Harold_Z

Good News

To me it sounds like the Verves were recorded "live" in the studio. i.e Tate singing with the band playing as opposed to singing over tracks. The Atlantic (5 years later) defininitely sounds like singing over tracks and I'm not sure about the "comeback" recording, although I suspect he sang over pre recorded tracks.

That's the way I hear it too. The "comeback" recording is very good and they are consciously trying for the sound of the Verve recordings. Some of the horn lines are verbatim from the Verve stuff, but the Verve stuff has that extra something.

Chris, I have all of those also. I've had them since they came out. I was in high school when Riverside released those and I used to cut school and take the bus (the same one I take now !) into town and a store on 5th Ave called "The Record Hunter" had all of them. I picked them up over a few visits. I think that "The Living Legends" series is not only totaly enjoyable, but it's great music and really essential listening for jazz lovers. It's the one of the first examples I know of where you can hear those guys and that type of music in good sound. You can't go wrong getting "the Living Legends".

You need somebody to be with the car at all times and ready to move it. You most likely will have to double park or pull into an illegal space (i.e fire hydrant, etc). So be ready to get the Hammond out in a rush while somebody is available to move the car if necessary. Unloading is a drag in the City. Give yourself a lot of time upfront. Finding a space on the street in the village isn't impossible, but it's time consuming and requires going around the block - or a couple of blocks - repeatedly. It's a lot easier (but more expensive) to unload and find a lot. I'm going to to try and make the set if posible.

Thanks Chris. Glad to be back. ....And thanks for the good news on Fats. I hope his family comes through this ok too. My mind is boggled by the magnitude of this disaster.

Fats among the missing ! This really sucks !

I was on the gig at the Mozambique in Detroit. Mac's next gig was (quartet- I wasn't on it) was in Atlanta at a room I can't remember the name of, but probably someone here will know it. It was in a motel and was pretty well known to the guys on the circuit. It was still going in the 80s and I remember they had a tradition of Sunday afternoon jam sessions. Financially I don't think there was a hell of a lot going on for Mac then. The rooms on the circuit paid zilch. Sideman pay from Mac was $50 a night (!) and not including rooms and food. I took the gig strictly because it was McDuff. A couple of buddies of mine had been on the gig previously - Drummer Ronnie Davis and guitarist Vinnie Corrao. Ronnie and Vinnie both were on a nice live McDuff lp on Cadet. I think it was called "Check It Out". I think Leo Johnson was on that too. Anyway, Ronnie had a more negative view of it than Vinnie and kind of advised against even taking the gig, but both guys chalked the gig up to what you put up with to work with a guy like McDuff. IOW, everybody loved the music, but the conditions were basically a drag. ...now that's jazz.......

It had to be 1976 or maybe 1977. It's around 30 years ago and I was only there briefly. McDuff was a nice guy, definitely NOT in the prick band leader category, somewhat of a raconteur, and seemed mainly interested in having a good time. Partying after the gig, etc. After all, he was on the road - away from home ! (at that time he was living at Lenox terrace at 135th and Lenox Ave). As far as standards, he definitely played them, but those are among the tunes I didn't play on. They were of the the How High The Moon, All The Things You are Ilk, but probably different titles and heads. From my point of view I wanted to play the jazz things, but I was just hired for the LP tunes - of which I remember nothing. (Not to put them down -They were groovy bluesy funk tunes). McDuff didn't want me to bring an amp - he had me going through the pa system and he set the sound and levels. That was kind of a drag, but overall I thought he was a pretty decent guy.

Re Track eight...I've been giving this a return listening now and then. It's a GOOD track. I'm wondering now if it's McKinney's Cotton Pickers with Fats Waller on piano. (I should have said in my earlier post where I speculated Fletcher Henderson, that I didn't think Fletcher was the pianist - so if its Fletcher's band I'll still go with Fats on piano.

