Daniel A

While not as comprehensive as one would wish, still the Penguin lists an awful lot of musicians, and I'd bet you're not familiar with all of them. It has made me buy records I'd never have known of without the guide, and one fact which is sometimes overlooked is that it lists quite a lot of European jazz which is not listed at all in the AMG.

Nice to see you back here again, Brownie! Yes, I must get this release too! A month or two ago I noticed that a press release from BN said "Blue Note recording artist Martial Solal", but no record had yet been announced on their beloved website by then.

I agree with the AMG that many of these dates don't generate the excitement they could, allthough I think some of the ratings are a little too low. I voted for 'Street of Dreams' which in my opinion really has a vibe to it. I wonder what the reviewer means with that it's "yet another underrated Green session". That he himself underrates it?

Perhaps a warning, though, that a few of the very last Cadets, one or two of them are also featuring a chorus I think, are more "commercial" than the earlier. Not a bad thing in itself, they're just stylistically a bit different. Re: My off-topic notion about unissued Getz. Sorry, I though for a moment that this thread was dedicated to everything it appears we're not allowed to hear. Such a thread would perhaps be unnecessarily sad, so we'd perhaps better stick just to Jamal...

This is what I think is one of the great problems of the AMG. Nowadays, I mainly use the AMG for checking out which musicians who are playing on a certain album (and sometimes - as I'm moving towards more obscure releases - it doesn't even list them at all). In the past, when I did have a rather small record collection, I had a lot more use for the Penguin than the AMG, allthough I rarely read it these days other than for pleasure. (When was the last time you READ the AMG for pleasure?) I got burned a few times - lured by Scott Yanow's routine hard bop praise - when a five star album turned out to be rather average.

Sorry for bothering you, I think I found the data here: http://www001.upp.so-net.ne.jp/TFA/disco_2.../Disco_2001.htm Michel Legrand (arr), Billy Byers(cond), Clark Terry, Snooky Young, Ernie Royal, Al Derisi (tp), Bob Brookmeyer, Wayne Andre, Bill Elton, Urbie Green, Tom Mitchell (tb), Julius Watkins (frh), Jerry Dodgion (as), Phil Woods(as, fl, cl), Paul Gonsalves, Other Two Players (ts), Tommy Flanagan (p), Milt Hinton (B), Sol Gubin (ds) 1962.12.6. šHave You Met Miss Jones, This Can't Be Love, The Lady Is a Tramp ¦ Original Title " Plays Richard Rodgers " I like that "Other Two Players (ts)"... On another site the tracks are listed as being issued on 'Michel Legrand Orchestra Plays Richard Rodgers' (Philips 600074). I wonder why those particular three tracks were reissued on the 'Legrand Jazz' CD, though. Maybe the Japanese liner would answer that question...

I have the Japanese CD issue of 'Legrand Jazz', which has three additional titles recorded in 1962 - 'Have You Met MIss Jones?', 'This Can't be Love' and 'The Lady Is a Tramp' (the original album was recorded at three sessions in 1958). The personnel is listed in Japanese only on the inlay card, and since the mini-LP-sleeve only reproduces the original liners I'm not able to find out who the musicians were at the 1962 session. Anybody around here with more knowledge? Another question regarding this album: It was originally released on Columbia, but it seems to have been transformed into a Philips album already in the 60s. How did that happen? I think that this is a truly interesting piece of work, and considering the formidable array of musicians who participated I find it strange that it isn't mentioned more often. The three extra tracks are perhaps not up to the standard of the rest of the album, but it would be fun to know the background to that session.

OK, here's another one: No previously unreleased Stan Getz material may be released at the moment. Som legal conflict stopped the new reissue of 'Sweet Rain' a few months ago. There is apparently an unreleased extra session featuring Roy Haynes and Steve Swallow along with Getz and Corea, one excellent track of which has been released in a Corea retrospective box.

Just got my Monk set today. Everything's fine except that there are two copies of vol. 2 and none of vol. 3...

I usually turn off my gear at night, allthough I tend to forget it at least once a week. My amp is a 1973 Harman/Kardon (solid state), and it's old enough to make me think it should be allowed to cool down once in a while. Besides, I'm always hesitant to leave - especially old - equipment running unattended. My turntable has been switched on (but not turning, though) for the last ten years, since the main power switch is broken.

I'm still a bit curious as to why you're here at all, Jimmy. The percentage of your posts which just deals with the alleged hypocrisy of Christiern is certainly not decreasing.

I think the LPs sound very fine, and be sure; there is perfectly audible hiss on the quieter spots! Should there be any drawback, it's perhaps that the stereo separation on some tracks is a bit too heavy.

