DMP Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Focusing on "Concert By the Sea." Probably nothing in there that everyone here doesn't already know, but nice, just the same. (The Journal seems to have increased its jazz coverage - yesterday there was an article about the New Languages Festival in Brooklyn; the words "Blue Note" appear!) Sorry I can't post any links, that's beyond my limited computer abilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Haven't seen the WSJ piece, but here's part of an e-mail I sent to a friend ten days ago: 'Last week I picked up a decent LP copy for 50 cents of Garner's famous best-selling "Concert of the Sea" album. I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Other instances, e.g. the Paul Gonsalves "Diminuendo and Crescendo in Blue" solo on "Ellington at Newport," Brubeck, etc., are not really great (Brubeck) and/or were tremendously popular for reasons that were not that closely linked to the core of what that artist was up to." I would add Gene Ammons to Garner, now that I think about it, though I don't believe that Ammons' popularity, while broad and deep, was as broad (in sales and socially) as Garner's was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Here's a link to Will Friedwald's Garner piece: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405...4002886930.html He's right that "Concert By the Sea" was a big hit, but Garner had hits before and after that; "Concert By the Sea" was no one-off but a highwater mark for a long-running phenomenon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Oliver Jackson used to complain about working with Garner, that on-stage his manager put a spotlight on Garner and kept the rest of the trio in the dark - "I couldn't even see to get up and go pee." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMP Posted September 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Garner may have been one of the most popular jazz artists (who had many fans beyond the jazz audience), but I think he may wind up as just a footnote, forgotten by all but a small group, given that his most popular work continues to be tied up in some legal limbo. When was the last time there was a "legitimate" Garner release? The Telarc CD's were 10 years ago, and they've probably been discontinued. And we all know about that planned Mosaic set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill B Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Garner may have been one of the most popular jazz artists (who had many fans beyond the jazz audience), but I think he may wind up as just a footnote, forgotten by all but a small group, given that his most popular work continues to be tied up in some legal limbo. When was the last time there was a "legitimate" Garner release? The Telarc CD's were 10 years ago, and they've probably been discontinued. And we all know about that planned Mosaic set. Unfortunately,you are probably correct about the footnote. The 'legal limbo" you speak of has been created by Martha Glaser his manager who is suffering from dimentia. There is no Garner estate since he has no living relatives. Numerous attempts have been made to issue the remaining vault items but these attempts have been stonewalled .If it weren't for the Chronological classics we wouldn't have his recordings, from 1952-53. There are other previous posts which refer to these events . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medjuck Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 (edited) Will Thornbury, who taped the concert, was a great DJ-- very knowledgeable. He was still on KJAZZ (or whatever it was called then) when I moved to LA in 1980. Edited September 18, 2009 by medjuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA Russell Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Stan Getz (and Charlie Byrd) became household names with Jazz Samba, which was a few years later. I think that would trump Concert by the Sea, don't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted O'Reilly Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Stan Getz (and Charlie Byrd) became household names with Jazz Samba, which was a few years later. I think that would trump Concert by the Sea, don't you? Maybe, but I think the success of bossa nova also became a cage for them. Is that what Larry calls "exactly what (they) would have done anyway"? I know Charlie Byrd used to refer to "Girl From Ipanema" as "Girl From Iwo Jima"... And the only legit CD version of Concert By The Sea actuallly sounds worse than my LP version. How would it have sold in improved sound, and extra tracks added for new audiences? Maybe not Kind Of Blue numbers, but very well. (BTW, the next gig the trio did after Monterey was at the Colonial Tavern here in Toronto). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesAHarrod Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I agree that it is nice to see more jazz coverage in the WSJ. I am puzzled at the information conveyed by Friedwald regarding the concert. I no longer have my copy of Columbia CL 883 but recall that the liner notes clearly indicated that the concert was taped at the Sunset Auditorium in Carmel where Jimmy Lyons hosted a series of concerts featuring artists who were also performing at the Monterey Jazz Festival. Do they employ fact checkers at the WSJ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 (edited) The 'legal limbo" you speak of has been created by Martha Glaser his manager who is suffering from dimentia. The disease is dementia. I keep hoping that one day the "legal limbo" will be solved and Mosaic will after all be able to release a Garner set. Edited September 18, 2009 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Stan Getz (and Charlie Byrd) became household names with Jazz Samba, which was a few years later. I think that would trump Concert by the Sea, don't you? Yes, but as great as Getz was, "Jazz Samba" is not great Getz IMO (nor I believe in Stan's), while "Concert By the Sea" is great Garner -- not that Garner was ever far below that level. "Jazz Samba" was essentially a "this is new and cool" phenomenon, though Stan's artistry made an undeniable contribution to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill B Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 The 'legal limbo" you speak of has been created by Martha Glaser his manager who is suffering from dimentia. The disease is dementia. I keep hoping that one day the "legal limbo" will be solved and Mosaic will after all be able to release a Garner set. Thanks for pointing out the typo. This so-called "legal limbo" will not be sorted out in Ms.Glaser's lifetime. M. C. has worked long and hard for this one for a long time.If it does come out I may not be the first to purchase,but I won't be far behind . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I agree that it is nice to see more jazz coverage in the WSJ. I am puzzled at the information conveyed by Friedwald regarding the concert. I no longer have my copy of Columbia CL 883 but recall that the liner notes clearly indicated that the concert was taped at the Sunset Auditorium in Carmel where Jimmy Lyons hosted a series of concerts featuring artists who were also performing at the Monterey Jazz Festival. Do they employ fact checkers at the WSJ? What I've read is that the concert was recorded in Carmel by a serviceman from Ft. Ord, Will Thornbury, later the well-known DJ, who wanted to play it for his buddies. If so, Friedwald has confused from Ft. Ord with at Ft. Ord. Again, if so, it wouldn't be a first time for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medjuck Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 The 'legal limbo" you speak of has been created by Martha Glaser his manager who is suffering from dimentia. The disease is dementia. I keep hoping that one day the "legal limbo" will be solved and Mosaic will after all be able to release a Garner set. Thanks for pointing out the typo. This so-called "legal limbo" will not be sorted out in Ms.Glaser's lifetime. M. C. has worked long and hard for this one for a long time.If it does come out I may not be the first to purchase,but I won't be far behind . If he has no heirs what happens when she dies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 depends on her will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesAHarrod Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 What I've read is that the concert was recorded in Carmel by a serviceman from Ft. Ord, Will Thornbury, later the well-known DJ, who wanted to play it for his buddies. If so, Friedwald has confused from Ft. Ord with at Ft. Ord. Again, if so, it wouldn't be a first time for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 'Last week I picked up a decent LP copy for 50 cents of Garner's famous best-selling "Concert of the Sea" album. I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Other instances, e.g. the Paul Gonsalves "Diminuendo and Crescendo in Blue" solo on "Ellington at Newport," Brubeck, etc., are not really great (Brubeck) and/or were tremendously popular for reasons that were not that closely linked to the core of what that artist was up to." All on Columbia. I would add Gene Ammons to Garner, now that I think about it, though I don't believe that Ammons' popularity, while broad and deep, was as broad (in sales and socially) as Garner's was. Not on Columbia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 'Last week I picked up a decent LP copy for 50 cents of Garner's famous best-selling "Concert of the Sea" album. I could be wrong, but Garner may be the latest instance in the history of jazz where a great artist (and I think Garner is great) became immensely popular doing exactly what he would have done anyway. Other instances, e.g. the Paul Gonsalves "Diminuendo and Crescendo in Blue" solo on "Ellington at Newport," Brubeck, etc., are not really great (Brubeck) and/or were tremendously popular for reasons that were not that closely linked to the core of what that artist was up to." All on Columbia. I would add Gene Ammons to Garner, now that I think about it, though I don't believe that Ammons' popularity, while broad and deep, was as broad (in sales and socially) as Garner's was. Not on Columbia. Are you saying that the label and its distribution system was the only reason or the chief reason? I don't think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 19, 2009 Report Share Posted September 19, 2009 Not at all. I am saying that a big label could take what was gonna happen anyway in terms of "mass appeal" and just make it happen that much more. Gene Ammons was never gonna be a major crossover act. "Canadian Sunset" or "Angel Eyes" on Columbia might well have not sold as well as they did on Prestige. But Garner, Brubeck, Ellington/Newport, etc...each in their own way ready for "mass appeal", a ballw hich something Columbia certainly knew how to take and run a very far way with. and also pointing out the irony in a "major label" helping to popularize the very music that they would eventually be accused of helping to kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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