I worked briefly with McDuff in the mid 70s. I saw his charts first hand. They were always in pencil and written very professionaly. Neatly and coherent. At the time I was impressed. I thought it was great small group writing. ← Can you elaborate on working with McDuff, his charts and how he did things? His band and arrangements ALWAYS amaze me. ← As I recall, the charts were for Rhythm plus Trumpet and two tenors, although the gig I was on was just the standard quarted with electric bass added. Mac may have had other parts for other situations. He LIKED to write. He had a melodica and would write after the gig some times. The parts I read had a specific bass part, but there were also chord changes and anybody in the rhythm section would have been cool with the same part I read off. None of the parts were xeroxed. Mac hand wrote them all. I was only there a short time. Mac really didn't need or want a bass player. He had just done an (funk) album for Sylvia Robinson's All Platinum label (Frank Prescod played bass on that lp along with Yogi Horton on drums and Billy Jones on guitar - the All Platinum rhythm section) and she wanted him on the road with a bassist to promote that album. I only played on funk tunes, so the standard Organ, Drums, Tenor, and Guitar quartet played all the straight ahead stuff. I sat right next to McDuff when I didn't play and watched him up close. It was a gas for that alone. Now THERE'S an album that must have sunk like a stone. I've never heard or seen any mention of that lp. All platinum was a big on ripping off the artist label and I don't think McDuff stuck around with them too long. He dug the score and split.

I worked briefly with McDuff in the mid 70s. I saw his charts first hand. They were always in pencil and written very professionaly. Neatly and coherent. At the time I was impressed. I thought it was great small group writing.

8 seems to be the magic number - where fascination ends and tedium begins. I dug the soundtrack too.

The Verves and the Blue Notes had different "aims", with the Verves definitely being more commercial and reaching more for a mass audience. It was a function of the era. I like (love) both bodies of work - I just perceive their intent differently. Soundwise I know what Soul Stream is saying about presence. JS is definitely more up front and in your face on the Blue Notes, but I'm not sure if that's because the Blue Notes are usually smaller group things or if its a result of multi track recording. I tend to think it's a result of more tracks. In any event I'm glad for both. Although there is a "sameness" to a lot of Jimmy's recordings there is a corresponding sameness to my reaction. I ALWAYS dig it ! And to that end Jimmy is on my list of "Get it all" people. So is McDuff.

Harold, They play normally in anything but a computer. What's bad or regretful is that this has detracted from a discussion of some otherwise fine cds. I've listened to the Gordon, Jamal, Blakey and am listening to the Brookmeyer and they're all outstanding. I find the polyrythms in the Blakey cd (the first 3 cuts, the rest is conventional hard bop) fascinating. My family wasn't crazy about that but I loved it. The music is just great and so are the notes. Columbia has done a first class job with these reissues. In each case, the liner notes are written by somebody special. For example, Randy Weston wrote the notes for the Jamal cd. ← Thanks Brad. I agree...the music is the important thing here and the copyguard seems easily avoidable. I also agree with those who don't want to alter their pc to play anything, but I don't see a hassle in burning a copy for car and pc on my standalone, thereby avoiding all the unpleasantness. In it's present state this version of copy protection seems destined to fail.

Alright...I'm not sure I have this right. The ONLY problem is on computers? They play normally in a component system or car player ? In a two-tray stand alone cdr recorder ? If so....WTF is Sony thinking?

No...he wrote "Louis Louis".

Yeah...that's a great rap! "Jazz is where it's at. Everything else is bullshit ! "

I assumed they were the Challenge and Retrieval were the same - why would JRT do two restorations on the same material ?

Same here. As Lon said on the King Oliver thread - the sound is very important when presenting vintage music to people who are not familiar with the sound of old records. People have trouble getting past that.

The Challenge set is remastered by JRT Davies also. That's the one I'd go for.

Brad - does it play on a regular cd player ?

Same here. Everything except for what's previously unreleased. I wish the new material was available seperately (as if the record companies EVER do that nowadays !).

Chris, That's one of my favorite stories in the book. It makes me laugh everytime I read it...really, I can just picture that whole scene.

I'm referring to "In Person" Atlantic 1039. This contains the classic live Drown In My Own tears cut. "At Newport" Atlantic 1289 with the equally classic A Fool For You.