Yes, the J.J. box set is fantastic! I think it's one of the most enjoyable and consistent box sets I have. Inspired arrangements for the two or three horn front lines throughout, and a big slice of the underrated Bobby Jaspar.

SSSHhhhhhhh.....! I was trying to play Bertrand's role this time!

I'll save the final posts for a day or two in case someone should still be unaware of the right answer.

This is a real gem! Topic: Major scoop concerning Moncur's Evolution bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 23, 2001 05:06 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I've known this for a while, but kept forgetting to post it here, for reasons obscure even to me. Anyway, I thought I would start with a teaser to get the ball rolling. I will post the answer "at my convenience", just to get to see what guesses you guys come up with. So here's the scoop. The information for this is first hand, namely Grachan Moncur III told it to Jeff McMillan (the author of the Master's thesis on Lee Morgan mentioned elsewhere). I then confirmed it with the other party involved. In late 1963, when Evolution was recorded, Lee Morgan was just exiting a period of inactivity due to "personal problems". He was booked to do Evolution, but could not be found for the rehearsals, so *ANOTHER* trumpet player was brought in by Jackie to the rehearsals just in case Lee didn't make the date. Of course, at the last minute, Lee sauntered in, and laid down the incredible playing that we know. Lee even later told his brother Jimmy that it was his favorite playing on record. So, the question is: WHICH TRUMPETER ALMOST SUBBED FOR LEE MORGAN ON EVOLUTION? The winner gets a copy of The Complete Blue Note recording sessions 1939-2001 (including rejected and unissued takes) on SACD. Stefan Wood is disqualified because I already told him the answer privately. HINT: The answer is not at all obvious! Put on your thinking caps. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged Chuck Nessa Member Member # 422 posted July 23, 2001 06:07 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Must be CT. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 2284 | From: Whitehall, MI | Registered: Oct 1999 | IP: Logged impossible Member Member # 515 posted July 23, 2001 06:45 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles Tolliver, Chuck? Possibly Alan Shorter? Hm... Eddie Gale? Don Cherry? Am I going to far? How many guesses do I get? I don't believe you Bertrand. You aren't giving away anything! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1902 | From: Riverside, RI | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged lukrion Member Member # 1156 posted July 23, 2001 06:48 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Someone that would be totally un-obvious. I would guess either Donald Byrd or Kenny Dorham, because they are not typical for Grachans camp. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1944 | From: Pa, USA | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged BFrank Member Member # 1089 posted July 23, 2001 08:16 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- OK, since no one else will take the plunge - I'll say Miles. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 3130 | From: SF | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged jhr Member Member # 659 posted July 23, 2001 08:31 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Clark Terry? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 217 | From: Roseville, MN, USA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged James Dye Member Member # 840 posted July 23, 2001 09:41 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Nat Adderley -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 462 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged JSngry Member Member # 1611 posted July 23, 2001 10:26 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 63? Jackie connection? Blue Note? A Moncur date? (Newark?) The obvious unobvious answer would be Kinney Dorham. 63 perhaps being a little (barely) too early for a Tolliver tip, one might feel that Tommy Turentine might be a reasonable choice. One could select Bill Hardman (no realation to Glen), but that would ignore the extra - musical factors that would preclude recommendation as a sub on a recording date that was probably taken quite seriously by Jackie. So... 1963, forward looking date, need a fiery trumpeter who was at least on the outskirts of Jakie's scene & had shown himself to be able to produce on a recoding date AS WELL AS somebody who would be cool "socially"... There's only one player I can think of,,, Woody Shaw. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 10291 | From: tx, usa | Registered: Mar 2001 | IP: Logged bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 23, 2001 10:58 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is fun. Some good guesses there, but no cigar yet. Please note that I said that I got confirmation form the trumpeter him (or her) self, and this is after Jeff's thesis was published last year, so it has to be someone who is still alive. I liked the Woody Shaw guess, but no. The answer is less obvious than any of these guesses, I'm afraid. But it's someone who is somewhat known, although maybe not by everyone on this board. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged Jimmy Mahler Member Member # 1914 posted July 24, 2001 12:38 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Herb Alpert? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 312 | From: Chicago, Illinois | Registered: Jul 2001 | IP: Logged dean.r Member Member # 700 posted July 24, 2001 02:42 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I just love guessing games - I seem to remember Tommy Turrentine playing in some unlikely settings - so could it be? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 60 | From: London, England | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged Bill Fenohr Member Member # 592 posted July 24, 2001 03:35 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Him-Dizzy Reece Her-Barbara Donald -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1484 | From: Lansing,Mi,Ingham | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged Gene Harris Fanatic Member Member # 1529 posted July 24, 2001 04:40 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- someone no one's thought of: Hub (except that I now see that Bertrand calls him "somewhat known" and that ain't Hub!) Carmell Jones? Blue Mitchell? Sweets? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 2478 | From: South Florida, USA | Registered: Mar 2001 | IP: Logged jmjk Member Member # 1325 posted July 24, 2001 05:20 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dave Burns? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1781 | From: Boston and Groton, MA | Registered: Dec 2000 | IP: Logged kartoffel·hadi blues Member Member # 1008 posted July 24, 2001 05:43 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ira Sullivan? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1125 | From: bothell, wa | Registered: Jul 2000 | IP: Logged philip Member Member # 405 posted July 24, 2001 05:47 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Idrees Sulieman? The suspense is killing! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1657 | From: Derbyshire, UK | Registered: Sep 1999 | IP: Logged ralphie_boy Member Member # 1410 posted July 24, 2001 05:54 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Freddie Hubbard? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 731 | From: New York | Registered: Jan 2001 | IP: Logged Lon Armstrong Member Member # 137 posted July 24, 2001 05:59 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maybe Bill Hardman. Would have been an interesting session if he had been allowed to play. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 10027 | From: Austin, TX USA | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged Swinging Swede Member Member # 197 posted July 24, 2001 06:06 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wynton! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1484 | From: Sweden | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged lukrion Member Member # 1156 posted July 24, 2001 06:19 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Can you give us a hint? Pretty please! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1944 | From: Pa, USA | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged sidewinder Member Member # 1104 posted July 24, 2001 06:21 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dewey Johnson? Martin Banks? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1033 | From: SW England | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged Catman Member # 0 posted July 24, 2001 06:53 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Doc Severinson? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: | From: | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged Swinging Swede Member Member # 197 posted July 24, 2001 07:02 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Curson? Lonnie Hillyer? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1484 | From: Sweden | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged sidewinder Member Member # 1104 posted July 24, 2001 07:13 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ornette? