McCoy. His solo albums of that era (Grammavision?) I found disappointing and don’t do him justice.

Agreed on the Gramavision albums.  They seemed aimed for radio play, and wasted some other talented Philly musicians also (Sumi Tanooka, Sid Simmons).  Probably worth remembering that Blake had also played with Grover Washington, Jr. in the 70's, so was likely not exactly adverse to the idea of selling some albums.

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Posted (edited)

Yes, those albums had a bit of an FM-play feel to them - plus something of the sterility (to my ears) of Windham Hill, also the rage circa 1984-85.

Edited by sidewinder

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9 hours ago, sidewinder said:

Blake was in the touring lineup circa 1980-83, so later than the mid 70s. 

I thought he was really excellent live with McCoy. His solo albums of that era (Grammavision?) I found disappointing and don’t do him justice.

I'm certain I saw John Blake with McCoy Tyler later than 1983; definitely in 1984 and possibly 1985.

I also saw John Blake as a leader, about the time of Twinkling of an Eye. Fantastic group.

 

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At some point, after relatively stable deals (Impulse, Blue Note, Milestone, even Columbia), Tyner wound up leading dates for several labels, in some cases just one offs (Elektra, Palo Alto, others)... But what I could never figure out were the couple of sessions for Laserlight, a budget label if ever there was one. They’re pretty good (Claudio Roditi!), but seem largely forgotten. Always wondered what the story was. (And Sonny Lester, that must be another story!)

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The Laserlights were reissues of the earlier LRC CDs. I guess the money was good enough and he took advantage of it. Dizzy Gillespie frequently did recording dates for a flat fee, figuring that he would never see royalties from them.

I don't remember Tyner being on Columbia for long, I know of 2 LPs and Looking Out is pretty forgettable.

Palo Alto was in business for a rather short time. Herb Wong put out some good music, but being a respected journalist doesn't mean one has either the expertise or finances to run a record label. He is missed.

 

There has to be a treasure trove of unissued McCoy Tyner concerts worthy of release. I have quite a few broadcasts archived in my library.

The questions remain who has the rights to them and is there a label interested.

Maybe Resonance or Elemental Music will explore opportunities before jokers like Hi-Hat start releasing them with the Tyner estate and publishers not getting paid.

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Was McCoy's wife his business manager, at least at some point? Seems like I heard that back in the day?

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I think he was divorced some time before his death, but I am pretty sure that he had a son.

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On 7.1.2022 at 7:28 PM, JSngry said:

Was McCoy's wife his business manager, at least at some point? Seems like I heard that back in the day?

 

On 7.1.2022 at 8:13 PM, Ken Dryden said:

I think he was divorced some time before his death, but I am pretty sure that he had a son.

Interesting that now reading this I thing we know very little about his personal live. He seemed to keep it off publicity, that´s really okay. 
Other jazz wifes were pretty well known, like Lucille Rollins for example...

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I would like to see some live material released.  As pointed out, there must be plenty of it.  I have seen live concerts on YouTube with Joe Lovano that are much better than the official live album by Tyner and Lovano.

 

 

 

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28 minutes ago, Milestones said:

I would like to see some live material released. 

Wouldn't we all!  Though I'm no Lovano fan.

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We differ there.  He seems to be falling off with the ECM albums, but before that I'd say he was my favorite tenor.

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I really like Lovano as well. And he's one of the nicest musicians I have ever met. But I don't like those gongs on his recent record. . . ugh.

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Those ECM trio records are just too ethereal and lacking pulse.  But I will say that the ECM with the Polish trio is better than the others.  

 

 

Edited by Milestones

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Against my previous and perhaps better judgment of Lovano's work, I kind of liked his "Garden of Expression." The relative lack of pulse somehow turned out to be a plus; semi-ethereal seemed to be working for him.

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17 minutes ago, Larry Kart said:

 The relative lack of pulse somehow turned out to be a plus; semi-ethereal seemed to be working for him.

It's been implicit in him from the almost-beginning with that tone that is a mind-meld (or something) of Joe Henderson & Dewey Redman.

Would that he had embraced it sooner, but things are not always as easy as they seem from the outside, maybe. When he made those ECM records with Motian, I thought that that was where he was going. Turned out that he had other plans.

 

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The ethereal sound on the recent ECMs is really nothing like his ballad style.  I regard Lovano as the greatest ballads player of the past 3 or 4 decades.

 

 

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On 1/9/2022 at 2:59 AM, Gheorghe said:

 

Interesting that now reading this I thing we know very little about his personal live. He seemed to keep it off publicity, that´s really okay. 
Other jazz wifes were pretty well known, like Lucille Rollins for example...

Know very lit Was Jimmy or Elvin marrie3d?  Who knew?  Guess I still don't. 

 

Thinking the same thing. Know little about McCoy, less about Elvin, Pharoah, Rashied. Did these dudes have a personal life?

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Well about Elvin we know much: He was married for decades to his japanes wife Keiko. She was always there and tuned his drums before the gig. I saw her on stage doing that before Elvins group started. In Laurie Peppers book about her husband she describes here very well, and that she lectured Laurie how you might "handle" a husband who is into drugs, to keep him off the bad guys, to take care of his money and buy him "presents" like jewellry, sharp threads, expesive watches and so on, to keep them reasonable happy....

Pharoah, as much as I know, married a much younger woman and they lived on the Coast and I think they have a child too. There was an interview with Pharoah were he said that, but he also said he hated the place were they lived.....

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38 minutes ago, Gheorghe said:

Well about Elvin we know much: He was married for decades to his japanes wife Keiko. She was always there and tuned his drums before the gig. I saw her on stage doing that before Elvins group started. In Laurie Peppers book about her husband she describes here very well, and that she lectured Laurie how you might "handle" a husband who is into drugs, to keep him off the bad guys, to take care of his money and buy him "presents" like jewellry, sharp threads, expesive watches and so on, to keep them reasonable happy....

Pharoah, as much as I know, married a much younger woman and they lived on the Coast and I think they have a child too. There was an interview with Pharoah were he said that, but he also said he hated the place were they lived.....

Learned this much in 3 minutes. Thank you Gheorghe. I actually couldn't stop reading, and that is sincere. 

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