ghost of miles Posted November 1, 2003 Report Posted November 1, 2003 Contemplating this ever since the recent suicide of singer-songwriter Elliott Smith, which sparked quite a wave of grieving on the Internet. Although known mostly to the mainstream listening public for his Oscar-nominated "Miss Misery" (from the GOOD WILL HUNTING soundtrack--he lost out to Celine Dion for the TITANIC theme), he had an intensely devoted following in the indie-rock world. His fans tended to regard him in religious-like terms; he was called things like "the pop messiah" and "the Buddha of the brokenhearted," and his death therefore provoked a similarly passionate response. Smith was 34, the same age as Charlie Parker when Bird died in 1955. I know some board members were alive & cognizant of the jazz world at that time; how quickly did word travel in that Internet-less, much-less-media-connected world? Did those who knew him only through records and performances feel like weeping, grieving, etc.? I just compare Parker to Smith because they both were all but worshipped in their respective musical worlds (both also had enormous problems with heroin and alcohol). Parker was obviously much more of a revolutionary, who changed the course of jazz far more than Smith did the course of indie rock; nonetheless both had a messianic appeal to their followers. I've read several Bird books, with the stories (apocryphal?) of "Bird Lives" appearing shortly after his death on walls around NYC. (And let's not forget the story that there was a tremendous clap of thunder at the time of his death.) Somewhere I read a story about Jackie McLean seeing news of Bird's death in a newspaper headline, and feeling even more devastated because he had been rude to Bird the last time that he saw him (I think Bird had borrowed Jackie's horn and then hocked it). Some artists become legends when they die. Seems to me Bird was already a legend when he died, and that the true history of it is hard to determine through all of the mist of mythology. Grist, I suppose, for whomever the gritty, levelheaded writer is who sits down to write a no-nonsense Bird bio. Quote
brownie Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 I was in highschool in Paris at the time and a jazz fan for a couple of years. I was not the avid newspaper reader I am now and missed the news on the day it was published. It was not a frontpage item. But the two main French jazz reviews Jazz Hot and Jazz Magazine both had photos of Bird on their cover in their April 1955 issues. Jazz Magazine in its May 1955 issue had a two-page report on Parker's funeral by Billie Wallington (think she was George Wallington's wife). The report was illustrated with three photos from the funeral. The famous one of the coffin carried out of church with Leonard Feather, Teddy Reig among the carriers and Louis Bellson, Charlie Shavers and Charles Mingus attending. Another photo taken during the funeral ceremony showed Addison and Art Farmer, Elmo Hope, Doris Parker, Herbie Mann, Don Schlittein and Gigi Gryce inside the church and a third one showed Chan Parker and her brother with Tony Scott and his then wife Fran. Ken Vail's 'Bird's Diary's invaluable book reproduces some 'Bird is Dead' newspaper headlines of the time plus a couple of articles that appeared in Down Beat at the time along with the Parker coffin carried out of church photo. Since this is a thread about the death of Charlie Parker, I was intrigued when I found this link some time ago [url:www.holeintheweb.com/drp/bhd/CharlieParker.htm]Death of Bird Had never heard of the Art Blakey aspect of the story. Is this fact or fiction? Quote
brownie Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 Tried several times to make the URL to the Bird's Death link work on my last post It does not seem to be working this morning. Quote
JSngry Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 Since this is a thread about the death of Charlie Parker, I was intrigued when I found this link some time ago [url:www.holeintheweb.com/drp/bhd/CharlieParker.htm]Death of Bird Had never heard of the Art Blakey aspect of the story. Is this fact or fiction? Try this link: http://www.holeintheweb.com/drp/bhd/CharlieParker.htm That Blakey reference is, uh... It certainly COULD be true. I think... Quote
Shrdlu Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 I'm not buying the accusation against Blakey! And now we read that Bird was invited to spend a few days in Nica's apartment. I was enlightened to read the following "word of knowledge" though "you can fit 16 16th notes into a single bar of music, or 32 32nd notes." Quote
Brad Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 I'm not buying that stuff about Art at all. From all that I've read -- we all know what happened -- he died in her apartment from more or less natural causes, if you consider the way he died "natural." To raise that without substantiation is pretty libelous. Quote
JSngry Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 Oh, I'm not buying it either. I'm just saying that based on some of the stories I've heard about Blakey. it COULD be true. Quote
AfricaBrass Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 That's an interesting story. I know Blakey was guilty of dropping a lot of bombs, but.... Quote
JSngry Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 Established Mythology: Ra killed Trane New mythology: Blakey killed Bird. These ARE interesting times! Quote
A Lark Ascending Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 (edited) But did Blakey kill Diana? We NEED to know! (No, not her...the other one!) Edited November 2, 2003 by Bev Stapleton Quote
ghost of miles Posted November 2, 2003 Author Report Posted November 2, 2003 Who the hell is Dr. Progresso? Quote