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1033 | From: SW England | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 24, 2001 07:15 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I already gave the biggest hint I could possibly give without giving the answer: he/she is still living. I think someone will guess, so I'll still wait a bit. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged impossible Member Member # 515 posted July 24, 2001 07:56 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tell us! Has he/she ever been recorded at Blue Note? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1902 | From: Riverside, RI | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged luke68 Member Member # 542 posted July 24, 2001 08:17 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- How many guesses are allowed? Eddie Henderson? Louis Smith? Jack Sheldon? Conte Candoli? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 280 | From: NJ - the Garden State | Registered: Dec 1999 | IP: Logged Al in NYC Member Member # 8 posted July 24, 2001 08:27 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Dixon?? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 29 | From: New York, NY, USA | Registered: Jun 99 | IP: Logged sidewinder Member Member # 1104 posted July 24, 2001 08:42 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bobby Bradford? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1033 | From: SW England | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged impossible Member Member # 515 posted July 24, 2001 08:57 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Oh man. I can see Bertrand now... leaning back in his chair laughing, "I've stumped them all!" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1902 | From: Riverside, RI | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged jhalbro Member Member # 674 posted July 24, 2001 09:01 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Really out on a limb here: Benny Carter! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 134 | From: New Orleans, LA, USA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged E. Dankworth Junior Member Member # 1946 posted July 24, 2001 09:15 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maynard Ferguson Benny Bailey -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 4 | From: | Registered: Jul 2001 | IP: Logged nick c Member Member # 1111 posted July 24, 2001 09:16 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chuck Mangione -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 116 | From: eugene, oregon | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged luke68 Member Member # 542 posted July 24, 2001 09:20 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Donald Ayler? Olu Dara? Kenny Wheeler? I give up... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 280 | From: NJ - the Garden State | Registered: Dec 1999 | IP: Logged jhalbro Member Member # 674 posted July 24, 2001 09:27 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bobby Shew? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 134 | From: New Orleans, LA, USA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged sidewinder Member Member # 1104 posted July 24, 2001 09:31 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Last and final offering ! Marcus Belgrave -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1033 | From: SW England | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged jmjk Member Member # 1325 posted July 24, 2001 09:33 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by bertrand: No, he/she never recorded for Blue Note. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Never as a leader...or sideman(woman)? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1781 | From: Boston and Groton, MA | Registered: Dec 2000 | IP: Logged BFrank Member Member # 1089 posted July 24, 2001 09:51 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Mantler? Cecil Bridgewater? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 3130 | From: SF | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged Dennis Member Member # 1379 posted July 24, 2001 09:54 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wynton in diapers? Al Hirt? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 189 | From: Sussex, New Jersey USA | Registered: Jan 2001 | IP: Logged sidewinder Member Member # 1104 posted July 24, 2001 09:56 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Virgil Jones? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1033 | From: SW England | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged JSngry Member Member # 1611 posted July 24, 2001 10:14 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Eddie Armour -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 10291 | From: tx, usa | Registered: Mar 2001 | IP: Logged James Dye Member Member # 840 posted July 24, 2001 10:40 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Roy Eldridge -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 462 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged Bill Fenohr Member Member # 592 posted July 24, 2001 12:05 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Concerning he/she, i have been racking my brain all day and just can't think of a living trumpet player who is also a cross dresser. Sorry i just could not resist. For serious how about Marvin Peterson. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1484 | From: Lansing,Mi,Ingham | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged A Bleaden Member Member # 1341 posted July 24, 2001 01:45 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- rene mclean? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 157 | From: Glossop UK | Registered: Dec 2000 | IP: Logged jhalbro Member Member # 674 posted July 24, 2001 01:59 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Rocky the Flying Squirrel? (best known for his flying, but a much under-rated trumpeter) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 134 | From: New Orleans, LA, USA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged luke68 Member Member # 542 posted July 24, 2001 02:53 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- One more try... Wilbur Harden? Not so healthy around the time Evolution was recorded, but nonetheless still alive... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 280 | From: NJ - the Garden State | Registered: Dec 1999 | IP: Logged bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 24, 2001 03:14 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I repeat: the trumpeter in question is still around. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged BFrank Member Member # 1089 posted July 24, 2001 03:45 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- OK Lew Soloff? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 3130 | From: SF | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged kartoffel·hadi blues Member Member # 1008 posted July 24, 2001 04:42 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- For a brief moment I considered cheating by emailing Jeff. I suspect the guy’s inbox already contain a few messages, all asking the same question. Bertrand, you tease. I can’t think of a better way to generate interest in McMillan’s thesis. It’s now at the top of my “must read” list. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1125 | From: bothell, wa | Registered: Jul 2000 | IP: Logged bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 24, 2001 05:07 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wow! Fifty messages, and no one's guessed yet. Take your pick: I can wait a bit longer and post the answer before I go to bed (3-4 hours from now), or I could give one more clue. There is a clue that so far, only JSangry seems to have picked up on - he started taking it in the right direction, but then came to a wrong (although plausible) conclusion. Let me know what you guys prefer - I'll check in in a little bit. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged bertrand Member Member # 230 posted July 24, 2001 05:16 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I double-checked the new edition of the Cuscuna/Ruppli discography to make sure that I did not lead anyone in error. I stand by my original statement: the trumpeter in question never recorded *for Blue Note* as a leader or sideperson. Bertrand. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 1798 | From: Bethesda, MD | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged BFrank Member Member # 1089 posted July 24, 2001 05:35 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are we talking about XXXXXXX XXXXXXX? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 3130 | From: SF | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged Tony Jerant Member Member # 212 posted July 24, 2001 05:50 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A totally wild guess, since I'm stumped...Randy Brecker (would have been 18)! As far as I know he recorded as a leader for Solid State (very obscure album), but not for BN, and I can't think offhand of any BN sideman dates from the "original" BN era. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 3000 | From: Sacramento, CA | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged BeBop Member Member # 24 posted July 24, 2001 06:17 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dupree Bolton? (though I thought I'd heard he'd passed recently) Leo Smith (too logical) Ted Curson (likewise) Ruby Braff (would have been perfect!) Snooky Young

