Unk Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 Don't know a thing about jazz? No one needs to know that. Here's how to fake expert status. Amusing, if you don't take it too seriously. (Who, me? ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gould Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 I'l try and read this later once I forget that he says Avoid discussing crossover jazz vocalists like Armstrong and Fitzgerald. Has anyone here ever heard Armstrong or Ella criticized for crossover appeal? Even if it happened back in the day, it never happens now which is the whole point of the article - how to keep up in a jazz conversation today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 they're not criticized - but i would agree with the writer, that you will always recognize someone who praises Mingus as a Jazz fan - with someone who praises Armstrong you don't know - that could be anyone... so if you want to show that you're an insider, it's better to talk about Mingus... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unk Posted April 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 I'l try and read this later once I forget that he says Avoid discussing crossover jazz vocalists like Armstrong and Fitzgerald. Has anyone here ever heard Armstrong or Ella criticized for crossover appeal? Even if it happened back in the day, it never happens now which is the whole point of the article - how to keep up in a jazz conversation today. What would you think if the examples were, say, Diana Krall and Norah Jones? I'd consider both on the "pop" side of the crossover spectrum, though both are assigned (by some people, not me) jazz cred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gould Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 I'd say you definitely want to avoid Norah and Diana to keep jazz cred in a conversation - if you're faking it. Avoiding Ella and Louis because of some perception of cross-over appeal is ludicrous. We're talking about two of the greatest singers of the 20th century and the vast majority of their music was without question jazz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 The best way to keep up is to let the other person think they know more than you do. If they really do, hey, you won't blow it. If they really don't, you can give 'em enough rope to hang themselves if they're assholes, or else enjoy a light conversation with a nice person who doesn't know as much about the subject as you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 Have never thought of this "problem". Still don't. None of my wife's friends have a clue about me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unk Posted April 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 I've often felt like I could use such a primer on movies and television, neither of which I'm conversant about, but frequently encounter in "polite" conversation - a situation I avoid as often as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 Have never thought of this "problem". Still don't. None of my wife's friends have a clue about me. Or maybe they do and don't want to spoil the mojo you exude from thinking they don't! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold_Z Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 Have never thought of this "problem". Still don't. None of my wife's friends have a clue about me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Wheel Posted April 5, 2011 Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 The best way to keep up is to let the other person think they know more than you do. In other words, being honest instead of trying to put on a fake persona. This column doubles as good advice for how to be a douchebag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unk Posted April 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2011 Not just that column - the whole website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 Oh boy! am I a novice... Birdbrain was an unknown expression in my jazz lingo I'll keep it in mind for my next jazz conversations! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA Russell Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 I've never heard the term "modern creative" before. Is that common? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 It's disingenuous to converse about jazz without any actual interest in jazz. Who does that? I'm psyched when I run into another jazz fan, and the conversation is rarely about anything other than which recordings we love, which years we love, lists of names, etc. Who cares if Miles was an asshole or not? His discography is incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 I've never heard the term "modern creative" before. Is that common? The term itself, or music that actually is? Either way, I'd have to say no... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Pomea Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 I've never heard the term "modern creative" before. Is that common? It came right after "late medieval creative," I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.:.impossible Posted April 6, 2011 Report Share Posted April 6, 2011 Just mention Elmo Hope, Warne Marsh, Baby Face Willette and Charlie Persip. Oh, and Cal Massey. Make a joke about Booby Hancock or Herbie Handcock. You'll be fine. No need to actually listen to, and enjoy the stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swinging Swede Posted April 9, 2011 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 I have heard Symphony Sid talk about "modern progressive jazz"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ep1str0phy Posted April 9, 2011 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 I first heard the term "modern creative" in the old allmusic guide (where it is used extensively). Even there, the classification is managed nebulously. It has something to do with post-free jazz, IIRC, although who managed to get categorized under the free jazz banner, fusion, modern creative, etc. was often confusing and kind of random. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fasstrack Posted April 10, 2011 Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 Don't know a thing about jazz? No one needs to know that. Here's how to fake expert status. Amusing, if you don't take it too seriously. (Who, me? ) After reading this I bet he couldn't keep up. Wow, did he embarrass himself. I jumped ship when his 'lesson' referred to Charlie Parker as a 'bebop innovator of the '30s'. 'Nuff said... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjk Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Don't know a thing about jazz? No one needs to know that. Here's how to fake expert status. Amusing, if you don't take it too seriously. (Who, me? ) After reading this I bet he couldn't keep up. Wow, did he embarrass himself. I jumped ship when his 'lesson' referred to Charlie Parker as a 'bebop innovator of the '30s'. 'Nuff said... As well as misspelling Diz's first name. Also, I think he's wrong on the reason for Trane's death, but I have to look this up, as I don't remember exactly. Maybe I shouldn't feel worthy to talk about Trane and I might just sip my dry Martini instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Basten II Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 If you want to look cool, just say you don't care about singers, quite suprising how little how the jazz modern crowd hates singers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.:.impossible Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 I thought it was cool to like some singers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Just dead ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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