John L Posted November 2, 2003 Report Posted November 2, 2003 (edited) Who the hell is Dr. Progresso?  Well, from his knowledge that there were three autopsies after Bird's death, I assume that Dr. Progresso must have performed the third, where chips from Blakey's drumstick were found in Parker's brain. More seriously, that text is weird. Other than the Blakey remarks, everything resembles the usual truncated Bird bio. Furthermore, the Blakey remarks are stated in passing as if they are obvious fact and not subject to any speculation at all. I wonder if Blakey's family knows about this? If I were Blakey's kin, I would try to get it removed. Edited November 3, 2003 by John L Quote
ghost of miles Posted November 2, 2003 Author Report Posted November 2, 2003 I knew I hadn't heard it all when it came to Bird's death... I eagerly await Jerry Falwell's next videotape, in which he will substantiate his claim that an eight-year-old Bill Clinton coolly murdered Bird for his mojo. Quote
bertrand Posted November 3, 2003 Report Posted November 3, 2003 How come none of this is mentioned in Leslie Gourse's 'definitive' Blakey bio. I want a refund!!! Bertrand. Quote
Joe Posted November 3, 2003 Report Posted November 3, 2003 I guess that was Miles on the grassy knoll... Quote
bertrand Posted November 4, 2003 Report Posted November 4, 2003 I've had some time to think, and I decided I'm really uncomfortable with the existence of this site. I think something needs to be done to set this Dr. Progresso guy straight... Bertrand. Quote
medjuck Posted November 4, 2003 Report Posted November 4, 2003 I always thought Bird died while watching Jimmy Dorsey on tv. And before we blame Jimmy's playing, it should be added that Bird was apparently an admirerer. And in fact although it was the Dorsey Bros. tv show (under the auspices of Jackie Gleason) I think I've read there was a juggler on tv at the time of Bird's death. Quote
Man with the Golden Arm Posted November 4, 2003 Report Posted November 4, 2003 I think Hollywood oughta get Eastwood and Stone together to sort this whole thing out. Quote
Dave James Posted November 4, 2003 Report Posted November 4, 2003 Bird should have been an admirer of Jimmy Dorsey. That guy could really play. In some of the film clips I've seen, he was all over his horn. Crisp, tight and very, very fast. Not sure what to make of this Progresso stuff. I love the way he just matter of factly assigns Blakey the blame like anyone who knows anything ought to already know that. If the ending of Eastwood's movie is to be believed, Bird simply wore out and expired. If you were to play the devil's advocate, though, you might argue that the Baroness just took the path of least resistance. After all, wouldn't it have been a lot easier to explain things this way than to bring Blakey into the mix? Involving him would just complicate things and it for sure wouldn't bring Bird back. I'm guessing the authorities wouldn't give two hoots one way or another. Just another junkie biting the dust. Clear the case quickly and move on. Up over and out. Quote
chris olivarez Posted November 6, 2003 Report Posted November 6, 2003 Maybe the reason this guy writes under an alias is that he knows none of this true. It just doesn't make sense. First of all if the NYPD had probable cause to arrest Blakey I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't have done it and even if jazz publications swept such a story under the rug it would have been known in the jazz community and who the hell would have wanted to work with Blakey after that? Everything I've read indicated that Charlie Parker never met a substance he didn't like. Bird lived fast,loved hard and died young and it seems to me that his choice of lifestyle contributed to his early and untimely demise. I just have one other question from a legal standpoint can you slander a dead man because it seems to me that the Blakey estate would have a hell of a case against Progesso whoever the sob is. Quote
JSngry Posted November 6, 2003 Report Posted November 6, 2003 (edited) Well, in fairness to Dr. Soup, all he says is that Blakey showed up and a fight ensued. He doesn't say that Blakey actually MURDERED Bird. So maybe, like, they had words, maybe a punch or two got thrown, Blakey left, and then Bird's body just stopped working. It was bound to happen sooner or later. I'm still not buying it, but if any of you think that Blakey was a saint or some such, and would never hurt a fly or a Bird, you've heard substantially different stories over the years than I have. 'Nuff said. What I find more intriguing is the notion that Sun Ra killed Trane by putting a curse on him for stealing a lot of Ra's concepts without really "understanding" them. This is a story related to me by somebody who spent a good deal of time hanging out with Clifford Thornton (yeah, I know...) in the early 70s. Supposedly the heat on Ra after Trane passed was a major factor in his relocation from NYC to Philly. This is a story that some musicians of the time and place will admit to having heard, although they will neither confirm nor deny their belief in it. Do I believe that Ra was actually responsible for Trane's death? No, not even a little. Do I believe that Ra was talking a lot of shit about Trane, and maybe even DID put a "curse" on him? That seems quite plausible, as does the possibility that Ra got some heat after Trane's death from some quarters. Edited November 6, 2003 by JSngry Quote
blue lake Posted November 6, 2003 Report Posted November 6, 2003 There was a cause of death given in newspaper notices of Bird's demise, and none that I've seen listed blunt force trauma as a cause of death, usually cirrhosis of the liver and heart failure. If there was an autopsy there wasn’t found any violent cause of death that’s been published. To say there was and that it was specifically Blakey is like listening to Rush Limbaugh talk about Bill Clinton. That mo-fo is HIGH. B) Quote
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