I'm not entirely sure, but weren't the original session tapes lost in the Atlantic fire, and the source for the Coltrane box in fact safety copies of those tapes? That would perhaps account for an extra dose of hiss.

Congrats, Marcus! In case you're out of ideas for your next project, let me know...

I wonder if the Spanish Blue Notes are really TOCJ remasters. I didn't think 'Boss Horn', for example, had been released on CD aside from the Blue Mitchell Mosaic set.

Received Evans and Tatum today. I've still only looked at the Evans Riverside box, but the discographical info is nonexistent. Quite easy to find on the web, though. Mysteriously, still no money has been drawn from my VISA card...

Hi Gregore, and welcome to the Organissimo forums!

On a sidenote, I thought keyword spamming was against eBay regulations. And neither this post does the board members any favors... except Johnny, who gets more attention...

Actually I phoned them this morning (I was a little worried, because I still hadn't got any confirmation almost one week after my online order - neither has any money been drawn from my VISA card, and several of the box sets are now sold out). They assured me that "they will come, they will come!" on my question about the status of my order, but still as of this evening: no confirmation email. What to make of that?

Khan Jamal.

Even though the message has changed, I'm still greeted with a Hello, Duke Pearson [ log out ] in the upper left corner of the page, which suggests that the board software is still running somewhere behind. Wonder what happens if I log out...